friends Basic state pension - help?

[HP Mum]

Asking for a friend:

Born in '48; doesn't have a UK passport, but educated here and owns property here, resident for most of adult life - although each year split between UK/ abroad.

Ran own business  about 40y ago but is vague on if ever was given a NI number ... 

Certainly doesn't have it to hand.

Also can't remember anything about tax returns ??

Had some income generated overseas at other residence.  Was wealthy, kind of a person of independent means.   But not now.

How do I assist on ascertaining if eligible for basic state pension?

Would have been able to claim since 2013, but hasn't.

I have access to some boxes of private papers - where might I find the NI# or something else that may help locate it?

Friend currently abroad.

 

 

[dx100uk]

Did she ever attend a doctor or a practice ??

They should have their nhi number

 

Dx

[HP Mum]

Thanks dx

I am sure they must have.   I will ask which local practice they attended.  But bit concerned the practice may not have kept records.   Is it normal for a doctor to hold NI numbers?

They were also married with children; divorced/ widowed - so must be info somewhere.   I have asked one child - but they have no clue

[honeybee13]

NI number should be on tax documentation or pay slips.

 

HB

[dx100uk]

any surgery/practice attended should still have records.

 

its all digital now anyway.

 

might have to produce passport/drivers licence.

 

 

[Ethel Street]

If he can't find it on anything the 'last resort' is to fill in form CA 5403 and post in to HMRC and they will tell him what it is (if he has ever had an NI number). 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/national-insurance-get-your-national-insurance-number-in-writing-ca5403

 

If he has never had an NI number I'd have thought he couldn't ever have paid any NI contributions. In which case he wouldn't be eligible to for any basic state pension at all, would he? I'm not an expert on this though.

 

Why would a GP's practice know your NI number? Surely it would have your NHS number? 

 

I wouldn't be too quick to tell HMRC he never filled in any tax returns but used to run a business even if it was 40 years ago! Stick to what's asked on form CA 5403

Edited January 14, 2020 by Ethel Street

[HP Mum]

if friend had a company that was registered for vat - would that have NI# records attached?

[honeybee13]

I'd ne surprised tbh. NI number is personal information. 

 

HB

[HP Mum]

ok HB. 

The company (friend's own) would have paid friend a salary and thus NI contributions, maybe w/o friend even realising?

[honeybee13]

Well if your friend owned the company, I would imagine they were salaried but I don't have experience of this.

 

HB

[HP Mum]

Managed to have a brief chat with friend.  Income, NIC and tax return info seems very vague. 

But he wasn't divorced as i had wrongly thought.  He was just widowed. 

Wife also did things by the book, was the majority income earner, and was claiming her pension when she died (was older).   

If friend didn't make enough contributions can he now attach himself to her pension? 

She passed in 07; friend would have been able to claim from '13.

[honeybee13]

I would say it depends what kind of pension the wife had. Are her records any more accessible and complete than your friend's?

 

HB

[ericsbrother]

you say he lived abroad a lot, he may not be "domiciled" in the UK at all and he then has to rely on pension provision from country that is his official place of residence.

People born in the UK usually have to nominate somewhere if they wish to have this apply  so that is another avenue.

As he is abroad then chances are he wont get a payout as things are and will have to return to the UK and suffer the waiting period of non tax paying expats. As he presumably has a passport from another country he may well fail that as well

 

[HP Mum]

Friend has other passport; not uk

But he has lived in UK most his life; kids raised here; owns property here.  He just always spent the winter away.  He has in recent years been away rather than in uk.  Think that UK would be considered official place of residence.   He never worked abroad, where he is now.

He also wants the pension funds to remain in the uk bank - to cover expenses here. 

 

Not sure if wife's records are accessible.   How do I locate them?  Via dob, address, birth/death certificates?

[honeybee13]

So your friend doesn't have any paperwork about his late wife?

 

I'm also surprised that if he's spent more than half the year in the UK that he doesn't have any paperwork.

 

HB

[HP Mum]

He does have tons and tons of paperwork  In a cupboard under the stairs of his flat.

I haven't dared to investigate yet!!

[honeybee13]

I have to say I'm amazed at the efforts you're going to in order to help your friend.

 

Forgive me for saying it but it might be better to find information rather than ask us what to do when you don't know what is available from the paperwork.

 

HB

[HP Mum]

I know.  I am a good friend!!

[HP Mum]

friend has provided me with marriage certificate, spouse dob and date of death.

He states she had started claiming in 98.  She passed in 07.  She was the income earner in the relationship.

What does friend need to do now?  Or how can I help?

[Ethel Street]

11 hours ago, HP Mum said:

 

What does friend need to do now?  Or how can I help?

 

 

What's been suggested already. Use the link in post #6 to find out if he has an NI number, then ( if he has one) ask for a pension forecast. The pension forecast form asks for details of spouse (including spouse's NI number).

[HP Mum]

Thanks Ethel - Friend doesn't have NI or tax reference details though for himself or late wife.   Can he use her dob and death and marriage details to obtain them?  

Edited January 22, 2020 by HP Mum

[honeybee13]

Did your friend do what Ethel Street suggested in post #6?

 

HB

[HP Mum]

HB. He doesn't have his NI or tax details. Nor those of wife

[honeybee13]

1 minute ago, HP Mum said:

HB. He doesn't have his NI or tax details. Nor those of wife

 

Yes. That's why Ethel gave you a link in post #6.

 

HB

[HP Mum]

When I spoke to him he said he doubted if he ever had a NI#   but his wife did as she was the earner.  If he never had a NI# and thus no tax reference - can he use the link to find out wife's and be able to claim via her Ni ?