CEL PCN Claimform - Tenerife Buildings, Station Road, South Gosforth, Newcastle NE3 1QD *** Claim Discontinued***

[brassnecked]

They must have pictures and they have to provide them, if they can't where is the basis of their claim.

[ericsbrother]

the lba doesnt fulfil the requirements of PAP but that will be a minor issue as you arent going to lose anyway.

Now CEL will probably fail to send the details of the claim in time but your hubby still has to do his bit or they win by default.

 

It doesnt matter that you were driving as this is not going to be admitted, ther main thing is they havent followed the POFA to create a keeper liability and their usual letters fail to be good enough to create ANY liability under the POFA so use of court is an abuse of process to boot.

 

They will drop the claim when it becomes apparent that it wil be robustly defended but until then hubby has to follow the rules and they are hoping he doesnt

[dx100uk]

pop up on the MCOL website detailed on the claimform.
.
 register as an individual
 note the long gateway number given
 then log in
.
 select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box.
.
 then using the details required from the claimform
.
 defend all
 leave jurisdiction unticked.
 click thru to the end
 confirm and exit MCOL.

 get that CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors [if one is not listed send to the claimant]

 

no need to sign anything
.
you DO NOT await the return of paperwork.
you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform [1 in the count]

[laluna88]

Thanks for your replies and sorry for the delay! 

Thank you so much for all your help with this, it's much appreciated. 
 

[dx100uk]

well get that previous post 28 done.

time is a tickin'

 

dx

[laluna88]

We've submitted the AOS via MCOL @dx100uk
 

I've attached the letter that we're going to send (minus the personal info etc). If you have time, would you mind checking that it is ok? I don't want to make any mistakes!

 

Thanks again and Happy New Year! 

CEL response letter.pdf

[dx100uk]

well you cant make a mistake simply copying a template we give.

send it to cel not a person.

 

dx

[laluna88]

Noted, thanks

[dx100uk]

do NOT miss your defence filing date no matter what does or doesn't happen/be returned 

[laluna88]

Sure.  

 

What is the best course of action for the defence? Some of the things mentioned by EricsBrother in post #27?

Very out of my depth here!

[dx100uk]

plenty of our std 2 - 5 line defences here already

 

just use our custom google search box

 

PCN Claimform

 

dx

 

[ericsbrother]

they will have snet the details by the time you need to send off you outline defence. If thye havent it is easy to compose somehting that states they have failed to show a cause for action against you by failing to submit the details of their claim as per CPR (whatever number) AND IN ANY CASE there was no contract offered to breach etc

[laluna88]

Hi there,

Happy New Year to you ll

 

Just a few things:

• We've still not had anything back since I sent the request of 13.14 letter but we have had the attached (POC).
• Can I just clarify what an N180 is and so I need to do one of these too? (read this on other posts)
• I'm going to start writing the defence now and have been reading a few posts on here for a suitable one, is this sufficient for this particular case please:

1. It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of the vehicle in question.

2. It is denied that the Claimant has complied with Schedule 4, Protection of Freedoms Act 2012; see paragraph 5.1a. The car park signs are owned by Civil Enforcement LTD. Under CPR 31.14 I have requested evidence of the claimants contract between CEL and the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with the public and make claims in their own name, and proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 2007.

3. It is denied that the Claimant entered into a contract with the Defendant. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was not contracted by the landowner to provide car-park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim. The proper Claimant is the landowner.

4. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

 

I have looked on Newcastle City Council's website and there's been no planning permission granted for that site, nor has an application ever been submitted from what I can tell. Also, the signage doesn't specify which businesses are included (as I mentioned before I ended up going into one business that is apparently not part of that car park even though it's on the same block). Should I mention that they've never sent any photographs of the car from the ANPR cameras?
 

As always, your help (and patience as I panic through this!!) is much appreciated. 

 

 

 

CEL latest letter.pdf

Edited January 13, 2020 by laluna88

[ericsbrother]

This is the problem with doing a google search for cut and paste examples.

I would never use this as it is outdated and no-one ever talks like this, use palin english where possible

[ericsbrother]

basic content OK though

[laluna88]

1 hour ago, ericsbrother said:

This is the problem with doing a google search for cut and paste examples.

I would never use this as it is outdated and no-one ever talks like this, use palin english where possible

 

Dx literally told me to do a google search on here for what to use. 

 

Apologies if this is frustrating as I can see that it is your bread and butter but as I mentioned before, I'm completely out of my depth here and I don't want to say anything that is either going to trip me up, or is just out right incorrect for this particular case. 

[dx100uk]

Now go read what i actually said...

[laluna88]

"just use our custom google search box"

Which I did. Am I missing something here?

[dx100uk]

well other than what EB has pointed out,, probably selected a very old thread with that in 

or else (like you} it was someone else that had bumped that defence to a more recent thread, when in all truth, it stems from a more length defence (hence ref to cut n paste) that was published here many years ago but is no long appropriate.

 

 

[laluna88]

Do you have a direct link to the suitable standard defences?

 

It took me quite a while to dig something out that I assumed would be suitable and I don’t want to waste everyone’s time here. This whole thing is stressful enough as it is, the last thing I want right now is to worry about what i’m posting 

[laluna88]

Please can you let me know if you're able to help, absolutely no problem if you can't though.

 

I need to file the defence by tomorrow lunch time at the latest as i'm being admitted into hospital for an ankle op tomorrow, won't be in any fit state after that so would like to get my ducks in line rather than palming the stress off on my husband.

 

Thank you.

[dx100uk]

https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=partner-pub-8889411648654839:3134625398&q=3 line defence pcn cel&oq=3 line defence pcn cel&gs_l=partner-generic.3...70057.79217.0.79530.22.22.0.0.0.0.147.1599.21j1.22.0.gsnos%2Cn%3D13...0.9189j11913773j22...1.34.partner-generic..22.0.0.NdsNsMDDTgw

[ericsbrother]

with CEL just saying that no keeper liability exists and their letters failed to creat ANY liability whatsoever under the POFA 2012.

In any case it is denied that any contract was offered at the time so no cause for action against the defendant or any other person.

 

You had a limited time to do this so fire off this or something pronto if you havent already.

I did say the sontent of your suggested defence was OK just write it in plain english but you seem to want to tie yourself in knots over this.

You are not a lawyer so noone expects you to speak in Latin or old French, you wont get clobbered for it

[laluna88]

I submitted something in time (it was due a few weeks ago now). 

 

CEL have sent this now - attached. It also included all the copies of letters sent to us with a photo of the car which was never ever sent up until this point. It also included the last page of the uploaded doc. 

 

Also, this first letter that is attached has our PCN number on it but the detail on the bottom of page 2 relates to a completely different vehicle for a different parking problem which isn’t ya. 

 

Any advice would be much appreciated.

new doc 2020-02-15 13.56.12_20200215145243.pdf

[dx100uk]

what date did you submit your defence 

and what did you file?

 

dx