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Moneybarn - Am I missing something!!

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Can anyone advise me please?

 

Are additional charges and court costs allowed to form part of a judgement order?

 

Cirumstances relate to

I took out high interest moneybarn finance in November 2016 to buy a car priced at £6995 the finance was 60 mths £240.82 per month.

The first payment was due in 17 Dec 16, which I immediately struggled to pay due to income issues.

I did at the time speak to Moneybarn and to avoid bank charges I cancelled the diect debit in December 16.

 

I was unable to make the payment due 17/1/17.

I was charged £18 on 10/1/7 & £18 on 8/2/17 both charges list on the statement as DD failure charge,

I never received notification of these charges and there wasnt even a DD in place.

 

10/2/17 they issued a default notice and charged the account £18 -  2 months missed.

On 2/3/18 the contract terminated however I as not informed of this and continued to make payments by 8/3/18 I had paid £488 to them

 

contacted them on 8/3/18 to see how much more was required to bring account in line only to be told the contract terminated on 2/3/19,

I received the cancellation bill etc finally around 20th march which I kept the envelope it came in.

 

I was told not to worry as they can arrange for a Judgement for delivery of goods by consent order through the courts and it would be suspended as long as I made the payments.

 

The court cost totalled £408 and they advised me if I attended a hearing the court costs would increase.

This process for them to arrange took approx 2 months in total and I was pressed for my signed docs to be returned by 28/4/17  or an agent would have attend court.

 

I was required to agree to;

1 payment £315.50

11 payments £315.42

43 payments of £240.82

 

The judgement balance claimed £14140.82 inclusive of costs (£408)

 

The  3 x £18 charges are also included in the total amount but are not listed so are masked within the listed balance of the finance.

The starting figure for the finance £14208.00

 

 

 

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well apart from lying to you to avoid you attending court and possibly objecting to the return of goods order

I cant see anything wrong sadly.

 

so you signed a tomlin order to suspend the return of goods order as long as you make the required payments?

court costs are allowed [though if £408 are is correct I have no idea]

 

there are a few unlawful penalty charges there but they are the least of your worries.

 

as usual for moneybarn, they either haven't a clue what they are doing

don't understand rules

or

make them up as they go along.

 

 


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Thanks for your reply.

 

To date ive paid £8098 and this agrees to their statements

the order requires payments inc Oct 19 of £8119 so to be totally up to date i need to pay £21,

however every month they claim im in arrears with the order.

 

 I asked them on 4th Oct to explain the arrears they allege.

They finally replied today and again just referred me as they always do me to the order, state their calculations are correct and now alledge I owe £551 in arrears?? 

 

Im concerned I have no rights due to the order?

 

Can they just take the car as they allege im in arrears or do they have to return to court?

 

Is there anyway the courts can resolve the arrears issue?

Thanks

 

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no they cant just take the car

they would have to return to court and get court bailiffs to enforce the ROG.

 

are their statements complete, i'e they show how each month the balance is made and what you have to pay/

I hope they aren't adding extra charges each month too?

they can ONLY demand what the COURT agreed with on the signed tomlin

 

it was a tomlin order yes?

 

 

 


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Check to see if they are adding monthly charges inflating arrears as per DX.


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Yes it was a tomlin/consent order

I have a recent statement its not showing any additional charges on it.

The statement does not show the balance to pay each month, as the contract was terminated in March 17 and the termination bill was added to the account so my payments reduce the account balance £14262.38 

Capital £6995.00

Interest £7213.38

Plus 3 x £18 charges 

I presume if it went to court again I would be notified? 

 

I thought court costs and charges could increase a balance owing but not be included in arrears or court proceedings when listing the amount owing, or am I wrong?

 

Not sure if relevant but on 16/6/17 the initiated a direct debit £315 using my original instruction from 2016, which I cancelled then queried and was informed it was an error,

 

they then sent me a letter on 10/8/17 stating "based on my recent contact set out below are the details of the payment plan agreed for you to repay the installments under the court order

1@ 359

8 @ 315

43 @ 240.82

1 @ 80

I never had any contact relating to this at all, so would this suggest they have altered the repayment plan from what the order states? 

 

Trying every avenue to see how they claim im in arrears.

 

They also again on 16/8/18 initiated another direct debit for £480 using my original details, which I cancelled.

 

Then again on 16/9/18 for £240.82.

 

 

 

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that's mortgages and repossession of homes where they cant inc the arrears/charges.

 

pers i'd just for the moment keep paying

get an sar running to them.

 

do you have a copy of the tomlin you signed?

that ALL you have to pay and when .

as the court agreed it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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When a default is sent,

am I correct in presuming the 14 days starts once its deemed to have been served?

 

(So for example, if posted on a Friday the first accountable day is the Monday and sat/sun or bank holidays do not count)

 

If the date was Friday 4th October

am I correct in presuming (based on my first question being correct) that Thursday 25th October would be a  deadline to adhere to a default sent on the 4th?

 

If so, would the 26th be the first day a creditor could initiate further action if a debtor had not be able correct the details required on the default?

 

 

 

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a default notice must specify a DATE not 14 days

 

who's this from

and whats the debt all about.

 

 


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I need to check the requirement of a default before I post some information, concerns and request if possible further assistance on a post I have already started in moneybarn issues and wasnt sure which topic to post my question in.

 

Altbough a default requires a date for rectification, does that date still require a minimum of 14 days from the date of service before any further action can be taken?

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threads merged.

 

just pay what is stated and agreed in the tomlin.

pers I wouldn't worry about the finer points.

 

if you have any penalty charges 

get them taken off the bal. [£18 etc]


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Sorry but just one small further issue if anyone could advise;

 

Along with ,the £54 extra charges, they added cost to issue proceedings £308.00 plus an application fee £100, which I do not know what that application refers to.

 

The consent order was returned to them on 13/4/17 and they confirmed receipt of,

however they then submitted the initial court proceedings

(I wasnt aware of this and was led to believe proceedings where already in place), 

they where actually issued on 26/4/17.  

 

Is that normal practice? 

What could the application fee relate to?

Could the court proceedings and fee been avoided?

 

Under the terms of the consent order the final payment is due on 16th October 2021,

however this date then means I am required to complete the finance in full earlier than the actual signed agreement terms stated.

 

Is that allowed?

 

The terms of the order do not seem fair, or is that normal practice?

 

 

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normal practice 

the consent order trumps the agreement

and the court fees are sadly legit too.

 


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Surely being required to complete the initial agreement I signed earlier, would mean I am paying more interest as im settling the loan over a shorter period.

 

As previously mentioned they allege a default was sent out on 10/2/17 

(this isnt true anyway as I received 2 duplicate arrears notices dated 8/2/17 in one envelope posted out on 10/2/17, I keep their envelopes as they have a habit of posting things way after they are produced, no default) and the right to demand delivery 2/3/17.

 

If it was posted 10/2/17, the first countable day would be 13/2/17, and the final date can not be less than 14 working days, so the 2/3/17 would be the final date before any further action can be taken, but they terminated on this actual date

how can that be justified for a default to be lawful?

 

Sorry but I am fed up with their badgering for arrears I do not owe and looking through other posts it would seem they ignore any legislation and do as they please.

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scan up the default notice to PDF 

read upload


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That's my main issue, I do not have the default notice from them (never received one) and based on their admissions it would seem they have acted incorrectly.

 

I wasn't aware of any default or the termination until I contacted them on 07/03/2017 @ 07:31am by email and received a reply from them on 07/03/2017 @ 16:50pm (they had made no prior attempts to contact me even after receiving payments on an agreement they were aware had been  terminated)

 

however I did not see the reply they sent until the 08/03/2017, stating:

" Can you please give the office a call your agreement has been defaulted and terminated and we have agents currently appointed to recover the vehicle " 

 

At this point I had paid to them

£80.00 02/03/2017,

£300.00 07/03/2017,

£150.00 08/03/207

total payments £530.00  -  (which covered Jan & Feb (the first payment date is confusing as they applied the first installment on 17/12/16 to my account however the paperwork states 1st  payment due 1/1/17) and £48.36 carried to March)  

 

 I am only aware that they allege one was issued to me on 10/2/2017 as the statement refers to - 10/02/2017 "Default Notice Served" £18.00  and they allege it also in the court proceedings that they posted one out by first class post on 10/2/2017  and they also state the date that the right to demand delivery of goods accrued on 2/03/2017. 

 

I did however receive 2 identical/duplicated Notice of Sums in Arrears both dated 08/02/2017 that arrived in an envelope with the date of 10/02/2017 stamped on it as posted, (I thought I read somewhere that you should receive 2 sums in arrears notices before a default can be issued, if so would the 2 of the same ones I received in the same envelope count towards the required 2),

 

The amount stated for the arrears shortfall £517.64, which I presume is the 2 months (Jan/Feb) plus 2 x £18 charges for a direct failure that I never had in place anyway for it to have failed 

(they have on more than one occasion since March 2017 applied a"direct debit receipt" then underneath that entry "Bounced DD" on my account,  one of them actual took funds from my account 16/06/2017 £315.42 but was quickly reversed by my bank and the DD they had set up claiming I had given them authority to do so was cancelled , Moneybarn claimed it was a system error. Again on 16/08/2018 £480.00 and £240.82 on 18/09/18).

 

When I contacted them on 08/03/2017 this was the point I was informed of the action they took in terminating the agreement .

The Termination Notice was sent by post to me on 08/03/2017 (I have the envelope) (It was dated for 02/03/2017 and my statement shows termination billing on 02/03/2017)

 

It was at that point I was told that my only option would be for the asset team to look at entering into a consent order with me and they would be in touch shortly. 

 

Do I need to ask them for a copy of the alleged default?

Have they acted correctly in their action taken?

 if they have not,, surely the court proceedings could have been avoided and no costs incurred?

 

Any advice you can give is appreciated,

 

I am of the opinion (although I could be wrong in my assumptions) they have not  acted correctly and guess they have or may still be doing this sort of behavior to other unsuspecting clients

 

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they do it to everyone.

 

have you looked at your credit file?

 

adding any default notice fee - £18 to the figure quoted on the DN invalidates it .

 

 

 


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Should I ask for a copy of the default? 

Yes, I have checked my credit file, there is no default listed for Moneybarn, the account states up to date and has been every month since June 17. I did notice a few discrepancies at the start of the account in:  

Jan 17 - 1 month missed

Feb 17 - 2 months missed

Mar 17 - 1 month missed

Apr 17 - 2 months missed

May 17 - 1 month missed

 

They terminated agreement in Mar 17 but continued to report on my credit file as though the account was ongoing and although I had been waiting for them since Mar 17 to sort out the consent order 

 

they eventually got back in touch with details of over 1 month later and it was then completed beginning of May 17 they had the cheek to report I was again behind (how can they operate in this manner, between Apr 17 - May 17 I had not made any payments due to;- 

1. No agreement in place.

2. Was waiting for them to issue documents etc.

 

However my Credit File gives the impression that I made a payment and the account at the point of the consent order (May 17) was only 1 month behind.

 

The account status however does not agree to the balance status as they did not reduce the balance in Feb 17 with the payment made, but increased it to include the charges they applied. 

 

In March they reduced the balance with the total payments made to them £530 but still never added the 3rd £18 charge.

 

In May 17 the payment was made to them in accordance with the consent order, however they never mark the file instead with 1 month missed.

 

The actual balance remaining on the agreement is £6110 (2 yrs, 1 month) while the overall balance is  £6572 (£462 charges).

 

To date £8098 payments made,

credit file states up to date,

no default etc,

 

they claim im in arrears by £551 I do not understand.

 

The order was to be paid in 54 monthly installments, so  in 27 months it completes Nov 2021 in full which matches the balance.

 

I can not get a response from them sufficient to justify the arrears they claim even though I have given them a detailed breakdown. 

 

I am willing to go back to courts to get the order overturned if its possible as its clear they are hoodwinking their clients to gain the upperhand, if this alleged default is void, do to them terminated early plus if it does state any charges along with I never even got it the costs surely will be revoked along with the order etc.

 

Is there anything I can do?

 

Based on their actions and them continuing to be allowed to do this the consumer isnt protected at all.

None of their actions makes sense at all and nothing seems to back up why they initiated everything.

 

 

 

 

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Would there by anyone who can advise on my last post please and let me know if its worth asking for a copy of the default notice they claim to have issued,  if there is any action I can possible take, or a governing body its worth complaining to. Thanks

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On 30/10/2019 at 14:44, dx100uk said:

Adding any default notice fee - £18 to the figure quoted on the DN invalidates it .

 

terminated on the back of an invalid DN 

even if there is one .....voids the agreement.

 

you should get back all you payments and a monetary value of the car today.

 

all in the rules of the consumer credit act.

 


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Thanks, I have read the consumer credit act and I believe I am correct that according to their dates on the alleged DN (never received one) they have terminated early and have not given the 14 days required. It is also apparent my credit file has no record of one.

 

My conern however:

I am not sure what the best way is to approach this. 

 

Do I apply to the court as they currently have a Judgement, suspended as long as I adhere to the consent order.

 

Complain directly to the governing body (FOS) or both?

 

Would I have to write to Moneybarn?

 

Thanks in advance 

 

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I would for the minute continue.

get an SAR running to them.

 


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