xcercise4less and HARLANDS/CRS . DD problem

[dada71]

Hi, I'm looking for some advice from you guys.

 

I've read all posts in forum about similar problems but I didn't find solution.

 

My issue with HARLANDS is slightly different.

it's a long and quite complicated story but I'll try to explain it as clear as possible.

I apologize in advance for any grammar mistakes, english is my second language. 

 

I've signed up for the xcercise4less gym in May 2016, always been paying with direct debit without any issues.

Unfortunately in May 2019 I did not have enough money on my account to pay for gym membership so direct debit bounced back,

 

they charged me for overdue payment.

Ok fair enough, I've paid charges, reinstated my dd and continued my trainings on gym.

Since then  direct debit was bouncing back every month when in fact I had enough money to pay.

 

I've been trying to reinstate direct debit every month on website that they provide me and every time it was saying

" your direct debit details have now been updated, please take note of reference number blah blah..."(I have screenshot of this) but dd was still bouncing back.

They have been kept charging me for overdue payments (I've paid £160.97 for overdue payment fees and they are asking me to pay another £213 but I'll explain it later)

Meanwhile I was still going to the gym and trying to call harlands but they have never answered the phone, never replied to the email.

I've asked gym staff from reception to help me with this issue but she said they have nothing to do with payments.

 

I've asked her to to call harlands and ask what's going on,

she called them and they said that direct debit is bouncing back because my bank is telling them that there is not enough money to cover payments, and she advised me to contact my bank(Tsb) . woman from harlands said that she will put note to not charge me again but they did charge me again next month anyway.

 

I started thinking that really could be bank's fault because at the same time I had some issues with other direct debit (sky)

I've spoken to bank manager he checked bank statements and said that is not bank fault and there is evidence that harlands was even trying to get any money from my account. I felt really helpless, I couldn't resolve that problem.

Harlands was saying that is Banks fault and bank was saying  that is harlands fault.

On the next day I've made official complaint to the bank through their website.

I've got reply by post from them saying that:

"having conducted a through investigation the payments are being returned as the organisation is quoting an incorrect transaction code, therefore harlands is claiming my direct debit incorrectly.

 

The payments are being claimed on a repeat of previously failed payment.

For future claims, the organisation will need to ensure they are claiming against an active direct debit instruction and also need to ensure they are using the correct transaction code for the claim that they are attempting"

in same letter my bank confirmed that they had some issues with sky direct debit and they have sent me £80 compensation for that issue.

Meanwhile harlands sent me SMS with information that I owe them £98.98 again for overdue payment, I did not pay that.

Couple of days later I've wrote and sent two letters to harlands one with complaint in which , I've explained everything saying that i want all my money I've paid to them back

 

. In second letter I wrote that I'm forced to cancel my membership due to being charged constantly for something which is not my fault.

both letters were tracked with delivery confirmation and I have copy of them.

 

They responded saying that they can not match my details and asking for more details about my membership.

I've sent them all the information requested and since then did not get any response from them.

As I said I did not pay that last charge £98.98,

after couple of weeks people from CRS started calling me  5-6 times every day from many different numbers.

 

I've recalled them once and explained all that situation but guy who I've spoken to said it's not their problem and I still have to pay 213.47.

(btw that escalated really quick from 98.98 to 213.47 lol)

I've also contacted citizens advice in my city, they advised me to call trading standards.

I called them and they advised me to send another letter to harlands and tell them that I've got confirmation from the bank saying that is harlands fault, and if they don't reply in 14 days to contact trading standards again and they will tell me what to do next. 

I'm going to write that letter in this week but I've decided to write that post here on forum before I will do that, maybe you could give me some advice.

 

That situation really stressed me out, I've started taking some anxiety pills.

 

I was paying these charges because i was afraid that could affect my credit score,now i know it would not.

I've stopped going to the gym because of that situation, I was losing money, time, I had to take 2 days off to get to the bank then to get to citizens advice because I'm working long hours during the week.

 

I've lost a lot of my time to resolve problem which is not even my fault. 

I would rather spend that time with my family...

I will appreciate any more ideas from you what I could do to solve that problem.

 

Is there any chance that I could get any compensation from them?
thanks for your help

[dx100uk]

simply way is to :

 

workout how many months to the day you 'cancelled' (or stopped going) that should have paid a fees for and total that figures

then total up how much you have actually paid to the same day.

 

can you do that and give us the two figures?

 

 

[slick132]

Hi Dada and welcome to CAG

 

You're not going to get get compensation for Harlands/CRS, end of !

 

Harlands/CRS  make more money from you charging admin fees than they make from collecting monthly DD fees for X4Less. That's how they work.

 

Stay off the phone as it's a waste of time in that it will never result in a good result for you.

 

I know DX has asked for info but I want info too please. Can you check your bank statements and tell us :-

 

1. After your failed DD in May 2019, how much have you paid in admin fees (not gym fees).

 

2. How much they have taken in DD m/ship fees since May 2019.

 

Then we may be better able to advise if you should reclaim any of the DD's paid by the bank.

 

 

 

[dada71]

Hi

I've checked my bank statement and actually I haven't paid them twice.

 

25th march 2019 first time I didn't have enough money to pay for membership.(its showing on my statement, 11.99 out, balance went on minus then on same day 11.99 came back to account)

 

23th March I've paid £11.99 23th May 2019 that's second time I haven't paid

( since then DD was bouncing back every month(that's what harlands told me) ,

but from June it's not showing anything in my bank statement)

 

2nd July I've paid £98.98 fees for overdue payments

13 August I've paid £61.99 fees for overdue payments

 

Then I think in September they sent me sms that I have to pay them another 98.98 fees which I didn't pay so they passed that to CRS and now they asking me to pay 213.47

 

They have been contacting me only by sms with direct links to payment website.

 

Also i forgot to mention in previous post that i have reported that to Financial Ombudsman services on 19th december but did not get any respond yet.

 

Thank you

 

 

[slick132]

Hi Dada,

 

The FOS will not involve themselves in your issue - it's not their remit.

 

Am I right to say :-

 

1. You didn't pay March 2019 as it bounced.

 

2. You paid £11.99 on 23rd April ( but you wrongly said 23rd March above) and that was the last regular monthly DD you paid.

 

Q1. When you paid the 2 amounts (98.98 and 61.99), did you pay this to Harlands/CRS or did they take the amounts using the DD Mandate.

 

Q2. Can you say approx last date you used the gym facility.

[dada71]

Hi slick, yes

March bounced back due to insufficient funds 

April I've paid 11.99

May bounced back due to insufficient funds again 

Since then direct debit was bouncing back every month even though I did have money on account. 

 

98.98 and 61.99 I have paid to harlands through website that they have provided by sms, not using dd. 

 

Last time I used gym facilities in last days of July or begging of August 2019

Thank you 

[slick132]

Hi Dada,

 

March you owe 11.99

April was paid

May you owe 11.99

June you owe 11.99

July you owe 11.99

August you owe 11.99

September you owe for notice period 11.99 (let's assume this for practical purposes even though you gave no propernotice to cancel)

 

Total you owe for m/ship = £71.94

 

I guess the 98.98 was m/ship 2 x 11.99 = 23.98; plus 3 x 25.00 admin = 75.00

 

And the 61.99 was 11.99 plus 2 x 25.00 = 50.00

 

Total you paid Harlands = £160.97

 

Bad news - you've paid Harlands admin fees that you should not have paid and cannot get back using the DD Guarantee Scheme.

 

Good news - you don't owe Harlands/CRS any more and can confidently ignore their demands and threats.

 

You chose to pay the 2 amounts to the Harlands/CRS website and can't get that back now. So I suggest you use this as a lesson learned and, in future, remember the advice in our guide here - https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/383678-cancelling-your-gym-agreement-get-it-right/

 

 

I suggest you write to Harlands by posted letter telling them :- 

 

Dear sir or madam,

 

I now realise you charged me admin fees of £125 in 2019 which I paid, but should not have. I also paid 3 gym fees of £35.97 so total I paid you is £160.97.

 

For unpaid gym fees in 2019, I owed for March, May, June, July, August and September (notice period), a total of just £71.94.

 

You have received  £89.03 more than I owed and, if I had paid by DD, I would reclaim what was overpaid. In the circumstances, I will pay you nothing more and expect you to cease demands immediately.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

This may not stop them straight away but it sets out your case in simple terms. And it gives you a good reason to ignore further demands from Harlands/CRS and stop worrying about your credit records.

 

Keep us posted ...............

[dada71]

Thank you for your help, but as I mentioned in my first post direct debit was bouncing back every month since May even though I had money every month after May on my account.

 

I have letter from the bank stating that harlands been using wrong transaction code.

Maybe they been doing that on purpose?

Is it possible to get that money back from them?

Thanks 

[dx100uk]

TBH I cant see why you can't ...see if you can do a chargeback via the bank as you used a debit card?

you could always state you paid under duress as they were threatening court/bailiffs? which you now find out was a lie and you were duped into paying penalty fees ??

 

then you could adapt the letter to offer all the membership backdated that you owe minus

 the unlawful fees? just musing.....

[slick132]

Harlands would not do what you say on purpose - that's not how they operate. Your paymets failed In March and May 2019 and that was your fault 

 

Try to get the money back by chargeback if you want - no harm in trying.