UKCPM/Gladstones MNPR PCN claimform - operator pictures - 93-101 GREENFIELD ROAD LONDON E1 1EJ - ignored everything to date - *** Claim Dismissed***

[Amis95]

Hi @Ericsbrother, 

 

unfortunately for me, I have already went and hand delivered the WS just now to the court

I will try to dig into these points in my skeleton argument as I already mentioned the points in my WS, may be able to elaborate further.  yes, point 32 means exactly that as explained in the paragraphs above it.

I have the costs schedule  ready as you mentioned. 

 

thank you so much for all the support you guys gave me.

 

I am still waiting for a response to the SAR and a WS from Gladys.

[ericsbrother]

as for documents like the POFA and Beavis decision

you make copies and take them along,

 

you have already referred to them so you will be forgiven for not doing so

( explain that in parking matters they are so well known you expected the claimant to have used them in their bundle as they refer to them in threatograms!)

 

write up your costs and present it on the day.

 

The idea is that it shows you havent just made up something on the hoof,

some judges wil reject part of the costs anyway but will then give you the same money for loss of pay.

[Amis95]

Hi Guys, 
I received a witness statement from UK CPM over the weekend.

A few issues noticed already:
1. Jack Chapman is the Witness  and it looks like a electronic signature 
2. Gladys letter says they are not attending court
3. they are referring the defendant (me) as the driver but showed no evidence that I am the driver
4. no mention of POFA so no show of evidence that I am the driver and no evidence how they can claim against the keeper
5. a pdf document of the signage was provided so no pictures that there was even a sign on that day
6. they only have the two pics of the back of the car so nothing else to show if there is a driver inside, or a valid permit is actually displayed or not. 

I am starting on the Skeleton Argument so will share this with you soon. I have until the 2nd of Jan to do it. 

thanks for the support as always. 

UK CPM witness statement.pdf

[dx100uk]

read it properly..it doesn't say gladdy's are not attending.. it says 'our client' - well their client is the claimant, one and the same.

 

jb from the 'claimant company' has written the ws , so if HE doesn't turn up in court, the WS is for want of a differing phrase 'inadmissible evidence' as you can't question him upon it's validity. 

 

their sign pix are not, they are a template of what they should look like.

 

there is no proof the contract signed between the lease holder in 2016 giving rights to ukpcs has been paid in 2018.

 

with regard to the contract T&C's.... are the leaseholder covered by GDPR to even handle your data? I'e photo your car being wrongly parked?

 

 

 

 

[lookinforinfo]

Interesting that their sign states that payment by card is £1.50. Surcharges have been against the Law since last year.

[Amis95]

Thanks for all the feedback guys, will share skeleton argument shortly. do I need to send the skeleton argument to gladys too? or just emailing court is enough?

[Amis95]

Hi Guys, 

beginning to feel a bit exhausted with the amount of researching and writing. here's my best shot of the skeleton argument:

 

Have deleted WS  saved it as PDF for you and uploaded it to your post, is better to post any important docs as pdf, then only Registered and signed in Caggers can read them.

 

WSArmis.pdf

[Amis95]

Thank you so much really appreciate it.

 

I am planning to send it on Friday to the court

 

I am not sure if posting to Glady's will be too late as the court date is Monday.

shall I call them and ask for a email address?

 

any feedback on the skeleton argument will be greatly appreciated. 

[ericsbrother]

You shpuld have got this in the post 14 days ago but no you dotn ask for their email address you use a afx service to send it.

 

With regard to surcharges then S62 of the CRA applies- unfair clause equals the whole contract is void UNLESS you show that you accept it.

 

You can still talk about this and the fact tat they have identified you as the driver when you arent and thus question their cause for action against you. I would state the name of the driver if the judge asks you it may well have been my next door neighbour who died last month for all anyone knows- they wont want to go to the expense of starting all overa again even if that was the case.

[Amis95]

Hi @ericsbrother

Thank you for the feedback. All noted for my additional script in the court.

[ericsbrother]

always worth reading from a script when talking if possible. Have been told off once for not providing copy beforehand in my evidence but that was more about time saving rather than the right to do so or the content

[Amis95]

Hi all,
So it's time, I have all the paperwork ready in a bundle including the evidence of documents sent to all parties. My hearing is at 2pm tomorrow so will let you know of the outcome tomorrow evening. 
Just want to say a massive thank you for all the support, would have not been able to come this far without you.

[dx100uk]

just remember

no little chats before you go in with them

they'll try I expect

smile..walk away..

 

dx

 

[honeybee13]

Good luck tomorrow, I'll be thinking of you.

HB

[brassnecked]

Good luck

[FTMDave]

Smash the fleecers!

[Amis95]

Hi guys,

 

You probably already guessed the outcome of this already, yes I won!!!!!! The judge ripped their rep apart and I didn’t have to say anything to be honest. That was awesome! 

 

So, here is how it went.

 

Surprised but not surprised, they did send a young girl to represent them. I went to the court half an hour early, dressed smart (made a difference), and reported to the reception. She heard me say my name so came and approached me. Then she said let me find a meeting room, and went off to find one. When she came back, I asked for what? She said we can have a chat, I replied no need, I am clear on everything. So she sat next to me in awkward silence.

 

Luckily, we didn’t have to wait for long. The judge from the beginning was very friendly with me and explained procedure and confirmed documents. She complimented the fact that documents were very well organized. I knew I hand delivered my WS to the wrong court as I had two letters with two court addresses. Luckily, she explained it works under one umbrella, to my relieve!

 

For some reason she didn’t get my skeleton argument, but she said she was sure I sent it. So she gave us 5 min to read it and then asked me if there was anything else I need to say. I just made my main points clear so the judge asked the claimant for their story.

 

The poor girl started to waffle through it only to be stopped straight away and asked to explain about Jack Chapman signature. So she sent us out giving the rep a chance to call and find answer.

 

We came back, the rep couldn’t reply clearly, so the judge (unsatisfied) asked her to continue. She went on to the landlord contract to which the judge stopped her again and asked who is the landlord, again failed to answer.

 

The judge also said the £60 in not lawful and claimant rep said they no longer are seeking it (so only the £100).

 

The rep carried on to the signage and after further waffle, judge stopped her again and said stop referring me as the driver because I clearly said I am not the driver and you have provided no evidence of it.

 

The judge then said, your pictures isn’t enough to prove that the car is parked and your WS says the breach is - no valid permit and parking outside of designated bay but the Jack’s WS doesn’t mention this. You took a picture of the back of the car so no evidence of valid permit, and no marking on the floor (the judge laughed out load at the rep, saying sorry but this not your fault and your Witness is not here to answer this).  I think you and I know your own WS has been your own failure so I don’t need to listen to the defendant any further so I am going to dismiss the claim. The rep tried to say I ambushed and said they didn’t receive it so I pulled out an email from Glady confirming receipt and also the email to court. As we were leaving the court room, the judge did warn the rep about the signature of Jack and said I am seeing more and more of these.

 

So there you go, a simple point I made about the fact that we can question if the car is parked, and taking a picture of the back of the car, which is not in a bay was enough. The judge said even if everything else is correct, all signage, keeper liability etc, she was not satisfied with Jacks WS and burden of proof is always on the claimant.

 

It was a bizarre experienced really, I wanted to say so much, but the judge ripped the rep apart on her own points instead while I am sitting there smiling the whole time. A very enjoyable experience. I was awarded £225 for the claimant’s unreasonable behavior and by that time the rep was finished to argue my schedule of costs.

 

So, we walked out, she took my bank details, and sat on the phone arguing with someone about what the judge said. She was clearly getting a earful by the sound of it. I rubbed it in a little more and said hope your day gets better

 

This is all thanks to you guys! I can’t imagine anyone doing this without the forums and the information you guys set out. Thank you so much!!!!!

[ericsbrother]

Brilliant!

Esp glad you got the unreasonabe behaviour costs order

I bet the rep want even a solicitor so shouldnt have been allowed to speak in the first place as she wasnt a direct employee of Gladdys or the bandits.

still, it will make her think about wanting to take on a claim that can only end in humiliation and that will be another court Gladdys wont contest anything at.

 

[honeybee13]

You've made my day - well done! I'll alter your thread title.

 

HB

[FTMDave]

Well done!

[dx100uk]

excellent ws too.

will be a good template for others.

 

well done CAG 

 

please consider a donation to keep us here..

 

dx

 

 

 

[brassnecked]

Absolutely superb, significant point to take from this is the Judges seems to be on to them with the RobOclaim almost mailmerge style WS emanating from PPC's.

[Amis95]

On 07/01/2020 at 08:05, brassnecked said:

Absolutely superb, significant point to take from this is the Judges seems to be on to them with the RobOclaim almost mailmerge style WS emanating from PPC's.

 

yes, there are quite a few points to note here actually that I felt the Judge pressed hard - 

- name of landlord wasn't on the contract so the judge didn't accept it. she asked number of times but rep coudn't say the name so she admitted fault

- Jack Chapman's signature and template, confusing witness statement

- keeper liability can only be sought by POFA and they didn't use it so Judge Shanti wasn't having any of it trying to pursue the keeper without knowing the driver.

- The unlawful £60 to which the rep quickly dismissed and said will only be seeking the £100

- clear picture of the front of the car which shows not displaying valid permit and car in a marked bay

- pictures of signage on the day, everytime the rep talked about signage the judge rubbed it in by saying 'signage that should look like, not your template'

- they always use the 'ambush' way out so, taking evidence of emails, posts are very important.

 

thank you guys!  

 

[Amis95]

Hi Guys,
after my win, I posted on my Facebook regarding it to make others aware.

 

A mate immediately contacted for help as he has a court hearing on this Tuesday (14th).

UKCPM and Gladys at it again.

He was depressed and was about to give up.

 

I went to his house last night and spent 3-4 hours looking at what he has done to date and where he made mistakes (many).

He admitted he was the driver, why he parked etc and wrote up a long defence copying and pasting stuff from google.
He didn't do a witness statement either and offered £50 through mediation which they refused.

 

I reviewed UKCPM WS and low and behold, Mr Jack and his fake signeture (SRA complaint sent).

I also couldn't believe how incompetent they are as they made a schoolboy error and shot themselves with their own statement.

 

They put that the signs went up, leasholder agreement signed and resident permits were handed out in Feb 19 but the PCN was from July 18. their whole WS about breach of contract is dead in the water.

I picked these points up and wrote him a decent Skeleton Argument.

However,

as my mate admitted number of things like he was the driver, he parked, signs weren't good enough etc,

what chance does he still have without a WS? (UKCPM had signs up illegally at the time and only went formal with an agreement in Feb 19, and they used to pay a resident £10 for each incident)

Can I ask, would I be able to turn up with him and speak on his behalf as he is very scared?

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

I think it would be better to start a new thread for your friend and post up the questions and your answers from the forum sticky please. His case won't be exactly like yours, with the best will in the world.

 

HB