ADCB/Moriaty PAP Advice Required Please

[Em75]

 Is anyone able to help?

 

I have recieved a letter and request for my financial information from Moriaty Law regarding an old credit card debt incurred in Dubai.

I was previously receiving letters from a company called Idrww which I ignored.

 

I am considering bankruptcy as a result of this and another personal loan debt in Dubai owed to HSBC.

I am now a single mum with no assets (living in council accommodation) and living with the fear of what might happen next is hideous.

 

Is anyone able to advise? 

[BazzaS]

Check that if you go BK in the UK that it will include cancellation of the foreign debts, else there is no benefit to going BK in the UK. There is also the £680 BK fee to consider. BK should be a last resort, and (based on your individual circumstances) clearly the best option for you before you should consider it.

 

Additionally, if it will be hard for them to obtain an enforceable (in the UK) judgment for those foreign debts, what do you gain by going BK even if the UK bankruptcy would include the foreign debts?.

Edited August 21, 2019 by BazzaS

[Em75]

Thank.you BazzaS.

I have been researching the topic for quite a while but foreign debt seems to be a tough one.

 

From what I have read it's likely that they could obtain judgement in the UK whilst still applying the 15 year statute of limitations under Dubai law.

 

A quick Internet search on bankruptcy and foreign debt brought up this:

• All of your creditors in the world will be included. This means that they cannot take action against you in England or
  Wales to recover the money you owe.
• Creditors will also not be able to take action against you in countries in the European Union (EU), except Denmark.
• However, creditors may still try to take action against you in countries outside of the EU.
• If you have any assets outside of the EU, creditors may be able to take action which puts the assets at risk.

I guess the advantage to me would be an end to the fear and the ability to start my life over again without fear of my past stupidity coming back to haunt me? 

[London1971]

Is the letter a PAP?

 

If it isn't ignore it, pretty much stuff all they can do to you, besides scary letters. Not worth going BK over, no way.

 

Do not under any circumstances speak to them by phone either, ignore all emails. They also have zero right to ask for financial details.

 

Only a court, HMRC or Council Tax can do that.

Edited August 21, 2019 by London1971

[Em75]

LONDON 1971 thank you. I think it is a PAP.... 

[London1971]

Can you scan it up on here taking out all of your personal details , lots of people on here will be able to tell you for sure

[Em75]

I'm hoping I have done this right? 

 

 

moriarty PAP letter.pdf

[London1971]

Looks like it to me

 

@dx100uk   or @Andyorch will be able to tell you for sure,

 

No need to panic, lots of help here.

 

Stay away from all the web sites with horror stories about foreign debt too, it's often paid for rubbish.  Better advice than mine will be along soon

[AndyOrch]

The following is what they should have sent you......

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/406231-the-pre-action-protocol-for-debt-claims-is-made-by-the-master-of-the-rolls-as-head-of-civil-justice-1st-oct-2017/

 

 

As for the above.....not sure what it is meant to be .....a watered down Pre Action Protocol  warning ?

 

Andy

[Em75]

Are we saying that I need to reply? 

[AndyOrch]

Ah so it is  PAP  now you have uploaded the addition pages.

[Em75]

OK so... Are we saying that I need to reply? 

[AndyOrch]

Well yes...you have read the link I posted above..... #9 ?

[rgaine]

all in the same boat Em and the team here will support do not be afraid 

[Em75]

Thank you rgaine. I have to admit... I am utterly bedise myself. Should I ask them to supply copies of everything like the credit agreement?.....  

[London1971]

No need to be beside yourself, just fill in the link given on here by Andyorch and send it back.  If and when a Claim Form is sent out there will be a procedure to defend.  Bear in mind that no UAE bank has won in court, if it has been properly defended.

 

It's also possible that they are doing this to scare you into paying up and a claimform may never arrive.

 

Also bear in mind that you don't own a house, so no chance of a charging order. The most likely outcome even if they won in court, is for the court to look at your income / expenditure (Moriarty have zero right to do this), and the court will decide an affordable sum.

 

I'm not paying anymore than 50 pounds per month for any of my CCJ's.

 

Do not, make any attempt to contact Moriarty by phone or email either.

 

 

Edited August 21, 2019 by London1971

[Em75]

Would you advise not to respond to the PAP letter @London1971

[London1971]

You must respond but do not use their form, use the PDF at the bottom of this page. Please read carefully. I repeat you CANNOT ignore a PAP.

 

 

[Em75]

Message received loud and clear regarding responding to the PAP using the PDF provided.

 

I am sorry if I am being a little stupid.

But I dont think that I can defend the claim.

 

I have just received a call back from the CAB who have advised me that the debt could not be included in Bankruptcy until there had been a UK judgement against me.

 

Moriaty dont currently have my telephone number do I give them this information?

 

Using the PDF, am I ticking box C to say that I don't know if I owe the debt and box I and not providing income/expenditure details?

[AndyOrch]

Why are you considering Bankruptcy...they have not even issued a court claim yet ? 

 

Its vital you use our forms provided in the link ...not the ones Moriaty have sent you.

[London1971]

I'm sorry the CAB have given me some terrible advice in the past, and some others on here.  Please do as Andyorch says above. do not use Moriaty's forms.  Do not fill in ANY income and Expenditure for Moriarty. They have no more right ot demand that from you than I do.

Edited August 21, 2019 by London1971

[rgaine]

Sorry but sounds like early days if CWD and lately IDR. Been dealing with this since 2009 and still going on as well as those crazy collection agency’s in Dubai also still emailing to this day. 

 

I set up a special email account where I have everything from CWD, IDR and all others so it’s all in one place and the laws that have been broken. 

Upon discussions also with R. Sterling at detained in Dubai its also been helpful. 

 

Currently with the FO with my complaints against the attempted collection of debt in the UK when it has not been passed through the correct channels regardless of what is in the T&C. 

 

Personally I would not pay any ting until as people know that debt has been passed through the correct manner of courts in the UAE or indeed purchased by a UK company which then I will be happy to defend given the laws here and whT I have available. 

 

Make sure to ask for everything when the time come all statements, extra charges terms at the time of supposed signing etc ! 

 

Listen to the team also 

[Em75]

Thanks guys. So using the form that you have provided...

 

I am ticking box C to say that I dont know whether I owe the debt, box G to say that I am seeking legal advice and Box I asking for copies of the credit agreement, full summary of account detailing all interest and charges, details of the interest calculation, details of the administration charges, a copy of the notice of assignment and a copy of the judgement obtained in Dubai? Does all that sound right?

 

I was thinking that it might be in my interests to show them my income/expenditure as they will see that I am a single mum, working part-time and receiving benefits?

[AndyOrch]

Have they referred to a judgment in  Dubai? If not dont request it.

 

They are not interested what your financial circumstances are...so do not disclose them.

[London1971]

Another thread running on this for you to keep an eye on