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    • Just to be clear you say your last payment to Mint was 3rd October 2014.   if that is the case there are possibilities:   a). Your last payment was a normal payment as a result of receiving the normal monthly bill and paying some part of it.   If you did not then pay anything else then you would have received some debt collection letters from mint over a period of some months presumably culminating in a Default Notice probably somewhere between month three and month six.   If, following receipt of that notice you did nothing then fourteen days after the date of that notice the statutory bar clock started which means that it probably started somewhere around January to April (but check this by getting SAR sent to Mint).  In this scenario you could have perhaps eight months to go before the stat bar kicks in.   b).  You had not paid the account properly prior to 3rd October 2014 and a DN was issued.  You responded by paying and the DN became voided as you corrected the issue by paying the arrears in which case we are back to a)   c).  You had not paid the account properly prior to 3rd October 2014 and a DN was issued.  You did not correct the situation within 14 days of the DN being issued and as such it came into being.  However, you continued to make some payments but if you did not fully pay the arrears the DN stays in place in which case your Stat Bar clock starts the last time you made a payment and this account will therefore become SBed 3rd October 2020.   Hope my logic is sound but I welcome any other CAGers chipping in here.   To be clear, did you pay Mint until you stopped paying or did you start to pay a debt collector after the account was passed to them?
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baycloves

Lowell Claim form - Provi Doorstep Loan online signup.

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Is this any better?  I've resigned myself to losing. Admittedly, I don't quite know what I'm doing. I just hope I get a remote hearing, that should save me some embarrassment. 

 

 

1) The Claimants pleaded case is that the Defendant entered into an agreement with Provident subsequently assigned to Vanquis Bank Limited under account reference xxx. 

 

2) It is admitted I have had financial dealings with Provident in the past. However, have no recollection of the alleged reference number the claimant refers to.

 

3) In February 2019 I made a formal written request to the Claimant for them to provide me with a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement as entitled to do so under sections 77 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. 

 

4) On the 21 June 2019 the Claimant sent a response which enclosed a reconstituted copy of an agreement, default notice, notice of assignment Provident to Vanquis, notice of assignment Vanquis to Lowell. [EXHIBIT x, x & x].

 

5) On 30/07/19, I received a claims form from the County Court Business Centre, Northampton, for the amount of £369.84. The claimant contends that the claim is for the sum of £369.84 in respect of monies owing under an alleged agreement with the account no xxxx  pursuant to The Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA).

 

6) Contained within the claimants particulars the claimant states that the account was subject to assignment from Provident to Vanquis. The claimant states a further assignment to them occurred on 12/06/2017 with notice given. 

 

7) It is denied notice of assignment from Provident to Vanquis and subsequently Vanquis to Lowell were ever received. 

 

8. The claimant states documents were received at both addresses. The claimant doesn’t appear able to confirm my address and therefore cannot say with certainty said documents were received. Furthermore, the client did not issue said documents and therefore cannot prove delivery.  

 

9) It is denied any communication took place with myself and Vanquis Bank Limited. Any alleged legal assignment to part of the “Fresh Start” initiative had not been informed. I have no previous knowledge.

 

10) Under the consumer credit act 2006, until debts have been repaid, there is an obligation to send statements and notices to the debtor at prescribed intervals at no more than 12 months. The statement should explain the money borrowed, money paid, interest in all cases and the outstanding amount. Consequences of failing to make repayments and the opportunity of making minimum payments should be informed. The Claimant has submitted a statement of accounts dated March 2019. This having followed my request for a credit consumer agreement. It is denied this document and any such required statement of accounts required under section 77A during the alleged agreement were ever received.

 

11) The claimant states that a default notice was issued on 18thJanuary 2017. The payment date requested by Vanquis Bank Limited on said document is  28thFebruary 2017. The formal Notice of Default that was accompanying this letter displays a requested payment date, 28thFebruary 2019. (Exhibit x, x)

 

12) I argue that this is not in fact a COPY of an original default notice, that they state was issued during February 2017, but that this is a fabricated version of a default notice created by Lowell. Either way the default notice was not issued by the assigned creditor (Vanquis).

 

13) It is therefore contended that the original creditor failed to serve a valid Default Notice pursuant to section 87(1) Service of a notice on the debtor or in accordance with section 88 (a “default notice ”) is necessary before the creditor or owner can become entitled, by reason of any breach by the debtor of a regulated agreement.

 

14) The Claimant states a default notice was not required. If there is a default in payments during the fixed term a default notice must be issued. The Claimant states they were informed a default notice was sent on 18thJanuary. The Claimants case relies upon being informed and does not constitute fact.

 

15) It is denied a default notice was ever received. 

 

16) It is admitted I responded to the Claimant’s pre-action protocol letter addressed in my name. I indicated I did not know if I owed the debt. I indicated as such having no recollection of affiliation with Vanquis nor Lowell. A default for the allege debt appearing on my credit file only November 2019. 

 

17) I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already written off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income.

 

As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights. This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information). The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party.

 

18) Under Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) Where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation. Therefore, it is expected that the Claimant be required to prove the allegation that the money is owed as claimed.

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I'm aware there are some grammatical and reference errors but the post expired before I could fix. I'd really like to know if I've made valid points or not. Thanks.

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I will check it through tomorrow for you baycloves


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some notes i've made tonight:

 

point 19..

go thru the claimants WS and note down the ws point number everytime and relation to which exhibited document they state that the document is a reconstituted version of what might of been sent ...not the original. i believe every document they rely upon are all reconstructed?


exhibit rc 1 the agreement
that is not an electronic sign up form...
its one you must sign and return and your sig is not on it?
you took out this loan at your home and the rep got you to sign a form or on an electronic device do you recall.

 

 

 

as for the default notice:

Default notices, litigation and section 127(3) of the Consumer Credit Act July 2010
.
 For a creditor to enforce a credit agreement against the debtor, 
he must serve the latter with a default notice, 
this notice must be served in accordance with section 88 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA).
.
 Generally, the prescribed form of a default notice according section 88 is as follows:
.
 "The default notice must be in the prescribed form and specify
.
 (a) the nature of the alleged breach;
 (b) if the breach is capable of remedy, what action is required to remedy it 
      and the date before which that action is to be taken;
 (c) if the breach is not capable of remedy, the sum (if any) required to be paid as compensation for the breach, 
     and the date before which it is to be paid."
.
 Section 127(3) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974
.
 Should the debtor be sued for the outstanding amount, 
it may be open to the debtor to raise an argument that the agreement is unenforceable 
because it does not comply with the requirements of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations.
.
 Agreements executed before 6 April 2007 are subject to sections 127 (3) & (4) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ('CCA'). 
Agreements entered into after that date are not by operation of the repeal under the Consumer Credit Act 2006.
.
 The effect of sections 127 (3) & (4) truly displays the paternalistic nature of the CCA, in that where a breach of a prescribed term under regulation 6 and schedule 6 to the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 is found, the agreement as a whole will be irredeemably unenforceable.
.
 In other words, the lender cannot enforce the agreement or realise any surety under that agreement; the debt in effect is written off.
 

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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I would go with the following....please feel free to amend or add.

 

WITNESS STATEMENT OF Baycloves.pdf

 

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We could do with some help from you.

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4 hours ago, Andyorch said:

I would go with the following....please feel free to amend or add.

 

WITNESS STATEMENT OF Baycloves.pdf 193.06 kB · 2 downloads

 

 

Thank you both so much. I've compiled everything and ready to ship out. I amended the default notice date at point 9 as it was 2017 but other than that, it reads perfectly well. I couldn't have possibly put this together myself but glad to see I made a few correct points. I now feel a fighting chance and will be more confident at the hearing. I will update soon 😊 

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Have things changed that much?

 

I thought Lowell were based in Leeds and not Jersey 

 

Also it seems they are only actually claiming arrears and my understanding is that if that is the case they do not need a DN  (Woodchester v Swain). That bit comes from a consumer credit blog so I can't say for sure.


Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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I've heard from the court and they have ordered the small claims hearing be converted to a dispute resolution hearing by telephone. Is this more like mediation?

Will I learn if I lost the case during this type of hearing or can this go on for longer?

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scan up the letter to PDF

 

dx

 


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group The National Consumer Service

 

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I've had my hearing this morning.

 

The judge transferred it to a telephone final hearing.

Lowell made a settlement offer of £300 which I refused.

 

I applied for application to submit further evidence or statement information which has to be sent before August 28th.

Lowell stated the incorrect date on the default notice is a typo.

 

I asked them to produce documentation regarding the Fresh Start initiative which they made note of.

The judge only had my witness statement and evidence.

 

With the extra information I'm allowed to submit do I send a new witness statement or can I add to the old one?

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How did you apply to submit further evidence ?


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The judge said I'd need to make an application so I asked if I could do it now and she gave me a date.

Lowell also requested the same thing, the guy said just in case.

 

Is it worth at this point submitting a really low offer to Lowell?

I'm not sure what else I have to add.

I can SAR Vanquis.

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Well your application fee will be £100....they have offered to settle at £300...the claim currently stands at £369.84.

 

If you dont know what to add why did you request permission to submit further ?


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I did not realise there was a fee?

The judge did not say there was a fee.

If I don't send anything will I still be charged? 

 

I didn't ask the judge mentioned it was something I could I do.

I simply stated I wanted to expand on the points in my witness statement.

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Not if you dont submit an N244.......if you wish to add further to your witness statement you submit a supplemental statement...which is free of charge but you must inform the claimant you intend to submit further.


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I only want to add further so it's a supplemental statement. 

Lowell don't want £369.84 they want £200 in fees also.

 

The judge pointed out it was higher than they would be awarded or something.

I think I will send a lower offer and point out the maximum I would be able to pay each month if they won the case. 

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From your first post .........

 

What is the total value of the claim? £369.84


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I think they said they were going after costs because of the non existent defence but of course they would say that wouldn't they.

 I suppose they will have to do something about the 'typo' on the DN


Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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Im only concerned with whats on the claim form at this stage......anything else is speculative until its been adjudged.


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I couldn't agree more- I was just trying to offer an explanation as to why they thought there were extra costs


Any opinion I give is from personal experience .

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Posted (edited)

I think I ruined my case.

 

Can Lowell use what I have said in an email as evidence?

I emailed them an offer of £100 and they made counter offer £325.

In the email I set out my supplemental statement and I said I made a local application to Provident.

Is this admittance of an agreement?

 

They responded with:

 

We refer to the above matter in which we act for the Claimant. 

 

With regards to reconstituted letters, the originals were sent to you, our witness evidence shows the number of documents sent and illustrate you failure to respond.

 

Your supplementary points are noted however the fact you entered an agreement with Provident is not in dispute.

The Vanquis Fresh Start is not a separate agreement and you made two payments one on the 7 December 2015 and one on 14 December 2015. Yes it may have been within the cooling period but you have not provided any evidence you wished to withdraw from the agreement. Furthermore you have not provided any evidence you paid back the loan to Provident or Vanquis. 

 

The documents have not been fabricated, we again state that despite any errors you may have found are from the documents provided. The default notice is not invalidated nor is it required as explained in the witness statement. 

 

Our client incurred costs not only attempting to contact you but also in issuing proceedings and instructing advocates to attend the hearing. Our client is not making any profit as it is just seeking to recover costs it has incurred in pursuing the debt. 

 

You mention not admitting or owing the debt however in the email below at supplement point 7 you clearly state “I made a local application to Provident”. We understand this as you admitted you entered into an agreement with Provident. 

 

We again invite you consider our client’s settlement offer.

As a further gesture of good will and our client’s willingness to settle our client is willing to accept £250.00 to settle the matter. 

 

I thought at this stage new evidence could not be submitted and it was just an email.

it is not my actual supplemental statement.

 

Can anyone advise the best thing to do now. I could probably scrape together £250 but it is a lot money to me at the moment. But I've really had enough. 

Edited by baycloves

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I'm not familiar with your case but two general points, if you really have had enough and you can afford to settle then do it.

 

And the fact that they are agreeing to increasingly lower settlements could be seen as a weakness and reluctance to go to the last stages And the other side will try and discourage and unsettle you right up the last seconds that's what they do

 

if you were confident only a month ago, what has actually changed since then to make you want to fold?

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That is a good point, they're increasingly offering lower settlements. I can't afford it but I could probably borrow it. They do a good job of discouraging people. If I send an email they turn it into admission of guilt. Up until this point I had avoided contacting them which is very good advice. I thought it was already clear I applied to Provident. 

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