VCS ANPR PCN Claimform - overstay - St Marys Gate Retail Park sheffield

[dx100uk]

might be worth finding the original council planning permission as bet parking is not limited to one hour when granted originally and no-one can change that

least of all a powerless PPC.

[Browntrout]

Dx this was explored years ago at this site and no time limits were in the original planning documents 

[andythepandy93]

If the time limit isn't in the original planning documents, does that mean that they can't enforce the 1hr time limit?

 

Could someone point me to some reading that I could inform myself with?

 

I've been searching the Sheffield planning portal with the search terms of "vcs", "excel" and "marys gate" and I can't find any application in relation to signage in the car park

 

[dx100uk]

BT please post proof of what you state

 

Dx

[Browntrout]

Dx100

This was many years ago. The planning documenta for this site are not online but they are available at sheffield city council offices by appointment

 

However none of the above has any effect on signage acceptance, offer, performance in this case so i would not personally waste your time but you are of course free to go to the council offices.

 

[honeybee13]

So how would you suggest approaching this case, BT?

 

HB

[Browntrout]

HB sorry i did type out a reply on my phone earlier but it didnt post

 

Well given the situation D is in, i would initially get in contact with the land agent/business/land owner and see what their initial response is to see if they can get the claim withdrawn.

Social media can help

 

If that didnt work then i have very successfully got Court Claims withdrawn from the likes of Parking Eye To CarFlow Ltd by threatening to involve the landowner.  

 

Now this takes a large amount of outrageous bluff, but (and this is case specific)  threatening the use of a witness summons (ok would need a witness summary on application, but again this is just bluff) to force the attendant of a site employee etc  to appear at a county court hearing works wonders on many occasions (if the case warrants it)

[dx100uk]

so an even bigger gamble than sticking to the 2 or 3 line defence used here then...

[Browntrout]

No not at all, involving landowners etc has no negative affects on any court cases and can only have a positive effect

[andythepandy93]

How do we go about finding the landowners?

 

The shop the car park was servicing was Staples, however this store has now closed. I can't imagine they were the landowners however....

[Browntrout]

Oh right didnt realise that,i think quite a few of them closed some time ago come to think of it

You can do a land registry search, costs about £3 using the .gov website

[andythepandy93]

Yeah looking now it seems that maybe all stores have closed...

Shall I do a land registry search now?

[Browntrout]

Yes you can do a map search if the address doesnt come just make sure you use the official land registry search. 

 

Its only a few £ so worth a punt, of course you can find out for free by going in and ask who the current agent is, but then that involves hassle

[andythepandy93]

Okay I have the document, not sure I should shared publicly(?), so what's the best way for me to share

 

ok to publish here 

use pdf

 

Seems to have very new owners

 

 

For reference, I believe the carpark to be within the red outline on the document, outside the front of the pink shaded building, kind of where it shows a wide Ellin Street. 

 

Here is the carpark from google maps (https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3734665,-1.4745247,127m/data=!3m1!1e3)

 

 

the same view without satellite view on:

 

pixs +RegisterPlanSYK352880 (1).pdf

[ericsbrother]

phone the Nottingham office of the Lnad Registry and ask them who the previous owners were as this is normally on the docs so you are entitled to ask.

The company that owns it now is just a front co for someone else, like the 25 others with a similar name, usually overseas investors but it i listed as non trading so VCS cant have a legal contract with them

[andythepandy93]

Will do that today when I get into work and report back here

 

Just spoke to them on the phone, they said that any documents requested online will show the title deeds as they currently stand. to find historic documents/previous owners I need to fill out the £7 postal application. Should I proceed with that?

 

I'm aware that the request for this document will probably take quite a long time between sending of the form and actually receiving it, so is this a path worth pursuing?

[dx100uk]

yes do it tomorrow

disclosure stage could be weeks away yet.

 

dx

 

[andythepandy93]

part of the form says:

 

Quote

 

Indicate how many copies of each [document] are required and insert the required date:

 

I apply for:

 

<QUANTITY> copy(ies) of the last historical edition of the register for <DATE>

<QUANTITY> copy(ies) of the last historical edition of the title plan for <DATE>

<QUANTITY> copy(ies) of every historical edition of the register for <DATE>

<QUANTITY> copy(ies) of every historical edition of the title plan for <DATE>

 

 

what do I fill in?

 

figured it out, form is posted

[ericsbrother]

dot forget to print off your receipts so you can bill VCS for them . If they drop the clai yu ask the court for a costs order cos of their unreasonable behaviour and include thsi along with your research time costs of 5 hours @£19.50 an hour. More of that later

[andythepandy93]

Thanks - yeah, am keeping all records!

[ericsbrother]

also, you can pay for stuff over the phone and get it posted. I have never suffered a delay when doing so and I am also surprised that the person taking your call wasnt more helpful. Perhaps times ahve changed and it is all about the money money money

[andythepandy93]

So have just hit the 10 day mark. What are we hoping to happen, and what kind of defence do I need to prepare for submission by the 12th Aug latest?

[Browntrout]

Hoping to happen?

 

This WILL 99.9% go to a hearing, this being VCS it doesnt matter where in the country they will send reps to attend a hearing. (unlike certainly companies if you use an address for service many miles away they will discontinue)  So you will certainly end up at a hearing (if Sheffield is your local court your are looking at December at the earliest looking at how cases are being booked at the moment

 

Defence wise, keep it concise.  your defence points will (as you outed yourself as the driver) will rest on landowner/contractual authority and signage, although knowing this site thats not really a strong argument

 

Also the £60 add on charge can be argued as an abuse of process.  claims have started to be kicked out because of this, although this is now subject to an appeal in the coming months

[andythepandy93]

Quote

Hoping to happen?

Was meaning are we hoping to have VCS withdraw it before it reaches a hearing.

 

Could you explain the £60 add on thing? Have just been reading about the case you mentioned before however I don't see anything about addons.

 

I know live in London, so Sheffield is not my local court. Do I have to attend, or do I just submit my defence and it'll get decided on the day and I'll be notified?

[Browntrout]

No you MUST attend, it will get allocated to your local london court, if you work, it may or may not be easier to select the county court to your work place, when you get an "allocation questionnaire"  (if you want it by your work place, then put the court name down and why, if your home court then just state the closest court to your home

 

London courts you will be looking end of January at the earliest

 

VCS will NOT withdraw this case.