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Could Not Produce 16-25 Railcard When Asked On TfL Service

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Hi All,

 

Thank you for taking the time to respond and, thank you for advising many other people on consumer-related issues. It has helped, and, continues to help a lot of people in stressful positions.

 

I am 20, hold a position at a reputable company, and I possess a valid 16-25 railcard. I use it because it works out cheaper than using an oyster card when commuting. My railcard is also digitally displayed on my phone using the Railcard app. 

 

I was running late in the morning, and I bought my usual discounted tickets. However, I forgot to charge my phone, so it died midway to my destination station.

 

As I tried to leave the station, a TfL ticket inspector asked me to produce the railcard.

I explained to him that my phone had died, and I would not be able to show my railcard at the time.

I then gave him my details when asked.

 

Two days later, I received a letter from TfL advising me that legal proceedings may be made against me. 

 

I have eight days and counting to reply to TfL's first notice.

They have given me the standard two options of either denying committing an offence or, accepting committing an offence and giving my reasons. 

 

Given my job, and, personal circumstances, I am open to settling the case OOC. However, I do fear that admission or denying would further escalate my situation. 

 

Any advice will be most appreciated. 
 
Thank you.

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Surely deny? You have a Railcard...there is a similar case of the transport focus website I recall..where the inspectors even refused the user to plug in her phone coz "it was the train companies electricity"

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But you have proof right... On an app on your phone... 

You shouldnt need to pay a penny...

 

GTR state that if you forget your season ticket then then they will refund any amounts paid for your ticket as a one off during the season ticket period... 

Its just an example... 

 

You could even screenshot your Railcard and show proof to them. There is no case to answer IMHO.

 

 


 

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**Fko-Filee**

Receptaculum Ignis

 

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simply reply with proof 

its just a std letter in this case 

 


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

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Hi Andy, Fkofilee and Dx100 

 

Thanks for your swift responses.

 

I initially felt and still feel like denying committing an offence. However, the Regulations of Railway Act states  "Every passenger by a railway shall, on request by an officer or servant of a railway company, either produce, and if so requested deliver up, a ticket showing that his fare is paid..."

 

I've noted what all of you have said, and will probably write a draft letter to TfL with a screenshot of my travel card. I'll post the draft later.

 

Do you have a link to the GTR query?

 

Thanks.

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https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/ticket_types/46571.aspx

 

Bottom of the page

Note you already have a ticket for this journey

And you have a valid (I Assume) travelcard to go with it... 

At that point... Its simple.

 

If you also have a receipt (If bought using the app you should) Also send a copy of this.

IMHO  I think you should be okay. As long as you have the Travelcard and the ticket and its valid for travel, you shouldnt find any problems.  


 

We could do with some help from you.

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

**Fko-Filee**

Receptaculum Ignis

 

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It is your responsibility to produce the railcard that makes the ticket valid.

You’ll note that this is a condition you agreed to when you obtained the railcard.

 

I mention this because you might be tempted to “take a tough line” when writing to them.  The risk in doing so is that they take a tough line in response, as technically you have committed an offence.

 

However, cool heads and common sense should prevail. Write back, explaining, and showing that you held a ticket you had paid the appropriate fare for had your phone not died.

Apologise for taking up the train staff and their time  with this, explain you had no intent to avoid your fare or cause an issue.

Point out you are buying a portable battery pack. Given there was no intent to avoid your fare or have your phone die on you, and you have taken steps to avoid your phone running out of battery again : would they consider not proceeding to court?

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Hey guys,

 

Thanks for the information and responses. The've been very valuable. I've drafted an email. What do you think of it?

 

--

 

Dear Investigations Appeals and Prosecutions Team

 

I sincerely apologise for failing to produce a valid accompanying railcard with my return ticket. 

I purchased a return ticket from Enfield Town Station to London Liverpool Street with a 16-25 railcard discount on the 15/08/19. I possess a valid digital railcard on my phone and had it at the time of travel. 

 

Unfortunately,  when asked to produce my railcard, I could not as my phone had died at the time. 

 

I understand that fare evasion is a serious matter. It costs the public a significant amount of money annually and is a top priority issue for TfL.

 

I pride myself on my integrity and honesty. I am incredibly sorry for what may appear to you and the staff, to have been an attempt to avoid my liability. I must stress that this was not intentional.

 

I have attached proof of my railcard to the body of the email, plus the return ticket with the discount printed on it. Hopefully, this can help you further in your investigation. 

 

Once again, I am sorry for the inconvenience to the members of staff concerned and TfL. 

 

I look forward to hearing from you,

 

Yours,

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It is only advice & you don’t have to take it, but you haven’t given them reason to believe you are taking concrete steps to avoid a recurrence, like I suggested.

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Hi BazzaS,

 

Thanks for your reply. I agree with your points. I want to get on their good sides ASAP so that my case doesn't have to go any further. 

 

I've made some small amendments to my apology. I've put the changes in bold.

 

--

Dear Investigations Appeals and Prosecutions Team

 

I sincerely apologise for failing to produce a valid accompanying railcard with my return ticket.  

 

I purchased a return ticket from Enfield Town Station to London Liverpool Street with a 16-25 railcard discount on the 15/08/19. I possess a valid digital railcard on my phone and had it at the time of travel. 

 

I know that it is my responsibility to show my railcard on demand to make sure that the ticket is valid and understand that failure to show it is an offence. Unfortunately,  when asked to produce my railcard, I could not as my phone had died at the time. 

 

I understand that this is a failure of my responsibilities and that fare evasion is a serious matter. It costs the public a significant amount of money annually and is a top priority issue for TfL.

 

I pride myself on my integrity and honesty. I am incredibly sorry for what may appear to you and the staff, to have been an attempt to avoid my liability. I must stress that this was not intentional.

 

I have attached proof of my railcard to the body of the email, plus the return ticket with the discount printed on it. Hopefully, this can help you further in your investigation. 

 

Going forward, I will make sure that I have my railcard ready when asked. I will also ensure that I take the necessary precautions to mitigate future technology failures.

 

Once again, I am sorry for the inconvenience to you, the members of staff concerned and TfL. 

I look forward to hearing from you,

 

Yours,

 

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Don't know much about data law and if they could do this when someone battery dies.

 

But you think they could have access to a data base like ATOC run's this https://www.railcard.co.uk/privacy-notice/

 

to save time, trouble and tree's...............................

Edited by 45002

Just say No to 0870 and 0845 Numbers,Use

http://www.saynoto0870.com/search.php

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