OPS/gladstone PCN PAPLOC now claimform - <10mins CCTV passenger leaving car - Broadwater Street West, Worthing

[lookinforinfo]

Give them the adress where you live abroad. If they want to pay for your airfare or train fare from there that is up to them.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

great stuff @Andyorch thank you, any advice on what I should include in the cover letter just reiterate the same points from my defence? 

 

Defence provided to court already as below - 

 

@lookinforinfo much as I'd love to charge them for the flight / travel I'd much prefer they don't have my overseas address! 

 

Thank you!! 

 

Defence

There was no breach of contract so no cause for action by the claimant - the 10 minute grace period is a matter of law as decided in the Beavis case so it wont matter what the IPC say they allow their members to do and the BPA CoP makes this abundantly clear and by failing to allow the grace period they have breached the rules.

I do not believe the claimant to have planning permission for their signage and equipment, breaching the Town and Country Planning act, Advertising Hoardings regs 2007 and so the defendant cannot enter into a criminal contract with them.

The claim is entirely without merit and abuse of process and should be struck out by the court using its case management
powers. 
The adjudicator for POPLA has deliberately missed this point and made a great deal about what the passenger did.
The passenger has nothing to do with any offer to a driver, this has been commented on by judges in the past.
The idea that pre authorisation is required makes the event a matter of trespass and not a contractual matter.
 

The fact they were filming the passenger is also a breach of their permissions under their ICO registration so a breach of the GDPR -
they cant lawfully process the images.

Finally I refer you to a recent comparable case from Brighton County court of the same claimant VS Ms W on February 5th 2020
where the claim was dismissed totally without merit. Claim Number F0HM9E9ZF

 

[AndyOrch]

No....you dont refer to your defence in the covering letter...you are informing them you will not be in attendance pursuant to CPR 27.9 and you have complied with all the directions its states in my post.

 

Sign and date. 

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Hi folks, happy Friday one and all!

 

Have had a copy of Gladstone’s DC questionnaire in which they are saying yes to potential mediation, is this to try and find another way of having me pay rather than go to CC do we think?

 

Am ready to send my DC off saying no to

mediation but just wanted to double check on the above first please?

 

Tia!

[AndyOrch]

It tells you in my link ...post# 44 ....but again no to mediation

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Thanks @Andyorch do you mean post 47 link please? I can’t see anything there about claimant suggesting mediation? Do you think it’s a ploy? I’ll just proceed with no to mediation on my paperwork. Have a good weekend!

[dx100uk]

On 22/07/2020 at 12:00, dx100uk said:

no to mediation

1 wit you

the rest is obv.

 

3 copies 

 

1 to the court

1 to gladdy's minus phone/email/sig

1 for your file

as above 

use the copies from andyorch's N180 link

 

its not a ploy.

mediation cannot make you pay anyway..

 

they are not the judge!

 

dx

 

[AndyOrch]

Yes sorry post #47...its states in the link " Yes to mediation No if its statute barred or a parking claim.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Thank you @Andyorch & @dx100uk one quick question, do I need to provide Gladstones with my defence (as CPR 27.9 states I should send them everything the court has had?) thanks!!

[AndyOrch]

No not yet...., just submit the DQ and then the court will advise the next stage by way of a Notice of Allocation...this will give directions and dates by which you exchange statements and evidence (documents).

 

Andy

[dx100uk]

if you mean your original defence, no, mcol did that when you filled it.

 

but yes you will need to send them a copy of your witness statement if the claim runs that far!

[AndyOrch]

You send the claimants solicitor a copy of your DQ and a copy of your cover letter stating you will not be in attendance pursuant to CPR 27.9

[ericsbrother]

I would continue to follow the usual course of action until it is time to exchange documents.

 

At that stage I would seriously think about letting them know you live abroad and want to attend court in person and will be seeking your costs for doing so and tell them how much an open ticket costs and see if they are still interested in wanting to continue ( don't invite them to do anything).

 

There was a claim made by these parking bandits some years ago where the defendant had to fly in from thousands of miles away ( he was in the forces) and they were forced to pay over £4 grand in costs. they appealed saying he could have visited his granny or something to mitigate the cost but the judge said that even if he did that the purpose of the trip was to attend court and it doesn't matter what else you do along with that it doesn't change the purpose of the trip.

 

As for not wanting them to have your address abroad, it would be better of they were forced to communicate by letter to that address and maybe you demanding that the hearing be in your local court under UK law to make them travel to wherever at their own expense.

 

if you were bothered to you could make this very uncomfortable for them but you don't seem to want to do your homework on the simplest of matters when it comes to procedure. Knowledge is power and you can use that to see off this claim well before a hearing if you put a bit more backbone into this.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Thanks @dx100uk @Andyorch for the

confirmation. 
 

Appreciate the extra info too @ericsbrother 

 

I am putting my backbone into this and fighting them all the way, hence why I engaged them immediately with my appeal on the PCN and to POPLA, grace period should have been a strong enough argument to nip this in the bud at that stage.

 

I’m learning all about the procedures and processes as we progress thanks to all of you here on CAG for assisting me on this. I frankly can’t believe this is still going on, bandits is very apt! 

 

@ericsbrother could you kindly point me in the direction of some reading on how I could request a local (overseas) court hearing under UK law, is there a particular convention or regulation I should refer to / read up on please? 

 

I'm seeing reference to CPR 6B and Lugano convention in my research but not being of the legal persuasion this isn't my forte and I'm not really sure which paragraph or subsection is most relevant to my situation. 

 

Thanks very much! 

[brassnecked]

Its the same OPS that were tolchocked in Lewes County Court, and special mention was made about the "extras added" might be worth including anything applicable in that judgment to clobber them with

 

[RageAgainstThePCN]

thanks @brassnecked on the questionnaire I suggested it was handled at Lewes CC for that reason! 

[ericsbrother]

 as you reside abroad you can still remind them about costs!

 

The address you are using is for service of documents and that is different to residence. 

A company will have a registered address that may have nothing more than a postal forwarding service there so as log as it isn't a PO box number any address will do for correspondence and wont affect your travel costs.

 

However, get the AOS and outline defence in first as they may well chuck the towel in as soon as they see the claim is going to be defended.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Morning everyone,

 

Have finally received a response from Gladstone RE the CPR 31.14, they dated it end of August but it took forever to arrive (Corona?),

 

They have stated a number of documents that would be included but that their client is not willing to disclose and all evidence will only be provided when the court orders them to do so,

 

Just wondering what them failing to disclose might mean, if anything at all? 

 

Guessing I still just wait for next contact from the County Court? Just checked MCOL and no update bar transferring to my selected CC previously...

 

Thanks as ever for your advice!

 

RATPCN

[FTMDave]

It's just par for the course, doesn't mean anything, they will have to disclose at WS stage.

[lookinforinfo]

It usually means that they do not have at least one of the documents which means that there is no contract between them and the motorist. That is good for you.

 

When doing your WS you can say that you sent them a CPR 31.14 in early August which they have not sent any documents to you as yet.

 

So it is reasonable to assume that they are missing at least one of the documents that prove there is a contract between OPS and yourself.

 

You feel that as a litigant in person that you may well be ambushed in Court with the Landlord's contract with them giving you little chance to investigate the whole of a comprehensive Landlord contract for example.

 

Then carry on to say that they do not appear to have permission from the Council under the Town and Country [Advertisements] Regulations to erect their signs and cameras in the car park.

 

It follows therefore that as the signs should not be there then there is no contract formed with them and the motorist.

 

It is also a breach of their Code which they need to have to enable them to apply for DVLA details and a breach of  the Consumer Rights Act 2015 concerning the need for them to adhere to th CoP.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Hi everyone! 

 

Hope you are all coping okay with Lockdown 2. 

 

I now have a "telephone" court date set, OPS stumped up the 25 pound fee so it's going ahead,

 

Already had some great advice from you all including @lookinforinfo above but wondered if there was any other tips I should be considering when drafting my WS please? 

 

I found what seems to be a decent guide here https://hallellis.co.uk/preparing-witness-statements/ as well as the standard justice.gov advice https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/standard-directions/general/witness-statements however would welcome any further input as to how I can fight this to the end! 

 

Thanks very much as ever,

 

RATPCN

[dx100uk]

plenty of PPC PCN WS's here already whens your date?
 

[lookinforinfo]

There is a WS  on a thread just above you from M1n1me that would help with what to say.

Also at the top of the Private Parking section you are on there is a list of some of the successful Court cases we have had. There you should find other wins cases that are more relevant to yours where you should find more WS examples.

 

when you have done it post it up here and we will make suggestions to strengthen your classic necessary.

Please Also post up their WS  so we can testify to pieces which helps your case.

[RageAgainstThePCN]

Hi Both,

 

Thanks for getting back!

 

@dx100ukit's the 9th of December, I will be submitting my documents via email this week,

 

@lookinforinfothanks for the pointer, reviewed M1n1me this morning and will look through some others today,

 

NB I am just going back through all of the docs I have and I researched the company OPS are contracted to for management of this site and that company was dissolved, 3 years ago. From what I have read this does not necessarily void the OPS contract for the issuing of PCNs but wondering if this holds any bearing and if I should include this in my WS,

 

Will post up redacted WS ASAP,

 

Thanks again,

 

RATPCN

 

 

Edited November 23, 2020 by RageAgainstThePCN

[brassnecked]

I would check on that especially if a new company is now occupying, that would not be party to the contract, and OPS might  just be carrying on regardless, the new occupier having not fallen foul of OPS. BBut unless any new occupier has agreed to carry on the contract, all OPS have to rely on is an implied acceptance, that is tenuous potentially.   It might  void any rights OPS has/had over the site.

Probably some more thoughts on this from others.