Statutory declaration for a speeding fine I did not commit? **WON**

[hassy786]

Hello

 

If anyone can help it would be great.

 

Long story short, I have received a letter in my post stating I owe £355 for a speeding offence. 

 

It was not me as I dont have a driving license and dont own a car.

I think this is related to my ex giving my name on the NIP when they ask you to write down who was driving.

Must have written my name so he could get away from it

now im having to deal with the problem when it has nothing to do with me.

 

I have a statutory declaration on the following wednesday for this and obviously I will say it wasnt me

how can i prove to them i was sitting at home on the day the offence occurred..

Actually I dont know what i was doing on the day as the offence is backdated from november 2017 and we are in 2019 now.

How will i be able to prove it wasnt me? 

 

I know they can check if I hold a driving license or if im a registered keeper on any vehicles which im not

how can i prove to them I wasnt commiting the crime?

 

If i say I was at home at the time will this be enough proof or will they not accept this?

 

Please help as I do not want to be charged for something I havent done.

If they ask me who i think it was all I can say is the registration number relates to my ex and it must have been him who commited the offence but thats all I know...

 

Thanks 

[Argyll]

If this is from November 2017 when did you become aware you were being blamed for being the driver?

[hassy786]

Thank you for replying.

 

I have moved addresses about 4-5 times since 2017, up until now and the first time I found out anything about this offence was in august this year (2019).

 

It was a phone call I received which explaining to me that I have commited a speeding offence and they have been trying to get a hold of me. I couldnt remember exactly what date the lady over the phone had said

 

I called them last week to ask if they could tell me exactly what date and time the offence occured and the lady told me she cant discuss case related topics with me over the phone but all she can tell me is the offence occured 17th november 2017.

She didnt tell me a time for when it happened.

 

Thanks.

[Argyll]

That would mean you didn't update your driving licence with your new addresses.

 

It seems strange the police haven't 'doorstepped' you. They normally do this to confirm you were the driver..

 

Haven't you viewed the photographs? They are normally available online. 

[hassy786]

Are you talking about my provisional driving license as that is all I hold and its invalid as it has expired and the reason I didnt update the driving license details is because I do not need to drive or have the intention to pass my licence any time soon so didnt really think about updating old address.

 

Yes they havent and also I do not know anything about any photographs as all i am aware is that I received a call stating I am £355 in debt due to a speeding offence in november 2017. No mention of any photographs. 

 

Statutory declaration coming up on wednesday

 

what will i say other than I do not hold a license to drive, own a car or even know how to drive a car?

 

Thanks

[Man in the middle]

You don't have to prove anything to do with the driving offence itself. But before we go any further please answer these questions:

 

1. When did you first become aware that you had been convicted of an offence?

2. How did you become aware?

3. What offence was it?

4. When were you convicted?

5. What has happened since you first became aware you had been convicted?

[hassy786]

Thanks for your reply..

 

1. Already mentioned this (29 August 2019)

2. Phone call to my new number (Not sure how they got my phone number) 

3. Cant remember exactly what they told me however I know its related to my ex's car being caught going over the speed limit.

4. I have not been convicted. 

5. I have not been convicted.

 

All I know is I have received a phone call from Cambridge magistrates Court informing me that I have been caught speeding with the car registration number and when I told them I dont know anything about this as i dont drive, they told me to attend a statutory declaration which will be for this wednesday.

 

The statutory declaration was originally for the 04/11/2019 however they had given me the wrong information as they told me it would be in my home city however they accidentally put me in a different city. Did tell them I wont be able to attend a different city as I dont drive or have money for transport 

 

They then told me thats fine we will rebook the statutory declaration and let you know when the next date is over email but i received no email from them.

 

I waited and waited up until 30/09/2019 when I received an email stating I did not attend the statutory declaration on 25/09/2019 however I did not even get an email telling me its booked in the first place.

 

I then received a letter from cambridge magistrates Court through post stating £355 will be taken out of my wages every week..

 

I contacted them again through email stating I will not be paying any money towards this as it has nothing to do with me and that I request them to give me a proper statutory declaration date as it was not fair on me why I should be paying for a ticket I did not commit.. they agreed to do a statutory declaration for this wednesday coming.

 

now I am in the position where I have a statutory declaration to attend but have no idea what it is or how to go about it..

Will I not have to provide them proof to show it wasnt me as I was lets say at home or at work?

How does it work please?

[Man in the middle]

Quote

I have not been convicted.

 

Then I'm confused on two counts:

 

Quote

I have received a letter in my post stating I owe £355 for a speeding offence.

 

If you owe £355 for a speeding offence and you were not convicted of anything, who do you owe the money to? Only a court can impose fines at that level so what have you got that tells you that sum is owed and who is it from? Then:

 

Quote

I have a statutory declaration on the following wednesday…

 

A statutory Declaration (SD) is made when a person is convicted of an offence but they had no knowledge of the court proceedings against them which led to their conviction. But you say you have not been convicted of anything. So who advised you to make an SD and why?

 

One other problem you have is that for it to be accepted unconditionally your SD has to be made within three weeks of finding out about your  conviction. The SD will remove any conviction against you (and cancel any penalties) but unless you can clarify what it is you have been asked to pay and why you have been advised to make an SD it is difficult to help.

Edited November 25, 2019 by Man in the middle

[hassy786]

Sorry I didnt reply back. 

I was busy stressing about this whole matter.

 

Today I have just done the statutory declaration and they asked me several questions.

 

1) You where supposed to attend within 21 days of being notified of the fine so why didnt you?

My reply to this was: I didnt receive any letters stating to attend court on these dates and I have changed address atleast 3 times so did not receive anything from them. I also told them i do not drive or hold a driving license other than my provisional which doesn't allow me to drive anyway. I was really nervous there and honestly couldnt get any words out.

 

Long story short..they agreed to proceed with my statutory declaration and now I have a jury trial case to attend on the 29th november which gives me 2 days to find any proof I can provide to show where i was on the day, what i was doing on the day etc etc. 

 

My question is..

What happens if i dont have any paper work to show for that day at the trial? 

 

Can I get a solicitor even though I have just done the statutory declaration without a solicitor?

I am really terrified of what has happened and I am very scared I am going to be charged at the trial for something my ex did and blamed it all on me.

Please help me with some advice.

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

What do you have to prove where you were? Withdrawal from a cash point, receipts for shopping? Do you know where you were on the day?

HB

[Man in the middle]

I'll ask again, what charge(s) do you face? There are two possibilities:

 

1. Speeding

2. Failure to provide driver's details.

 

Is it (1), (2) or both?

 

I suspect it is either both or just No. 2.

You need to find out what it is because defending (1) is totally different to defending (2) and no meaningful advice can be given.

 

In any case you don't have to prove where you were at the material time.

If you face Speeding the prosecution has to show that you were driving (which might be difficult for them from what you have said) and that you exceeded the speed limit.

 

From what you have said they have no evidence that you were driving so a conviction is bound to fail.

If it is Failure to Provide Driver's details, where you were at the time of the speeding allegation is irrelevant.

 

You can engage a solicitor if you wish.

Your Statutory Declaration has no bearing on your trial.

 

You may be able to find one who offers a free initial consultation (and the first question he or she will ask will be the one I have asked above) If you want one to represent you in court be prepared to fork out about £1,000.

 

By the way, you won't be facing a jury trial.

Almost all motoring offences are dealt with in the Magistrates' Court (and the two above most certainly are).

Your trial will be before either a District Judge sitting alone or, more probably, a Bench of three Magistrates.

 

But once again, you must tell us what charges you face.

[hassy786]

Honestly I am trying to find something just something to show for proof but I dont have anything.

My bank card was not in use at the time..

I have tried calling my old work and they told me my shift pattern was sunday to wednesday not on the 17th (Friday)..

They have provided me a letter to show I was working Sunday to Wednesday and that i started employment with them in 2017 in my home town but thats all i have.

My phone number has been changed at least 3 times..

In 2017 i had my old bank account which i dont use anymore so i cant check any records for that..

I cant remember anything as it was over 2 years ago.

I know 100% for sure that i did not commit this offence and i do not even know how to drive a car so it couldnt possibly have been me.. But how am i meant to prove this to them?? 

Can they seriously put this all on me and blame this on me?

Im not guilty and i dont want to be paying for someone elses mistake..

Could you tell me what will happen at the trial?

Will my ex be there?

Or is this a trial only for me?

The statutory declaration was done today and it has proceeded to a trial which is in 2 days.

Why am i being framed for something i havent done and my ex is literally walking away from all this. 

Please help me.

I dont know who to ask for help. 

[honeybee13]

I'm not sure why your ex would be there. Is his name on any of the court paperwork?

 

HB

[Man in the middle]

No, your ex has no reason to be there.

Presumably they have the form where he nominated you as the driver.

If he has nominated you knowing full well you could not possibly have been the driver the police may be interested because he has probably committed an offence of Attempting to Pervert the Course of Justice.

 

This is a serious offence which almost invariably ends up with a prison sentence.

[hassy786]

Yes I have just been told this exact thing over the phone to magistrates court.

They said if you can prove to us it was not you who was driving then ex can end up in prison as well as the fine to pay. 

 

My problem is i dont have anything to show what i was doing on the day so what can i do?

 

Can they see me as guilty without any proof on their side?

I mean theres no cctv images and the car is not registered to me so surely they cant give me a fine for something i havent done?

 

As far as i am aware i have been charged for a speeding offence.

I have not been charged for failing to provide driver details as its not my vehicle.

This is a speeding charge only.

 

what can i do about this?

I know for certain my ex has perverted the course of justice as he has tried giving my name when it wasnt me. 

 

What do i have to do to defend myself at court on friday?

Honestly im behind on rent and only just managed to slowly pick myself up and sort my life out and here i am getting accused for this.

 

I do not have the money to fork out £1000 for a solicitor.

 

@honeybee13No i am just asking as i dont know how the trial works. 

What is the trial and what am i going to be asked or told there.

I have no idea.

 

 

[Man in the middle]

OK. If it's just speeding (which I doubt) let's keep it simple. They have to have evidence that you were driving. Since you were not, what evidence do you think they have to prove that you were?

 

Quote

I have not been charged for failing to provide driver details as its not my vehicle.

 

It doesn't have to be your vehicle. Your ex told the police that you were driving. What happens next is that the police then send a notice to you asking you to confirm that you were the driver. If you do not reply to that you would be charged with "failing to provide driver's details". 

 

As an aside you should have been served with the evidence against you. Were you?

Edited November 27, 2019 by Man in the middle

[hassy786]

Thanks for the reply.

I know certainly 100% that there is no proof that I am driver of the vehicle.

Its not possible that I was the driver as I do not know how to drive.

I literally cannot drive a car so there is no proof that I was driving a car in kings lynn at 5.14pm on 17 november 2017.

 

Most definately they do not have any proof against me that I was driving so they cant possibly charge me for a speeding offence that i did not commit. 

 

I understand you now about the "failure to provide driver details".

I did not receive any notice or letters asking me to provide details of the drivers.

 

Maybe they sent the letter to my previous address which I do not live at any more for the past 2 years.

Then again, why would they ask me to provide details of the driver when its not my vehicle and I am not the registered keeper of the vehicle? That doesnt make sense...

I havent received any letter or notice asking me to provide any details of drivers.

 

When I turned up to my statutory declaration today and they read what they are charging me for..

It was for a speeding offence which occured on 17 november 2017 at 5.14pm kings lynn wellingham.

 

They said it was a fine of £355 now including a £600 charge (not sure what the £600 was for but im guessing this will be for court charges), I am looking at a fine of around £1000.

 

It is most definately for a speeding offence only as they believe I was driving a vehicle at a certain time and place and I was driving in excess of the speed limit. 

 

There is most definately no proof against me of driving the vehicle thats 100% certain.

 

How exactly can I interpret this to the court.

On friday at the hearing I am guessing all i can ask them is to provide me proof of ME driving the vehicle?

 

I am going to contact my bank in 2017 to ask them for a statement for november 2017 so I can hopefully find something on there to show I was not in kings lynn on the day.

 

Hopefully I can find this.

 

Thank you for your help.

 

Forgot to say, I was not served the evidence against me at the statutory declaration..

Maybe they will show this on friday at the trial?

 

Thanks.

[Man in the middle]

10 hours ago, hassy786 said:

It is most definately for a speeding offence only as they believe I was driving a vehicle at a certain time and place and I was driving in excess of the speed limit.

 

Ok let's go with that. The fine you mention (£355) is not high enough if you were convicted of Failing to Provide Driver's Details.

 

You need to see what evidence they say they have that proves you were driving. You are entitled to see this before your trial and if you are not served with it you are entitled to ask for an adjournment (that is, have the matter postponed) until you have it.

 

Strictly speaking serving it on the day is often seen as sufficient.

However, if you don't understand it you are entitled to be given the opportunity to take it somebody that can explain it to you.

 

I would suggest you contact the court tomorrow and tell them you need the evidence against you. They may tell you to contact the police or the CPS. If so, do that. 

 

If they do insist on the trial going ahead you must stand your ground and give your evidence, on oath, to say that you cannot drive and that you had never driven the vehicle on that or any other occasion.

 

You do not have to prove you were not driving - the police have to prove that you were and they have to do so "beyond reasonable doubt" so that the court is sure.

 

Quote

Then again, why would they ask me to provide details of the driver when its not my vehicle and I am not the registered keeper of the vehicle? That doesnt make sense...

 

As I said earlier, it is because your ex told them you were driving.

 

What I would also do is raise a complaint with the police on the grounds that your ex stated that you were driving when he knows you could not possibly have been driving (provided that is so).

 

As I said, it is a serious offence - far more serious that the speeding he was trying to avoid.

 

 

[hassy786]

When you say contact the police or CPS, are you taking about the police in Peterborough (my hometown) or the police where the fine happened (kings Lynn).

 

I will get the evidence against me tomorrow by calling them hopefully and if not I will go there and ask for it as I dont see how they can possibly have anything against me for driving when I cant drive.

 

by what your saying..

I am wasting my time trying to find a proof to show what I was doing on the 17 November 2017 as I am meant to argue back with the court and ask for proof rather than provide them with all my information?

 

I need to stand my ground and argue back and explain why im innocent and ask for what proof they have against me for this offence.

 

As for calling the police to raise a complaint on my ex perverting the court of justice, I dont think they will bother to look into this as I did at one point call the police and explain my story to them and did mention my ex giving my name in for a speeding fine I did not do but they didnt seem to care over the phone.

 

Do I ring the police as in magistrates court or the none emergency number (101) or ??

 

 

[Man in the middle]

Quote

When you say contact the police or CPS, are you taking about the police in Peterborough (my hometown) or the police where the fine happened (kings Lynn)

Try the court (where your trial is due) first. You probably won't get it until Friday but you need to make it known that you haven't got and you need it. 

 

Quote

So by what your saying.. I am wasting my time trying to find a proof to show what I was doing on the 17 November 2017 as I am meant to basically argue back with the court and ask for proof rather than provide them with all my information?

 

You're not wasting your time but I doubt you would be able to prove very satisfactorily what you were doing on a specific day two years ago (I certainly couldn't, unless I was on holiday or in hospital or something).

 

You mustn't lose sight of the fact that the prosecution has to prove you were driving, you do not have to prove that you were not.

 

SInce you were not I find it hard to believe that you were even prosecuted let alone that you were convicted. That's why it is important to see the evidence against you and you need to see it before your trial begins.

[hassy786]

thank you,

I will give them a call tomorrow and ask for the evidence first either the same day or on Friday before the trial starts.

 

Can I just ask..

What happens if I ask them for proof of evidence I was driving and they say they do not have any?

(Which most likely is the case other than my ex's word saying it was me driving).

Other than this, there is no proof to show I am the driver because its literally impossible to be me.

 

I understand,

Honestly I just think this is really unfair as I cant afford a solicitor for this and I dont see why I should waste my time and money to sit at a court hearing that really I dont even know why the blame is being put on me.

 

I understand its not the courts fault as it was my ex who is putting me through this

but at the same time, the court could be a bit more helpful towards general people of the public surely.

 

Only solicitors have a good idea on how court hearing are and how they happen and im just a normal every day person and this is the first time I have ever gone to court for anything.

 

I literally am playing with fire here as I dont know where to start and what to do.

I will be very gutted if this is put on me and I have a fine of £1000 to pay for my ex's mistakes and see him walking away. Honestly I am gutted.

 

I guess they prosecuted and pinned the blame on me due to them trying to contact me through my different addresses and maybe they must have tried calling me over the phone but couldnt reach me due to my number changing and because there was a mess up of the first statutory declaration which was meant to be in Peterborough but turned out it was in Huntingdon..

 

maybe because of all this, they prosecuted me for it and blamed it all on me as they didnt hear back from me.

While all my ex has done is sent a letter off stating it was me yet I dont even have a licence to drive!

Honestly I hope hell comes to him some day.

 

Thank you very much for all your help, I dont know who you are but thank you for taking your time out and helping me with this. 

 

1 last question I would like to know..

Would it be a better idea to find a solicitor to deal with this as I have a feeling I will go back on friday to the trial and freeze there with my nerves in my mouth.

 

Is it even possible to get a solicitor now even when I have done the statutory declaration or is it too late?

Can I get a on duty solicitor before my trial and explain everything to them instead and let them deal with it?

Will they charge me for this and if I am found not guilty then will all charges including solicitor fees be cancelled from me and put on lets say my ex or the court will pay for them? 

 

or

 

Will I still have to pay for the solicitor fees and court fees regardless if I win or loose the case?

I am innocent but when it comes face to face, I really have no clue where to start and what to say. 

 

This is exactly the problem I am having.

 

It was two years ago and I seriously have no clue what I was doing on that specific date, I know for sure I was definately not in kings lynn speeding and getting myself into a speeding fine thats 100% certain.

 

Its really not fair that I am having to pay £355 + £600 for something I havent done.

 

Honestly its sickening and what the worst thing about it is..

 

I cant even afford a solicitor and I cant really stand my own ground as I really do not know what to do 

[dx100uk]

hello hassy 

thought i'd pop in as I can see after reading this thread , it's getting on top of you and you are p'haps stressing over too many things that appear to you to be out of your control and that you don't , quite rightly, fully understand having never faced any such situation before, neither anything else involve the authorities and courts.

 

1st may I politely pointout you seriously need to put mostly everything out of your mind and put yourself in the position of the bench [well its a table most probably with a few people sitting around it or to all intent that's the way your should approach it in your mind] with at least one magistrates judge sitting at it.

 

he will have in front of him a file that details

what the charge is

the evidence

your SD

 

he will not have seen any of these previously but will most certainly have dealt with on that day or be dealing with numerous like cases and will have days/weeks/months and p'haps several years of doing so. he will be aware because of and have read your SD and that you dispute the charge.

 

speak when spoken to.

clearly and simply state ONLY the relevant facts in reply to any specific question when asked.

only answer what you are asked to answer for that question [the truth/bones will come out later as the talk progresses].

[what you have simply said in this thread is more than adequate and be acceptable without proof of any kind.

 

it will quickly come to the magistrates attention that you are not guilty and subject to false disclosures.

 

follow through with any further questioning they may ask, always give them time to digest your information, if you are invited to 'speak freely' .

 

you wont be found guilty.

you don't need a solicitor.

you will walk out of there smiling.

 

and  yes..I've been through exactly the same scenario and yes like you I couldn't prove where I was and this was 3yrs earlier.

 

I never hear another word but was pleasantly surprised to get a sum of money from the victim compensation scheme some 18mts later for my troubles

 

HTH

 

dx

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[hassy786]

Erm guys.. Is there any reason why they have already started charging me court fines through my wages?

 

I have been charged today £1.75 from my wages of around £60.

Didnt do enough hours this week thats why its low.

 

Why have they started charging me already when the trial is on tomorrow?

 

Thanks.

[noomill060]

You need to contact the Court and ask.

[Gick]

It would appear that the 'garnish order' in relation to the failure to pay the fine imposed at the first trial (of which you were not aware) was in place before your Statutory Declaration. You are just unfortunate that your SD did not come in time for the order to be stayed. 

You will get that money back after the new trial when you are found not guilty/the case is dismissed.

 

I would suggest that you get to the court early and seek out the duty solicitor who should be able to reassure you in the same way that dx and man in the middle have. His service is free for advice.

 

Remember to BREATH, listen carefully to everything that is said or asked of you and if anything is unclear, ask for it to be repeated or say. "I'm sorry you worships I do not understand" (if bench of magistrates) or "your honour" if district judge.. The duty solicitor or court usher will be able to tell you which.

 

You are entitled to sit in the public area to watch proceedings prior to your case being called and this will help you familiarize yourself. There will be a list of cases being heard in that court so you will see when you are likely to be called.

Best of luck