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Laura Cooke

Car Insurance Claiming I Misled Them And Requesting Payment

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2 Years ago I added my daughter to my policy, the car was at my daughter`s and had it`s driver side window smashed one evening, my daughter who suffers with depression was afraid to stay at home due to a controlling ex partner finding out her new address so suspected him of the damage, I was going away so she went to stay with friends.  A claim was not made for this as her insurance was already expensive.

 

We taped the window up for a temporary measure, whilst I was away a neighbour a friend of mine contacted me to say the cover was off and the car was wet inside, I let my daughter know and she came back to the house and taped it up again, she forgot her handbag with her phone and a small amount of cash when she left again,  she could not get a lift back till a few days later, her car had gone and the house had been entered but not broke into the catch on the conservatory had been messed with so whoever had got in could go in and out, my daughter discovered a mans jacket on the back of a dining chair.  Her handbag and it`s contents had gone and her car keys off the key board.

 

I rang 101 numerous times and was in a long queue, then when I did eventually get through I was told I could not report the car as taken it had to be my daughter,  I contacted our local PC told him everything he said he would make sure it was recorded,  daughters ex partner gave her the car but nothing relating to ownership was in my daughters name. 

 

I was contacted by my daughters friend about everything,  as soon as I got home I had got an answer phone message off the Police stating the car had been abandoned on a side street in town with the window down. (This puzzled me as the window was totally out not down)

 

I met with the Police officer who had left me an answer phone message she stated that the car had been involved in an incident, the insurance also asked me what had gone off neither myself or my daughter could state much other than we suspected her ex partner might have been the culprit. My daughter did not ring the Police I did she rarely engages with anyone, despite requesting a crime reference number none was forth coming. The insurers sent someone to interview me and my daughter.

 

The insurers kept mentioning a different date to the Police I assumed one or the other had the date wrong, fast forward to last month which is over 2 years since this incident and I received a letter from the insurers stating neither me or my daughter had a financial interest in the vehicle and that in their opinion I misled them to get them to pay out on the claim, they said any insurances I may be included in within their group would be cancelled, we never made a claim as neither of us owned the car we don`t know who the registered keeper is. The insurers stated that the Police have no knowledge of the incident being reported to them.

 

I contacted my local PC recently he said he would send daughter the incident number (I assume this is the crime reference number?) and he stated it was not marked down as a theft but an incident. He said the confusion is that there were 2 incidents involving the car which were a day apart, the incident I received an answer phone message about from the Police is incident number 2 the incident the insurers are on about is incident number 1 which took place in a different County to where we live I have no idea what this incident was,   how could I have reported incident number 1 when I had no knowledge about it,  I just assumed the Police & Insurers had their dates conflicted. I inquired as to if I could make a claim from the legal cover the insurers stated under the circumstances I cannot do this.

 

I told the insurers I refuted their findings and told them to look at things again a few days later they said they stand by their decision and because they had to pay out storage and other things they want just over a £1,000 off me. Now they have changed their standing that I never reported the incident to the Police to that of I never mentioned no theft.

 

I would like some advice as to what I can do I object most strongly to paying this and to be labelled a liar as such, I have drove for over 30 + years not claimed and never been in trouble for anything the insurers are labelling me and it is very unfair. It is not so much that the payment they are requesting is upsetting me but they are make accusations about my good name.

 

I cannot afford a solicitor I contacted my local Law Centre they stated they do not deal with this kind of thing, I am bitter about it all especially with this bill they are requesting I am disabled and do not work,  yet if I do not pay it I assume I will then have my details passed to a debt collector and I have an excellent credit record.

 

Any advice would be much appreciated, I wondered if contacting the Ombudsman would help matters? as the insurers said they have said the last word on the matter I have made a Sars request from the insurers. 

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So you insured a car for which you did not know who the registered keeper was and a car which you had no financial interest in ?

 

if this is the case, then you gave  wrong information when taking out the Insurance. When you take out Insurance, they ask you whether you own the car, is it regstered in your name. If you said no, they would not have insured you.

 

Ask the Insurers for a copy of the declaration and policy information you agreed when taking out the policy.  See if you told the Insurers wrong information.

 

Because you have seemingly taken out Insurance in a  careless way, then the Insurers are entitled to cancel all Insurances in your name and yes you would be liable for the sums the Insurers have had to pay. When you Insure a vehicle, you make the Insurers liable under the Road Traffic Act legislation. 

 

Remember that your details are now likely to be recorded on an anti fraud database and this will cause you problems with other Insurances you may have. So when you come to renew your own Car and Home Insurances you will have to tell Insurers about this cancellation of Insurance. They are then likely to refuse you Insurance and you will then have difficulty arranging affordable Insurance elsewhere.

 

If you suffer from mental health and your Doctors can support this in writing, it may be worth asking the Insurers to consider this. If your health has caused you to be confused about the Insurance arrangements, then you may find the Insurance company more helpful. The debt will still exist, but they might remove any fraud marker and provide a letter which accepts you made a mistake when arranging Insurance. This would help you in regard to obtaining affordable alternative Insurance.

 

I am sorry if this was not what you wanted to hear, but is an honest response to what you have said in your post.


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I think unclebulgaria is probably right, but is it really true that you can't insure* a car if you are neither the owner nor the Registered Keeper?  I would have thought this must happen a lot.  (Of course, the situation would need to be explained fully to the insurer when taking out the policy).

 

If someone gives you a car as a "gift", does that mean you have no insurable interest?

 

*May have misunderstood - I think uncle is saying you can't insure if you don't know who the RK is - seems fair enough

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9 hours ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

So you insured a car for which you did not know who the registered keeper was and a car which you had no financial interest in ?

 

if this is the case, then you gave  wrong information when taking out the Insurance. When you take out Insurance, they ask you whether you own the car, is it regstered in your name. If you said no, they would not have insured you.

 

Ask the Insurers for a copy of the declaration and policy information you agreed when taking out the policy.  See if you told the Insurers wrong information.

 

Because you have seemingly taken out Insurance in a  careless way, then the Insurers are entitled to cancel all Insurances in your name and yes you would be liable for the sums the Insurers have had to pay. When you Insure a vehicle, you make the Insurers liable under the Road Traffic Act legislation. 

 

Remember that your details are now likely to be recorded on an anti fraud database and this will cause you problems with other Insurances you may have. So when you come to renew your own Car and Home Insurances you will have to tell Insurers about this cancellation of Insurance. They are then likely to refuse you Insurance and you will then have difficulty arranging affordable Insurance elsewhere.

 

If you suffer from mental health and your Doctors can support this in writing, it may be worth asking the Insurers to consider this. If your health has caused you to be confused about the Insurance arrangements, then you may find the Insurance company more helpful. The debt will still exist, but they might remove any fraud marker and provide a letter which accepts you made a mistake when arranging Insurance. This would help you in regard to obtaining affordable alternative Insurance.

 

I am sorry if this was not what you wanted to hear, but is an honest response to what you have said in your post.

I appreciate the response my daughter as always sorted the insurance out online I have no idea what was filled in but I have requested a Sars I assume this will show me what was put down.

Yes I do have depression so does my daughter but I can hardly use that as an excuse when it wasn`t me gave the details to the insurance my daughter has been with this company a long while.

I agreed to adding her to the insurance as she said it made it cheaper for her but I wish I had never agreed to this, it is not her good name in question it is mine.

Looks like I have no choice but to pay this then, like I said previously it is not so much as the sum I have to pay but my good name put into question.

I just wish I could get someone legally minded to try and explain things to the insurers on my behalf.

Things have become quite strained in my relationship with my daughter through no fault of my own I now have this hanging over me.

It is strange that I never had to sign anything and have never seen any insurance documents all I know it was fully comprehensive.

The car was gifted to my daughter by a former partner a few weeks later the partner left my daughter and he has ignored all contact since, daughter assumed paper work would arrive in her name it never has.

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Some insurers ask if you are the owner or the registered keeper and you can be either/or to have an insurable interest.  Presumably if someone is gifted a car then they are the owner.  The part of your story which will cause a problem is that you say you 'added her to the insurance'.  If you mean you added her to your insurance to save money even though it was her car and she was the only or main driver then that's known as fronting.  It's fraud and it's illegal.

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What happened to the car? Who has it now?

 

Did insurers explain why it has taken them 2 years to come back to you about this?

Edited by Ethel Street

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You always have to remember that an Insurance policy is a legal contract you are entering into or amending.

 

Would you really let someone else alter your legal contract, without you knowing what they had entered ?

 

Which is why I asked the question about mental health ?  I am not convinced that someone with a clear mind, would allow a relative who also suffers from mental health, to have access to their Insurance online, to take out Insurance in their name, with the relative as a named driver.  And to then think that there was nothing wrong with this.

 

I am not going to repeat the issues which I have posted about earlier and others have added to.

 

Given that you are now likely to be marked on an anti fraud list and face problems getting affordable Insurance, it may be advisable for you to consider that your health was a factor in this and to try to at least explain this to the Insurers to help you move on from this.

 

Nb.  Most Insurances don't allow people to Insure a vehicle they don't own as there is no financial interest. Also not having the registration changed to be the registered keeper, is not accepted by Insurers.  Insurers take on responsibility under Road Traffic acts for third party claims and therefore they need to be fully aware of the risk they are taking on.


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45 minutes ago, Ethel Street said:

What happened to the car? Who has it now?

 

Did insurers explain why it has taken them 2 years to come back to you about this?

It was taken from outside my daughters home it is explained above it was involved in an accident I believe and wrote off I simply do not fully know as I was told very little about anything 

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34 minutes ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

You always have to remember that an Insurance policy is a legal contract you are entering into or amending.

 

Would you really let someone else alter your legal contract, without you knowing what they had entered ?

 

Which is why I asked the question about mental health ?  I am not convinced that someone with a clear mind, would allow a relative who also suffers from mental health, to have access to their Insurance online, to take out Insurance in their name, with the relative as a named driver.  And to then think that there was nothing wrong with this.

 

I am not going to repeat the issues which I have posted about earlier and others have added to.

 

Given that you are now likely to be marked on an anti fraud list and face problems getting affordable Insurance, it may be advisable for you to consider that your health was a factor in this and to try to at least explain this to the Insurers to help you move on from this.

 

Nb.  Most Insurances don't allow people to Insure a vehicle they don't own as there is no financial interest. Also not having the registration changed to be the registered keeper, is not accepted by Insurers.  Insurers take on responsibility under Road Traffic acts for third party claims and therefore they need to be fully aware of the risk they are taking on.

I know nothing at all about insurance I have not had my own vehicle to insure in around 10 years I initially took out insurance for my daughter, her vehicle needed lots of repairs she swapped it and just swapped the details of the vehicle she had gifted to her. 

 

I apologise if I seem a bit ignorant of things but I am, I am nearly pension age I am not up on legal things, insurance or anything similar my daughter has dealt with lots for me in the past.

 

I was not aware of anything that you have now clearly explained to me, especially what this financial interest thing meant, I never knew you had to purchase the car to be classed as owning a vehicle to insure it,  I assumed like my daughter did that she did own this vehicle even though she never purchased it, ( If someone buys you something would you not declare to be the owner?) my daughter gave her former partners details to the insurers to see if the vehicle was in his name though he is a non driver, we gave them lots of information and assumed we had done everything right hence why I have not heard a thing in 2 years. No one was was more shocked than me to receive a letter out of the blue about this insurance.

 

I did not intentionally do anything wrong but you have revealed to me how insurance works so I know now I have done wrong. I suppose I have to accept this and learn from it, I have never had a claim for car insurance or knowingly ever done anything wrong not even a speeding ticket so of course this as really affected me, I have to accept the findings and learn to live with my error of Judgement, I am so frustrated with myself for finding myself in this position.

 

Thank you for your advice Uncle Bulgaria and others who have responded to this thread at the moment I feel humiliated and very low about all this I never thought at my time of life to be in this position, I have always tried hard to do things right I really have messed up big time and have only myself to blame.

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1 hour ago, hightail said:

Some insurers ask if you are the owner or the registered keeper and you can be either/or to have an insurable interest.  Presumably if someone is gifted a car then they are the owner.  The part of your story which will cause a problem is that you say you 'added her to the insurance'.  If you mean you added her to your insurance to save money even though it was her car and she was the only or main driver then that's known as fronting.  It's fraud and it's illegal.

I never knew this my daughter asked me if I could add her to my insurance she said it would keep the cost down, this is why I could not understand why they kept speaking to me about things, I think it should have been the other way round my daughter insure and add me this was done wrong but not intentionally I had no idea there was two ways of doing it, I told the truth that the vehicle was my daughters and parked at her home why did someone not pull me up on anything, surely if you have not intentionally done anything this is not still fraud?

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If you answered their questions honestly that's probably why they've not gone after you for fronting and they've chosen a different route to recoup their money.  You say your daughter dealt with the insurance in the first place, it's a hard lesson learned that you shouldn't let other people do anything in your name.

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53 minutes ago, hightail said:

If you answered their questions honestly that's probably why they've not gone after you for fronting and they've chosen a different route to recoup their money.  You say your daughter dealt with the insurance in the first place, it's a hard lesson learned that you shouldn't let other people do anything in your name.

Yes it is a hard lesson learnt you cannot start to understand how I feel an unblemished reputation in tatters, I cannot believe I have ended up in this mess more concerned about my good name than any money I will have to pay. Right or wrong a lot of parents who little understand the internet let children do things for them but as you say it is a hard lesson learned most definitely in my case I could not feel any worse than I already do

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2 hours ago, Ethel Street said:

What happened to the car? Who has it now?

 

Did insurers explain why it has taken them 2 years to come back to you about this?

They said enquiries to DVLA and the Police have taken time it was like a bolt out the blue to get that letter I have been so upset since I feel humiliated that in 60 years I have done everything by the book and not had so much as a parking ticket to end up being addressed like a criminal

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The Insurers don't know you as a person. They only know you by the information that has been provided.

 

If the information is wrong, the Insurers will treat you the same as anyone else, in the same situation.

 

As I have said, what has happened cannot be changed. All you can do now is explain to the Insurers how the wrong information was provided and about your situation. The cancellation due to wrong information will stand and the debt will still exist. But the Insurers may be willing to make a note and not treat you as someone who has deliberately given wrong information.

 

 


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