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    • The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim vague and are generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.   1. Paragraphs 1 is noted and accepted that the Defendant has in the past had financial dealings with  Vanquis.I do not recall the precise details or agreement and have sought verification from the claimant and the claimants solicitor by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request who are yet to fully comply.   2. Paragraph 2 is denied. The claimant pleads that the defendant failed to maintain the required payment, arrears began to accrue. Given that the claimant has failed to comply with my CPR 31.14 request and failed to evidence such fact and would not be in a position as Assignee of debt to know the details of any alleged breach. The defendant has never received a Default Notice from the original creditor. As the claimants plead in their particulars precise knowledge of the default, they are put to strict proof to evidence such fact.   3. Paragraph 3 is denied.The Defendant contends that no notice of assignment pursuant to s.136 of the Law of Property Act & s.82 A of the CCA1974 has ever been served by the Claimant as alleged or at all.   4. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant, the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of assignment/balance/breach requested by CPR 31. 14, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to:   (a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement; and (b) show and evidence any cause of action and service of a Default Notice or termination notice; and (c) show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and (d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;   5. After receiving this claim I requested by way of a CPR 31.14 request and a section 78 request for copies of any documents referred to within the Claimants' particulars to establish what the claim is for. To date they have failed to comply to my CPR 31.14 request and also my section 78 request and remain in default with regards to this request.   6. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.   7. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974.   8. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.
    • I will get my son to upload the video when he gets in. No down hill slope just a small  gradient and from the turning he came out of its maybe 15 shops until the traffic lights. Maybe it didn't get faster but he feels like it did (not clear on the video)  I'm picking him up from work tonight I'll pay attention to the gradient when I go back.   He'd only changed up to 2nd so he wasn't driving fast    Upside he knows now to always be prepared for ice  
    • Not sure why you keep changing your point 1 back to .....   1. The Claimant claims £2247.91 is owed under a regulated consumer credit account under reference xxxxxxx. I do not recall the precise details or agreement and have sought verification from the claimant and the claimants solicitor by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request who are yet to fully comply.   1. Paragraphs 1 is noted and accepted that the Defendant has in the past had financial dealings with  Vanquis.I do not recall the precise details or agreement and have sought verification from the claimant and the claimants solicitor by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request who are yet to fully comply.   We you the court the claimant already knows ......The Claimant claims £2247.91 is owed under a regulated consumer credit account under reference xxxxxxx. its on the claim form.   Keep it as post #59 add post #66 renumber job done.
    • Hi all   Update, so they still have not provided any statements/documents etc regarding the account (I have the original SAR though) and since the beginning of October I have received a letter stating that they believe the debit is not SB because a payment of £340 was made April/May 2014 (this is credit and refund mentioned earlier in the thread). They have so far not received the statements etc from the bank but will forward them on due course, but if I should contact them to arrange a payment plan.   I have since had a offer of a 50% settlement and then last week a 75% settlement. My view is that they are just hoping I will bite and pay them something but that is not going to happen, I have not communicated to them since that single telephone conversation back in July.   The one thing I have noticed when I use Check My File is that the account status was changed November 7th to Query at Equifax, even though the default expired on November 4th so it should have disappeared by now. The original Satans Bank default was removed on time, but the Cabot account reference is still there albeit not negatively impacting my score it just has a status of 'Q' against November and the balance showing. There is no history showing before November it almost looks like a new account was setup with a Query status against it.   Does anybody have any idea of what is going on here? The cynical side of my is thinking they are forcing me to get in touch with them in writing about the account before their incorrectly perceived April/May SB date passes. I know Equifax does take longer for updates compared to the others agencies and in a few weeks it may be gone.   I'm just wondering what peoples views are, personally my credit score is almost in the excellent bracket and I'm not planning to get any credit soon so it makes no difference to me for now.
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syfodyas

British Gas and Moorcroft hell after Ombudsman

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Hello everyone.

Following a divorce around 10 years go, I was left with some bad debt and several defaults.

Since then i have worked to clear as many as possible and all my defaults today have dropped off.

I actually have 'good credit' again.

Unfortunately British Gas have put a spanner in the works. 
They supplied my electricity 2014 - 2017.

My monthly payment amount was initially £78, rising to £100.

Then out of the blue they demanded £275 a month!

 

I live in a two bedroom flat with no central heating!

I queried this and they made me do several burn tests and arranged for an engineer to check the meter.

This look forever as the engineer missed several appointments.

In the interim BG had instructed me to pay whatever i could manage, so I kept it at £100 a month via standing order.

 

The situation was not resolved as their customer services often did not call me back,

at one point i received a letter from Moorcroft demanding money.

 

I would remind British Gas that the complaint was still in progress and they would take the account back and leave me alone while scheduling their next set of tests.

I got so fed up i went to the Energy Ombudsman and raised a complaint about the shoddy customer service.


While the ombudsman was investigating, I decided to change my energy supplier.

BG issued me a final bill of £600 and i was upset, telling the ombudsman this was incorrect

- as BG had told me upon issuing that bill that their tests had shown my day/night readings to be back to front, and to expect a revised bill that should significantly reduce the balance.


in the middle of the ombudsman investigation (and within three months of my new supplier)I received a revised bill alright, for £1900!

I complained, the account was frozen due to the ombudsman investigation.

 

The final outcome was that the ombudsman though the balance was probably correct, but called out British gas for shocking customer service and serving erroneous bills. They demanded BG pay me £200 compensation, write a letter of apology, offer a reasonable payment plan and remove any negative markers that may appear on my credit file.

I told the ombudsman that while I am committed to a resolution I still thought the balance was incorrect, as i pay only £108 a month with my new supplier.

I also informed them that I suffer from anxiety and take medication for it, and this process was negatively affecting my health.

I asked them to have someone else look into the amount.


I received (about a couple months later) an email from them stating that someone else looked into it but could not recommend differently, that their original recommendations were no longer binding and it is up to BG and i to reach a resolution. I was provided a copy of their original recommendations in writing.
Foolishly i got distracted with.. life and waited assuming BG would contact me. They didn't.

 

About a year later which brings us to yesterday I received a letter from Moorcroft demanding £1900.

I contacted them and they said they had no information about the ombudsman process and just the balance, that the debt was not purchased by them and that they were working on behalf of BG.


I called BG and they refused to speak to me, stating everything should go through moorcroft and that they were unwilling to even raise a complain for me.

I asked if they had added a default to my credit file (i was working so hard to repair it and buy a house next year) to which they replied

- 'probably' and could not confirm.

I have checked my file on credit karma, experian and equifax and nothing shows. However im scared they will serve a default.

 

Note i received no notice or even communication from BG since the ombudsman decision.
I contacted the ombudsman again who claimed that when I grumbled further about the balance it was taken as declining their recommendations, therefore they are no longer binding, and that there was nothing else I could do via them as the case was closed. I couldn't even open a new case.

I contacted BG again and really argued, I said I wanted to complain that BG made no attempt to liase with me, and went straight to moorcroft.

I asked that the debt be returned to them and that an arrangement made based on the ombudsman decision.

After a long hold I was told that the debt had returned to them and to expect a call on Tuesday while their system refreshes.

Where do I stand with this and how do I avoid a default that would set me back 6 years!

I have worked hard to repair my file and my various other accounts are in excellent order,

Do you think BG will accept a full and final to make this go away?

(i'll pay the original £600 bill upfront but can't shell out £1900 up front).

What should I ask for?

I fell lost angry and confused.

Thanks in advance for your suggestions

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This is all a bit involved and I don't fully understand it yet.

What I do understand was that there was a day and night metre reversal – which is not uncommon. This was discovered but instead of providing you with a lower bill as one might expect, they provide you with a higher bill. You haven't commented on this or explain why this might be. It is contrary to any logic.

While we try to work out what the story is, you should begin by sending an SAR to British Gas and also to the ombudsman. Get them both off in the post tomorrow.

Follow the SAR link to see how to deal with the papers when they eventually arrive

 

Also, although you say that they were supplying your energy from 2014 to 2017, can you tell us when the bills started to become unreasonably high?

Presumably a new meter  had been put in place because you don't seem to be suggesting that the bills have been wrong throughout the period.


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Frankly it would be a helpful if you could restate the story again but this time in a bullet pointed chronology – missing out a lot of the narrative.


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Hi.

Thanks for replying.

I have no idea why the other bill was higher , I still think its incorrect.

BG claim it was a catchup bill because my new energy supplier gave them my latest meter readings on the switchover date

 

. I argued with the ombudsman that BG never did fix the reversed readings issue (hence the continued high bill) however they claim they did.

 

I do have the Ombudsman report. Should i attach it? It's quite comprehensive.

 

The bills became very high from late 2016. No new meter put in place, but my new supplier charges me £108 a month and i give regular meter readings.

 

Im certain BG had the readings swapped around but never implemented the correction.

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Please could you address the request that I made in post number three.

Also, send off the SAR's. These are essential.


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  • Moved into current home in 2014. quoted £74 per month in electricity charges which was paid via DD.
  • May 2016 charges jumped to £250 per month which i disputed.
  • Provide numerous meter readings to BG and arrangement for engineer visit.
  • June 2016, BG stated balance was £1,161 which translated to a payment of £223 per month  I disputed and set up a Standing Order Mandate of £100 to cover charges until matter resolved.
  • June 2016 Engineer confirmed that meter readings were ‘probably’ transposed  and could not install a second test meter  (in case of fault) because of lack of space.
  • July 2016 I chased BG on status. BG claimed complaint had been closed, was told it would be reopened with a deadlock letter sent immediately due to being messed around, so I could go to ombudsman should I choose. Was told another engineer visit was necessary as previous left inadequate notes.
  • October 2016 - second engineer appointment scheduled but did not show up. I gave up on chasing the complaint as I was diagnosed with stress and anxiety at the time. BG did not contact me further.
  • September 2017 I began complaint again, asked to do a burn test and told by BG that meter reedings were indeed transposed and as result had been overcharged. I informed that I wished to change energy supplier and a final bill would be provided. BG confirmed balance to be £1106.22 prior to readjustments. When i received final bill it was for £660 which I assumed was the readjusted amount.
  • December 2017 - Opened case with energy ombudsman as i thought final bill was still too high and customer service dreadful.
  • December 2018  - Ombudsman case continuing, BG send a revised Final Bill for £1963.83. I add this to my ombudsman complaint.
  • April 2018 - Ombudsman reaches decision claiming second BG bill is ‘likely correct’ and recommends..
    • They agree a reasonable repayment plan
    • £200 Compensation
    • They remove any negative markers from credit file
    • They write letter of apology

 

  • April 2018 - I tell ombudsman i still dispute bill of £1963 and want it looked into by someone else. I inform my stress/anxiety worsening and ask for my partner to be copied into future correspondence.
  • May 2018 - Ombudsman email my partner and state that their position unchanged, they attach pdf of their original recommendations and state that as I dispute amount, their decision is no longer binding and up to me to resolve with BG when they get in contact.

 

  • Long gap i know, but.. life.
  • 26th June 2019 - Letter received from Moorcroft demanding £1951.83. Moorcroft they have not purchased debt from BG but acting for them.
  • 27th June 2019 - BG initially refuse to discuss case with me and refer to Moorcroft. Cannot provide straight answer as to whether my credit file has been adversely affected. After some pleading they agreed to take the debt back from moorcroft and somebody will contact me on Tuesday to discuss a payment plan.

 

  • Still no confirmation regarding my credit file. No default notice received to my address, and file looks clear on credit karma, experian and equifax. I fear a looming default and want to prevent this as have plans for a mortgage next year.

 

So that's a SAR to BG and the Ombudsman?

What about Moorcroft?

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Thank you. That's very helpful.

Could you just tell us which date the account was closed and you move to a new provider. Which is the new provider?

No point in sending an SAR to Moorcroft. British Gas and the ombudsman should be all you need.

Are you aware of the back billing rules which prevent an energy supplier, attempting to bill retrospectively further than 12 months. This is come up in another energy case which I am helping on this forum somewhere although I can't remember where. I have suggested there that implied in the back billing rules that the billing must be accurate and that if they attempt to impose bills which are inaccurate for any reason, and that does not interrupt the passing of the 12 months.

Although there are other reasons for objecting to the bill which you have received, I think it would be reasonable to call in aid the back billing rules and to say that there hasn't been any valid bill. However, we will have to get the evidence which shows that they accept that the bill was incorrect.

How much of this do you have in writing?


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Little tip

ignore moorcroft!!

 

powerless to the end

 

Dx


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Please check through this thread to see if I discussed back billing rules in relation to an implied provision that the bill be accurate

 

 


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September (22nd I think) 2017 was the date of the switch.

New Provider is Flow.

First Final Bill was sent then, and the 'revised' one February 2018

 

Not much in writing at all.

I have the two bills in writing,

 I have notes from phone calls and

I have what the ombudsman deduced was correct

- they even say the billing was misleading.

 

Problem is the ombudsman claim BG revised bill was correct  

Question about SARs, do I have to send a fee with my letter?

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So you don't have the admission that you referred to earlier of British Gas agreeing that the bill was incorrect? How was this admission made?


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Phone call.

I have the exact dates and the person’s name I spoke to though.

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So presumably you never record your calls. Big fail.

Please read our customer services guide and implement the advice there


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I didn’t then but I do now.

none the less the ombudsman seemed to verify and confirm in their report that those calls took place

 

British Gas have agreed to take the date back from Moorcroft and will call me Tuesday to discuss a payment plan (I recorded that confirmation).

 

so any tips on how to deal with them then?

i basicly want the £200 compensation and the removal of any credit file markers as the ombudsman recommend, however I still don’t believe the full balance is correct.

 

should I offer to pay the original £600 amount there and then as a full and final? I can do it, just not any higher.

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During that 2014 to 2017 period, did you have an immersion heater permanently switched on to provide constant hot water on demand ?

 

if you did, with all other electricity usage, then your monthly usage would be quite high ?

 

Do you ever have someone look at your electricity usage ? Did they check what appliances you were using ?


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sar is free


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

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9 hours ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

During that 2014 to 2017 period, did you have an immersion heater permanently switched on to provide constant hot water on demand ?

 

if you did, with all other electricity usage, then your monthly usage would be quite high ?

 

Do you ever have someone look at your electricity usage ? Did they check what appliances you were using ?

 

Yes, these are very important questions. Maybe you can comment.

I think that you really need to get the information which will be disclosed in an SAR. I'm not sure it is possible to move forward without getting a much better picture – hopefully the full picture of what has happened.

 

Is at this thread that I saw a note saying that Moorcroft had returned the file to British Gas for the moment? I don't seem to see it any more


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Yes this is the case.

I convinced BG to return the debt to themselves.

Probably truth is it was always with them as Moorcroft claim the debt was never sold off.

 

16 hours ago, BankFodder said:

During that 2014 to 2017 period, did you have an immersion heater permanently switched on to provide constant hot water on demand ?

 

if you did, with all other electricity usage, then your monthly usage would be quite high ?

I Don’t buy this because I’ve been with my new supplier for a year and have gone out of my way to give regular readings, it’s been £108 a month which is much more reasonable than BG suggested towards the end 

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Okay. We are  just into speculation now. Send the SAR's.

In the meantime, now that you are recording your calls I suggest that you might start having regular telephone conversations with British Gas simply to steer the conversation around and see what is revealed. You will speak with several different customer service people – none of them will know the history of your case – or even care about you – but you will tend to find that they say different things and maybe you will get some useful evidence.


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Posted (edited)

I have just received an email from British Gas pretty much rejecting the SAR request!  Telling me the debt is with Moorcroft and I should chase them!

 

 

Edited by syfodyas

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what does your comment pretty much mean?

copy it here minus pers info please

 

you ignore Moorcroft and only deal with their stated client.


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I’ve posted it here with the formatting in tact. Yes they use different text sizes and type faces all over the place. Cut and paste obviously with shockingly broken English.

 

I’ve not moved at all. I used the template on here.

Your reply from British Gas- 8010651970.pdf

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so did you simply email? our sar template or did you adapt it?

 

you've obv moved since then so did you include a CTAX copy too?

 

 


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

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They are nuts.

 

 

 

 


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where did you send that?

sounds like they didn't understand what an sar was..


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

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