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Not sure if this is the right forum, please move if not.

 

I was told off this afternoon for parking in a close that had no yellow lines, or any other colour. One of the residents told me that it was under the control of a private parking company and that I would get fined if I did it again (I know they can't fine me, only invoice)

 

I pointed out to him that the road sign does not say it is a private road but he just said it was 'complicated'

 

I've checked on my local Council highways and it says the road is not publicly maintained but I'm not sure what this means. Does it mean a private company can issue tickets?

 

Thank you.

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yes

 


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3 minutes ago, dx100uk said:

yes

 

Lol, short and sweet dx.

 

Thank you.

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Longer answer is:- Yes provided that they comply with certain conditions, such as a notice at the point of entry from the public highway outlining terms and conditions for parking. Display details of the PPC contracted to enforce such conditions etc Details of location would help.


My time as a Police Officer and subsequently time working within the Motor Trade gives me certain insights into the problems that consumers may encounter.

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Thank you.

I won't be able to go there for a while to take a picture of the signage but here is a street view of the Close in question. There doesn't appear to be any sign at the entrance from the public highway.

Baron Close.png

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 I doubt if there is a parking co operating there and the resident is just telling you a story to make you go away.

 

There are several well known places where private roads near to railway stations have people racing to park there before going to work causing all sorts of problems with the residents and some of them take it upon themselves to stick notices on the cars but these have no legal basis.

 

Now in your case there is no notices offering a contract to park so you can park there regardless of what the irate local says.

The "complicated" bit may be that no-one can give a parking co the authority to manage the land because there isnt a single owner of it. many of the back alleys of terraced houses in large towns and cities have this issue, not the councils res;ponsibility but used by the public for so long that rights are conferred upon the users

 

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Hi Ericsbrother,

There are some signs there as I saw them yesterday when I went down there. I have attached 4 photo's but unfortunately I can't read the writing on them from the photo's, as I said, it will be some time before I can go there again.

 

However, from what Gick wrote, there are no signs at the point of entry so I assume I can park in that little lay-by on the right without fear.

 

Sorry to be a pain but parking in that area is so difficult when one wants to pop into the local shop for just a few minutes and I can't see that parking there causes any problems.

 

I'll have to send two more pics in a separate post.

 

 

 

 

 

pixs.pdf

 

Hopefully I've done it correctly. Apologies if not.

jpg2pdf.pdf

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thread tidied


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Hi,

 

Just wondering if there are any thoughts on the legitimacy of these signs.

 

Thanks.

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the crappy signs damn them more than they think because they offer an open contract to park that is counter to the earlier wording but makes no indication of how you can pay the money. This makes it an unfair contract.

 

The lack of a mention for which Trade Association they belong to means the signs aren't valid anyway so if they apply to the DVLA for a keeper details request they are breaking the law

 

If I lived nearby I would expect the signs to disappear and end up on a bonfire on the nearest allotment.

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Thank you very much ericsbrother. I will pass this on to the residents of that Close, hopefully they do not pay that company for the privilege of having those signs.

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When I approached the person that told me off for parking, I informed him of your comments above.

 

He has now come back to me with a reference to a court case brought by the parking company where the parking company won.

 

I note that this was nearly 5 years ago so perhaps the rules have changed since then.

 

https://combinedparkingsolutions.com/downloads/odonnell.pdf

 

Thanks.

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The case they have given you is relevant only in so far as the judge decided that the there was clear signage that the driver would have seen (the car was parked immediately in front of the sign) and that the sign was sufficient to create a contract.

 

TBH the defendant in the case (who appears to have been the Keeper not the Driver, he didn't identify the Driver) does not seem to have been very clued up on parking law. There was no discussion about whether the PPC had followed correct procedures nor whether the signage was compliant with POFA.

 

judge seems to have accepted the signage as compliant when the defendant raised no challenge or objection to it. So the case tells you nothing about whether the signage in your case is compliant.

 

It was suggested earlier that the signage must be at the point of entry to the area but I'm not sure if that is correct in your context, ie it's a private road. That's different to the requirement for signage when entering an actual car park. One of the experts here may be able to advise you on that.

 

You haven't been given a PCN yet have you? To ask the obvious question, now that you have found that it is signed as private parking wouldn't it be better to park somewhere else than to wait until you do get a PCN and then start arguing with the PPC about whether the signage is compliant?

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Thank you for your reply.

 

You are correct in that I haven't been given a PCN and I am not in the habit of parking on private property. However, at the time I did there was nowhere else to park and I knew I was only going to be a few minutes so I took the liberty. I fully respect the residents of that Close to be free of random parking outside their properties, I certainly wouldn't like it if I lived there.

 

On the other hand, as a Parish Councillor for that area, it concerns me if those same residents are being hoodwinked by CPS into thinking that they are protected when they are not. The resident concerned won't tell me if they pay CPS or whether CPS give them a percentage of any charges they receive.

 

I suppose I've become poacher turned gamekeeper haven't I?

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Posted (edited)

been hmm, you do seem to want help the residents of the Close from being exploited by CPS when it appears that they don't want your help, they just want you to park somewhere else!

 

I don't think it has established CPS's parking controls would be illegal or ineffective, but I'm not an expert. Even if they are ineffective is it part of a Parish Councillor's role to save people from themselves if they don't want to be saved ?🙂

Edited by Ethel Street

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Sorry, but  they do want to be saved from themselves, they are as ignorant of the intricacies of private parking law as I am. They do not want people parking in their small Close but on the other hand, if they want  proper management then it has to be management that is enforceable. This is why I was asking if the CPS signs were effective. The chap who originally spoke to me has since recognised that I am actually trying to help rather than just wanting somewhere to park.

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Posted (edited)

I net that resident was given that as part fo the selling spiel. there are hundreds of thousends of private parking cases that hit the courts but few of them  create a precedenta nd those that have or are cited as being persuasive are well known.  This isnt one of them.

As a paris councillor you could do your duty and remove the rubbish from the hedgerow that someone had dumped there without permission. if the residnet involed complains make him apply for planning permission to have signs put there at his own expense and to bear in mind that there will be objections and costs to consider

 

In short, they either get it right or they get lost

Edited by ericsbrother

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