Mutating Corona Virus

[honeybee13]

I don't get notifications, sadly.

 

Is there something that's missing that you'd like me to put back? Or you could copy and paste the version you'd like to appear into a new post and I'll delete the old ones if you want.

[tobyjugg2]

not necessary TY HB

I added back the florida link in a later post

 

[honeybee13]

Good.

 

[tobyjugg2]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-scotland-north-england-travel-advice-lockdown-update-sturgeon-a9647816.html

 

Scotland advises against travel to Northern England

 

"“I strongly advise anyone planning to travel to areas affected in the north of England, or anyone planning to travel to Scotland from those same areas, to cancel their plans.”"

Edited July 31, 2020 by tobyjugg2

[honeybee13]

This is a long read but it's advice from the official SAGE group's behaviour people about possible social unrest during Covid and policing issues, etc.

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/904677/S0578_SPI-B_Public_Disorder_and_Public_Health_-_Contemporary_Threats_and_Risks.pdf

 

It doesn't say when this was published but right at the end there's a mention of possible problems if there's a new lockdown just before Eid. I wonder if this was taken into account before the last minute announcement of a new lockdown in the Manchester area?

[tobyjugg2]

all relevant stuff HB, but I'll tell you whats bothering me:

 

Whether the initial plans were wrong or not, be they wrong disease, or wrong approach (herd immunity) it seems absolutely clear to me that absolutely no lessons have been learned, let alone applied from everything we have learned about covid

 

Johnson/Cummings 'herd immunity' plan clearly still seems to hover behind every decision even though there is ample evidence that that entire approach is now in severe doubt (limited immunity) - even with all moral considerations aside

 

and all plans were, and continue even now to seem to be based on the already dis-proven assumption that the disease would not be 'at large' during the summer months - despite its being clearly on the increase again at every opportunity.

 

Even the vaccines are expected to only offer a limited boost in 'relief from severe symptoms and the increased spreading severe symptoms (coughing and sneezing) can bring

 

That we now know that the viral load is 'higher' up the respiratory system hence requiring less force to blow it about seems to also be totally ignored (apart from a very late requirement for face masks) let alone that it can thrive in hot weather.

 

All these issues seem to be ignored in the failure to update planning which was dubious at best even in the early days in Jan and Feb.

 

and Johnson and Handcock seem to be expecting something other than severe problems when flu season starts proper in just a few month time ...

[honeybee13]

I can't disagree with what you say, TJ.

 

Another thought I read online yesterday was that Demonic is so obsessed with data science that the government has tried to use algorythms and modelling to manage a virus.

 

Whoever it was said that smaller and poorer countries have managed the pandemic better because they didn't rely on data, they took a public health type cautious and preventative approach. I hadn't thought about it that way before but I think it's right.

[hightail]

3 hours ago, tobyjugg2 said:

and Johnson and Handcock seem to be expecting something other than severe problems when flu season starts proper in just a few month time ...

Could that be because this virus has already taken out many of those most likely to be worst affected by winter flu?

[unclebulgaria67]

5 hours ago, honeybee13 said:

Whoever it was said that smaller and poorer countries have managed the pandemic better because they didn't rely on data, they took a public health type cautious and preventative approach. I hadn't thought about it that way before but I think it's right.

 

Not really thought about this, but yes this is probably correct.

 

If you look at some of the Asian countries they were already accustomed to wearing face masks and they are possibly more accepting of Governments imposing restrictions to freedoms. 

 

But comparing data between countries is complicated by many factors, as there were different strains of the virus  ( 4 I believe ) as I understand it, with Europe affected by a different strain to that suffered in Asia.  The one that infected people in Europe was more powerful as I understand it.  This is what I have read, but this was a month or so ago, so may have been disputed by subsequent research.

 

 

[unclebulgaria67]

Are the UK public ready and willing to accept another lockdown from September ?

 

Media reports are saying that due to schools reopening, Government will need to consider closing down Pubs and other meeting points, as they are expecting some Children plus the school staff to become infected. Therefore they want to control the number of contacts people have. The issue I have with this, is that parents of Children and partners of school staff will be mixing with people on public transport and in workplaces. If Pubs in particular were more risky than say an office, why are they open now ?

 

Also according to other reports in todays media, Government will be looking to shield over 50's, if there is an increase in virus cases.

 

Personally I don't mind another lockdown. Happy to work from office or home as necessary. But I am lucky that I am in a job that is not going to be directly impacted by other lockdown. There will be many businesses that are only just about surviving with any Government help. If there is another lockdown, I dread to think about the economic consequences.

[tobyjugg2]

47 minutes ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Are the UK public ready and willing to accept another lockdown from September ?

 

Media reports are saying that due to schools reopening, Government will need to consider closing down Pubs and other meeting points, as they are expecting some Children plus the school staff to become infected. Therefore they want to control the number of contacts people have. The issue I have with this, is that parents of Children and partners of school staff will be mixing with people on public transport and in workplaces. If Pubs in particular were more risky than say an office, why are they open now ?

 

 

All valid and important, but The real key question seems to me to be:

 

Are the UK public willing to accept that a significant number of children may end up killing their parents as a direct result of Johnsons' policies?

 

and when those parents become sick, or die, will the children need to go to their grandparents, perhaps for the rest of their grandparents lives?

 

Then what?

 

I think this is the most monstrous 'plan' of Johnsons yet

all for the lack of a proper testing regime and awaiting a vaccine

 

but don't worry, the private schools Johnson and farage and their ilke go to have much smaller class sizes

 

Managed returns of a few days/half-days a week. with increased focus on remote schooling with all parents who can work from home continuing to work from home

that and a REAL increase in competent managed testing is what is really needed and what undoubtedly will be needed in future

 

- Not Johnon/Cummings 'get the herd infected in a way they CAN'T avoid -  and if they die 'its the virus and their fault'

 

Edited August 2, 2020 by unclebulgaria67
Typo correction Managed returns of a few days/half-days a week.

[unclebulgaria67]

"Are the UK public willing to accept that a significant number of children may end up killing their parents as a direct result of Johnsons' policies?"

 

listening to LBC radio station at the moment and they are discussing this very topic.

 

Not just Johnson/UK policy, but other countries are facing same issues.

 

Agree that schools will need to apply social distancing, so reduced class sizes and they will have to provide teaching via Zoom or similar.  Any Children with health conditions or living in a household with others with health conditions, will need to have an individual risk assessment. Same for all school staff.

 

Personally I cannot see that schools will be ready to open fully in early September. They are going to have carry out a large number of risk assessments and this is going to take time.

[tobyjugg2]

Just tuned in to the rape/abuse by Tory MP (former minister) allegations

Edited August 2, 2020 by tobyjugg2

[tobyjugg2]

1 hour ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

Also according to other reports in todays media, Government will be looking to shield over 50's, if there is an increase in virus cases.

 

 

Does that actually just mean lockdown based simply on age?

Or is there actually some science hidden in Johnsons' poo pile - as if

 

Edited August 2, 2020 by tobyjugg2

[brassnecked]

The Herd Immunity scenario is for the Flu Plan all parties bought into, Demonic really is a closet Eugenicist, he buys into depopulation as does Gates the Vaccine king.  He wants a digital vaccinated tattoo on people vaccinated.  the Tinfoil hatters aver the vaccine contains fertility reducing components. 

 

Who will look after the children after their parents die from the school acquired infection, No answer to that.

[unclebulgaria67]

Conspiracy theories about population controls events are nothing new. 

 

Problem is always that 99% of the worlds population are totally reliant on experts and those leaders who may or may not apply the work of the experts.

 

Next year, most UK citizens could well be offered a vaccine. From what I have heard/read, most experts think a safe vaccine should be ready in a years time.  They will then work through a priority order, so healthcare workers are likely to be first on the list.

 

In the meantime, it is a case of going with the flow of whatever Government wishes to do, as I don't think people have much choice. Of course people should ensure that they are working in safe conditions and employers are required to conduct risk assessments. But the UK does have to get back to a workable environment, as the consequences of further mass lockdowns are too dire to contemplate.  

 

 

 

 

[brassnecked]

We are lucky, myself and son's being PC gamers have proper workstations with correct ergonomic seating, and a gaming rig makes a  powerful workstation for productivity. For many the laptop on the dining table is a reality and not suitable.

[honeybee13]

I can't link to it because of the paywall but the Times is saying that HMG is abandoning weekly testing in care homes, despite promises not that long ago.

 

Why? It already threw them to the wolves once - not my opinion, that was a parliamentary committee.

 

This is from 31st July and the news today is a complete U-turn.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-53604422

[tobyjugg2]

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/govt-accused-of-abandoning-care-homes-again-as-testing-pledge-dropped/02/08/

 

https://inews.co.uk/news/uk/care-homes-testing-coronavirus-matt-hancock-569268

 

You simply cant trust a liar, and johnson is the Father of Lies

Edited August 2, 2020 by tobyjugg2

[tobyjugg2]

Jenrick is reported as saying, quite carefully, that there are 'no immediate plans' to impose an age 50+ based lockdown ...

 

Maybe 2 weeks then ... 3 at the outside

 

not really sure what the REAL reason for any such is though

 

Perhaps they simply want the virus to mutate through the young systems before they let it loose on older ones when they unlock the over 50's.

They have already set up the compromised system folk by saying out you come into the epidemic rebound and heres a tenner to go to a restaurant.

 

Then they can claim (ensure) the NHS was simply overwhelmed when they all start dying.

Can't think of any justifiable rational reason other than a statistical inference that the older you are the more likely you are to have severe effects.

[hightail]

1 hour ago, tobyjugg2 said:

Perhaps they simply want the virus to mutate through the young systems before they let it loose on older ones when they unlock the over 50's.

Apparently that's exactly the plan.  Allow the under 50s to go ahead with unresticted normal life because they won't overwhelm the NHS and keep the over 50s (now being referred to as elderly in the media) out of the way and under house arrest.

 

I can only assume this will include Boris as he falls in the targeted demographic - or will there be a Cummings clause for him and his.

 

 

Edited August 2, 2020 by hightail

[honeybee13]

You're quite right, hightail. I'd have thought quite a few of the cabinet are over 50.

 

I can't see the sense of the scheme and feel it's another policy made on the hoof.

[tobyjugg2]

Well, 90 minute test announced

.. and it isn't prioritised to airports?

 

Actually getting the 24 hour test (let alone regular ones) would be a boon to care homes and hospitals.

A 90 minute test would be most useful at airports and borders

 

 

[brassnecked]

13 minutes ago, tobyjugg2 said:

Well, 90 minute test announced

.. and it isn't prioritised to airports?

 

Actually getting the 24 hour test (let alone regular ones) would be a boon to care homes and hospitals.

A 90 minute test would be most useful at airports and borders

 

 

Border force could wait on the beaches with them for the people getting off the rubber boats. It has been said that at least 50% could have the virus. We should be very wary of all movements in and out of UK though not just refugees. Should be testing at airports and seaports, Eurotunnel etc.

[hightail]

Quick question.  If you're tested where is that result registered?  Is it at the location of the test or your private address?