Police Harrassment

[Cadbury10]

Hi,

 

I have experienced many problems with police harrassment & other problems with them... I have tried to do a SAR but have had problems doing that and from what I understand a fee of £10 is payable to each police force / county for records - Which I cannot afford and seems so difficult to obtain records... 

 

Is there any way I can obtain nationwide SAR records with only paying one fee?

 

I could not seem to find a relevant sub-forum to post this in - Is there an area on CAG for police complaints?

 

Many Thanks

[AndyOrch]

Moved to the appropriate forum......Sars are now free...no charge.

 

Andy

[Cadbury10]

Thank you for your reply Andy.... That's good that they are now free!

 

How do I go about doing this? I am currently in Cambridgeshire, but have had issues in several other counties and would like full & comprehensive records, without having to write to separate county forces... 

 

 

[Cadbury10]

I was given a telephone number for data protection department, but they never answer...

 

I think they have a SAR form too asking for 6 years of addresses, but I would like records going back further than that and can't remember addresses from many years ago and not even sure Police would have addresses on record from particular experiences... Is there a national Police database that would hold details relating just to name & DOB?... When requesting records do you have to specify which Police station / area for particular incident, or can you just ask for full records covering entire UK?

 

Does anyone know what kind of data/records can be obtained from Police? Is it possible to obtain all records from calls made to 101, 999, call recordings, files, allegations, other records, fingerprints, photographs, arrest records, case records, body cam footage etc.... How far back are records held?

 

Many Thanks

 

 

Edited July 29, 2019 by Cadbury10

[unclebulgaria67]

Why don't you call the Information commissioners Office (ICO) to obtain advice on this.

 

There are different rules in regard to Police records, when compared to say a Bank, because obviously with Police records they can keep relevant information for longer and still use it.  

 

As the issue you are raising is quite complicated, you might want contact the ICO first and then search online for organisations that help in regard to issues with the Police.

 

 

[Cadbury10]

Unclebulgaria - Thank you for your reply.

 

I have tried that before and didn't get very far - They have been quite unhelpful with helping with this.

 

From what I understand you have to request info from each police force / station as well, but just wondered if there was an easier way, and they also ask you to provide reference numbers and dates too for specific incidences, but I would like them to provide info on dates and incidences and officers involved etc... 

 

Are police records held separately at each Police station, or kept altogether under somebodies name/DOB?... 

 

Just trying to find out where I can send my SAR

[Cadbury10]

Sorry for the vague questions - Does anyone know what info exactly shows on a police database computer search when someones name / DOB / address is entered?...

 

Is there like a computerised file for each person and also paper records kept somewhere? 

 

Also, does anybody know why Police would be in a regular unmarked car, but in full police uniform?

 

 

 

 

[AndyOrch]

https://www.npcc.police.uk/FreedomofInformation/FOIandSubjectAccessRequests/FOIandSubjectAccessRequests.aspx

 

https://www.acro.police.uk/subject_access.aspx

[Cadbury10]

Thank you for the links - I've seen those before...

 

If I was to make a claim against the Police for harrassment relating to multiple incidences, would a separate claim have to be made to each separate area/police station/force, or can one claim be made to cover entire UK Police?

 

Has anyone had any experience of making successful claim of this nature? 

Edited July 29, 2019 by Cadbury10

[BazzaS]

9 hours ago, Cadbury10 said:

 

Also, does anybody know why Police would be in a regular unmarked car, but in full police uniform?

 

 

Depending on their role, there could be many reasons, including (but not limited to)

a) Local officers in a GP (General Purpose) car,

b) Roads Policing Unit officers in an unmarked car, so that (member of the public) drivers don’t know it is a police car until closer (so less likely to change their driving behaviour just because they see a police car).

 

The police have more exemptions from DSAR information release than most (for the catchall purpose of assisting with crime prevention) otherwise criminals could just keep applying for details on themselves [not that I am suggesting you are a criminal, but that is why the police have the extra exemption!], so you may not get the detail you seek.

 

https://www.askthe.police.uk/Content/Q87.htm

 

One application will yield the (releasable) info from PNC, but for “locally held” information you’d need to approach each individual service.

 

You’ve posted about harassment from your:

a) mortgage company (yet they are allowed to pursue you for non payment of mortgage for over a year),

b) utilities company (they are allowed to seek a warrant to fit a pre-pay meter if you haven’t advanced realistic proposals to pay your £300+ [and increasing] debt), and

c) car finance company, (again over non-payment).

 

It also depends what you feel is harassment, and if that meets the legal standard for harassment - the fact you feel distressed by it doesn’t mean it becomes harassment - it is if a reasonable ordinary person would feel the same, (most people would expect a mortgage company to attempt repossession after a year of non-payment, or an electricity company to seek a warrant to fit a pre-pay meter if someone showed no sign of an I/E that showed ability to repay an ever increasing debt, and had refused a pre-pay meter by agreement)

 

The devil is in the detail : Why do you feel each has moved from lawfully following up a debt and become harassment, and what has happened with the police (across numerous services, from what you have posted) that constitutes harassment?

 

A complaint to the office of the Police and Crime Commissioner for that service might be another way forward, though it would be worth ensuring others felt it was harassment, too, before making the complaint. 

[Cadbury10]

3 hours ago, BazzaS said:

the fact you feel distressed by it doesn’t mean it becomes harassment - it is if a reasonable ordinary person would feel the same, (most people would expect a mortgage company to attempt repossession after a year of non-payment,

 

The mortgage company commenced repossession action pretty much straight away - There had not been a year of non-payment.

 

The incident with the uniformed Police in unmarked car: 

 

I had received several phonecalls and voicemail messages on my phones from the Police, demanding that I attend a non-local Police station for interview. I did not like the tone of those messages and felt incredibly distressed by that, which came off the back of somebody making false, malicious allegations against me. I complained via 101 about the telephone calls and then, I think about 2-3 weeks later was visited at my home address by 2 male officers in unmarked car, which they used to block the entire entrance/exit to my property. 

 

They banged on my front door and spoke to me with contempt, in a threatening and intimidating manner, as I had made a complaint about a fellow officer and they questioned me in relation to allegations made by somebody and advised me that I was being recorded on body cam. He threatened me again when I started recording on my own phone. 

 

They were deliberately speaking very loudly and by now a crowd of people had gathered who could hear all of this information. The Police were mocking me also and I felt incredibly intimidated, threatened and distressed. They refused to take any details of my complaint against the party who had made the false allegations and reduced me to tears, before quickly scarpering back to their car. I believe they were there with the sole intention of causing me alarm & distress... Which they did.

 

I subsequently made a formal complaint about them and then further Police harrassment escalated from there...

 

I will add more info about other incidences as soon as I can  

Edited July 30, 2019 by Cadbury10

[BazzaS]

Looking at this from another viewpoint, what you are describing is:

An allegation was made against you, so the police are bound to consider it and investigate if there is reasonable suspicion an offence may have been committed.

They gave you the option of attending a police station. You chose not to, so they came to visit you.

 

You seem put out they came in an unmarked car. Surely that is preferable to a marked car in terms of your privacy.

 

If you were concerned as to the privacy aspect of being spoken to on your doorstep (& given you had already declined to attend the police station), why did you not invite them in?.

 

How would you wish them to proceed if  they needed to speak with you regarding an allegation, you hadn’t agreed to go to a police station, and you hadn’t invited them in?

[Cadbury10]

Bazza - Are you joking ?

 

You're comments seem to be quite judgmental to me and not really very helpful... 

 

I don't understand what you are aiming to achieve .

[honeybee13]

I think Bazza is trying to establish what you want to achieve. I haven't had very much to do with the police, but I'm a bit confused about how someone can have problems with several different forces.

 

You don't sound like a master criminal.

 

HB

[BazzaS]

What am I aiming to achieve? Clarity as to if your expectations of treatment (and desired outcome) are:

a) reasonable (where all efforts to help you should be made), or

b) unreasonable (for example complaining about an unmarked car being used, where you likely would complain more if they’d used a marked car!), (where people can decide how much effort to put in to help you based on the likelihood of realistic expectations of the police’s behaviour and realistic expectation of outcome).

You haven’t actually said what you want as an outcome, have you?

 

So, my question remains “How would you wish them to proceed if  they needed to speak with you regarding an allegation, you hadn’t agreed to go to a police station, and you hadn’t invited them in?”.

 

It isn’t an unreasonable question, and hopefully you can give a reasoned and reasonable answer...

Edited July 30, 2019 by BazzaS

[Cadbury10]

16 minutes ago, BazzaS said:

What am I aiming to achieve? Clarity as to if your expectations of treatment (and desired outcome)

 

Bazza, I tend to treat people how they treat me and expect a certain, reasonable level of respect... I don't expect, nor appreciate to be held accountable for other peoples' ignorance, malice, lack of common sense, lack of human decency etc.. (Not that I'm saying you lack common sense)..

 

I hope that is a sufficient response for you.

 

If somebody spits their dummy out at me because I am not meeting their unrealistic expectations, and treating me with disdain (not that I am saying you are doing that), then I am going to respond accordingly to that. Behaviour breeds behaviour...

 

I find your questions distracting and a little bit dressing and do not have the time, or energy to respond to some of your comments, which I feel, in any event, most likely would not be satisfactory for you.

 

All I can do is the best that I can to my own ability and have already stated that I intend to provide more information as and when I feel able to... I was initially asking for assistance with a SAR for this and I still feel your questioning is somewhat unclear and distracting and still do not understand what your intention is... I don't feel able, or inclined to answer your questions, which are confusing me and, amongst other things, I suffer from PTSD and you might get more answers if you approach me a bit differently, as you have come across to me as quite judgmental, and lacking in understanding of my posts.

 

It feels as though you are trying to pull apart my post, rather than offer any kind of support, helpful advice etc . 

[Cadbury10]

33 minutes ago, honeybee13 said:

I think Bazza is trying to establish what you want to achieve. I haven't had very much to do with the police, but I'm a bit confused about how someone can have problems with several different forces.

 

You don't sound like a master criminal.

 

HB

 

 

HB - Thank you... I'm glad I don't sound like a master criminal...

 

I am sorry if my post is confusing in any way, but will do my best to clarify when I am able to... 

 

Think I need to do a SAR, but not at all hopeful that I will get anywhere near what information I would like...

 

[Cadbury10]

Hi,

 

If I write a bullet point list of info I would like from Police, would anyone possibly be able to help me draft a SAR letter?.. Sorry to be so needy, but just cant think very clearly at the moment and will take me forever otherwise..

 

I would appreciate any help with this.

 

Many Thanks

[BazzaS]

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/how-do-i-make-a-subject-access-request

 

https://ico.org.uk/your-data-matters/your-right-of-access/

 

 

Letter template

[Your full address]

[Phone number]

[The date]

[Name and address of the organisation]

Dear Sir or Madam

Subject access request

[Your full name and address and any other details to help identify you and the data you want.]

Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law relating to: [give specific details of the data you want, for example:

• my personnel file
• emails between ‘person A’ and ‘person B’ (from 1 June 2017 to 1 Sept 2017)
• my medical records (between 2014 and 2017) held by ‘Dr C’ at ‘hospital D’
• CCTV camera situated at (‘location E’) on 23 May 2017 between 11am and 5pm
• copies of statements (between 2013 and 2017) held in account number xxxxx.]

If you need any more data from me, or a fee, please let me know as soon as possible. It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.

If you do not normally deal with these requests, please pass this letter to your DataProtection Officer, or relevant staff member. If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.

Yours faithfully

[Signature]

 

You can always say “all data held on me (on manual or electronic systems) that can be released” unless YOU can narrow down what YOU want, e.g. by timeframe, by interaction or type of data.

 

How can I (or any other respondent) tell what info you want released, give the paucity of detail of

a) events

b) what outcome you desire, that you have posted so far.

 

[Cadbury10]

Here is what info I would like from Police relating to me:

 

• Printed hardcopies of PNC records
• Copies of all computerised records
• Copies of all handwritten notes relating to me
• Dates, times, names of call handlers, details of calls, typed transcripts, outcome of call, for all calls made by me or about me to 101 and 999
• All case files / data / records relating to me dating back from birth to current date
• All documents, emails, data held, correspondence between Police & any other third party relating to me
• Copies of all internal records / emails / details of allegations made against me
• Arrest records, recordings of interviews, copies of mugshots, fingerprints, notes of dates, times and officers involved.
• All dashcam & Bodycam footage
• Full Details of my complaints made, who dealt with them and what was done about them
• Dates, times & names of all visits to my home address and purpose of visit
• Any other data, records, information held about me

Please could somebody also clarify if I would need to send SAR letter to each Police force individually (as some events happened in different counties), or if I can just send to one national Police address? 

 

Many Thanks

[BazzaS]

15 hours ago, BazzaS said:

 

https://www.askthe.police.uk/Content/Q87.htm

 

One application will yield the (releasable) info from PNC, but for “locally held” information you’d need to approach each individual service.

 

 

As above, previously answered.

[Cadbury10]

I forgot to add to my bullet point list:

 

• Reference numbers/dates for all reports made by me, or involving me, whether made by phone or in station and full details of handling officer/s and what was done about each (some occasions I have not been provided with any reference).
• Full case records including witness statements and all other data from every single Police station / force / county in the UK.
• If any of above records not available, a full explanation why and/or certificate of destruction 

I don't feel my wording is very good - Would really appreciate if anyone can help draft full letter... otherwise may never get around to it...

 

Does anyone know if certain records / files get archived or sent to a national Police office after certain period of time, or are records stored actually in individual stations forever?

[Cadbury10]

Hi,

 

I'm hoping someone could tell me if a file of specific Police case from decades ago would be held in the individual Police station that were responsible for it, or if the case papers would be archived / stored somewhere else?

 

Many Thanks

[BazzaS]

Decades ago? !

 

Was it part of a major enquiry?

Of significant public interest?

Resulted in a Crown Court prosecution? 

Edited July 31, 2019 by BazzaS

[Cadbury10]

Bazza - About 25-30 years ago...

 

Yes, yes and yes... A prosecution against the Police for their utter incompetence involving a Police/court case which was escalated to Crown court and tore my family apart.. The Police were given a severe telling off for their incompetence and mis-handling, which caused so much trauma to my family, to say the least...

 

I just want to know where all of the paper records would be held now, so that I am not on a wild goose chase to get copies of them