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    • dx100uk   You are absolutely correct. That's exactly what the wording is! And if that's the case then - happy days for me! However, I thought that:   1. This wording meant the conveyancing solicitor had to tell the council that the house was about to be sold so they were aware!   But you are saying that the council only needs to be informed AFTER the house has been sold? Can I tell the council that? [I think I've seen something on the internet that says I can, rather than the CS] Or do I need the conveyancing solicitor to contact the council?   2. That this wording wasn't a restriction K [as I'd looked at Schedule 4 of the Standard Forms of Restriction] and tried to match my wording to those listed - and thought restriction K was the closest.   3. That this was a non-standard restriction [and that's what the Land Registry told me too and that the restriction was not a Restriction K!!! [see extract below]   Please remember that when applying for a restriction not in standard form: it must always contain the words ‘is to be completed by  registration’ rather than ‘is to be registered’. This will serve to make the effect of the restriction clear. The term ‘registered’, where used in any of the standard form restrictions, means the completion of a registrable disposition by complying with the relevant registration requirements prescribed in Schedule 2 to the Land Registration Act 2002 (rule 91(3) of the Land Registration Rules 2003), but this statutory definition only applies to standard form restrictions. Please note that we will not accept restrictions not in standard form for registration that contain the words ‘is to be registered’ So I'm confused now. IF it is a restriction K - then the conveyancing solicitor doesn't have to do anything and I can let the council know. It seems it is dependent on the wording 'completed by registration' and 'is to be registered'??? Below is copied from Martin's MSE.  This relies again on the 'is to be registered' whereas my wording is ' completed by registration' which you say is restriction K and LR says is not.   I need to go to sleep now!   Thanks dx.   Extract from MSE below.   If your property is jointly owned a creditor will not be able to obtain a CO against you, they can only get what is called a restriction. The laws on Restrictions are totally different to Orders, the most important being there is NO OBLIGATION for you to pay any of the proceeds of the sale to the creditor. However, during the whole court process you go through the reference from all parties (especially the creditor) will be to charging order and NOT to restriction. This is done in order to decieve you believing you are stuck with a CO. However, not all solicitors are aware of the law in this regard and it is important that you raise this point with them in the first instance before proceeding with them Quote: Restriction The restriction which can be entered on the register where a charging order is made against one of joint proprietors is in the following form :- No disposition of the registered estate is to be registered without a certificate signed by the applicant for registration or his conveyancer that written notice of the disposition was given to [name of person with the benefit of the charging order] at [address for service], being the person with the benefit of /I]an interim[I/I]a final[I charging order on the beneficial interest of (name of judgment debtor) made by the (name of court) on (date) (Court reference.…).        
    • Hi Tony,   Please ensure YF does NOT acknowledge any debt  when confirming their new address.   They should simply state, " Please note my new address, as shown above."   Do not say anything about "a debt owed", or "the money you are chasing."   Do nothing that resets the SB Clock - ie acknowledging the debt and causing probs for the next 6 years. 
    • you ring you bank    
    • i suspect the charge on the Land registry site against the house reads:   2. (XX.XX.2007) RESTRICTION: No disposition of the registered estate is to be completed by registration without a certificate signed by the applicant or his conveyancer that written notice of the disposition was given to XX Council at P.O. Box XX, STREET, TOWN, POSTCODE, being the person with the benefit of a Charge under Section 22 of the Health and Social Services and Social Security Adjudications Act 1983.   ..............   that is a restriction k and is useless to the council, as all 'legally' your have to do is inform them AFTER the house has been sold . then it's too late money has gone.   dx
    • I have got a copy of the charge. The Land Registry responded to say that the document attached to the RX1 was as follows. The A4 document headed 'Health and Social Services and Social Security Adjudications Act 1983 and National Health Service and Community Care Act 1990' is a statutory charge. However as the person concerned (your late father) was one of joint proprietors of the property, the charge could not be registered or noted. Instead it was protected by registration of a restriction.   This is a statutory charge that has arisen under section 22 of the Health and Social Services and Social Security Adjudications Act 1983.   Unfortunately the Land Registry blog was discontinued on 30 June 2020 [I only found out today!] they're waiting for a new platform which could take a few weeks - so I haven't been able to obtain any other advice, other than what I found in the Hardwick and co website today which stated that S22 of HASSA had been repealed and stated that    After 1 April 2015 a Local Authority will only be able to recover unpaid care home fees by securing a judgment debt either in the County Court or the High Court (s69(1) of the Act). and The Act increases the time limit for the recovery of a debt comprising of unpaid care home fees from three years to six years from the date the sum becomes due   hence I thought that as the fees had not been paid and more than 3 years had elapsed that perhaps the charge was no longer extant?    If the restriction is such that the CS only has to notify the council [and there's no restriction on me selling] then I thought the sale could proceed while I continue to battle it out with the council. Who haven't been in touch now since 2016.   This is all very complicated - I'm sure it could be simplified!!   Thank you      
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red11

Engage Credit SAR request ignored

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I to am with ecl and have been for acouple of years,sold to them by oakwood home loans,i to have large fees,costs, charges, e.c.t,one thing they do which they should not is to charge you additional interest and lnclude it in your monthly payment when this shold be added to your total balance.allso when the mortgage was transfered an early settlement fee was added to the account £9k so they charge you interest on this during the loan term, i am at the moment chalenging these and other charges with the ombudsman service. I think engage have been set up to make as much money from charges costs and extra interest before selling us on to an other company. I have been told by the citz advice it would be easier to do this with a block of people rather than on my own (how could we do this)

 

i have a similar story to your own and am happy to add my name to the list for "group action". would CAG be prepared to publicise this issue on their twitter account?

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Hi there, we have had the same problem with Engage, they took us to court in Dec 2011 they tried to get a repossession order. Thankfully they made a false statement on the court papers and the case was thrown out. Everything has been ok since then the court set our payments at CMI plus £50 for arrears as our term is 22yrs it the arrears would be paid off in 13yrs. We pay £600 as it was easier to round up the payments. We pay by bank transfer, in Sept 2012 the payment didn't go through, we didn't notice until we got a letter about the arrears, called them said what had happened, and paid double next payment. We then got a letter saying that they accepted the new agreement and would review it in 3 mths, they have twisted the situation to try and start charging us arrears fees etc they have now asked us to fill out financial expenditure forms. We won't do this as last time they manipulated the figures to suit themselves, obviously they have made the usual threat of legal action. I would rather go to court again as we have done noyhing wrong they are just trying to get more money from us. We would add our names to a group action against this dreadful bunch of Sharks.

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i'm due in court in a month's time

 

attempted to reach an agreeable repayment plan but ecl issued an application without notice - have also passed my complaint to the ombudsman. would appreciate examples of similar cases that i can cite (in court and to ombudsman) as evidence of ecl's true motives, ie. to unnecessarily repossess properties and plunder equity

 

(1)the connection between future mortgages/citibank and ecl, (2)adding unreasonable charges to accounts in arrears, (3)premature/unfair repossession hearings and (4)details of court decisions will all be helpful - i'm happy to feed back my progress and assist those following me on the conveyor-belt

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We also have a mortgage with Future Mortgages, which is due to be repaid in September 2013. Within the last three years I have had an accident and work which resulted in my losing my job and my husband was made redundant. We are both now nearing retirement age and have been unable to keep up the mortgage payments for the last three months. We have struggled on my incapacity benefit and his small private pension which gives us an income of less than a £1000 per month. As a result of not being able to keep up the endowment insurance payments this has now lapsed and we are unable to pay the outstanding amount. We had hoped to sell the house and pay off the debt. We have not yet been informed that they have sold the debt but are extremely worried. We think that we may have a buyer but if the offer is below the outstanding mortgage what do we do? We have had to move out of the house as we are unable to pay the high cost of heating and community charge and are presently staying with relatives.

Any advice would be very welcome.

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Hi, I also used to be with Future Mortgages and they sold my mortgage on to Engage Credit. I've been out of work about a year because I have a brain tumour and am undergoing treatment. Engage Credit have even asked for my medical records which i have unwillingly given them. The DWP is paying the interest and with some help from my parents i've just started paying £170 which leaves me £130 a month short. I didn't pay anything extra for a year so I have considerable arrears (especially will all the extra charges and interest) and to pay this is leaving me with next to nothing to live on. I have been trying for about 6 months to get them to look at going to interest only or capitialise my arrears or extend the term of the mortgage. Anything to reduce the monthly payment so I could do what they wanted and pay my mothly payment and reduce the arrears. They have said its unaffordable because I am on ESA even though all options would be significantly cheaper than I'm paying now. I've even had a letter from my doctor saying I should be able to return to work within 6 months and they said it wasn't a guarrantee and then admitted it wasn't possible to give a guarrantee but they still expected it. Their communication has been terrible and I can't get proper reasons for why they won't try and find a soultion. I've had to ask and ask to get anything in writing. While all this was going on they started court proceedings and i thought we were still trying to find a solution. I feel like a lot of the time they have been utterly inhuman. I desperately want to stay in my house, at least till i'm well, but its like they've just made their mind up and won't consider anything else. I've had one hearing and its been adjourned till the end of the month as the judge wanted some more information but I don't hold out a lot of hope as he's alrady prettty much said don't expect too much. I managed to get hold of an independant report Engage Credit had done (with a bit of a fight) and it states they have broken FSA guidelines on Treating Customers Fairly, broken internal guidelines on vunerable customers and not looked at rehabilitation strategies. I also found out that their Litigation Manager has been checking my LinkedIn profile and when challenged admitted she'd been googling me ' to verify information' - what the hell she expected to find on google about me I have no idea but I'm half expecting to find someone outside me house following me to the hospital of the supermarket! I've raised a complaint with the FSA and sent a copy of my letter to the director of the company and my MP who's been trying to help me, but i suspect anything will come too late or not make a difference. I'm going through a pretty heavy drug treatment at the moment and supposed to be in bed resting but this is making me seriously ill (on top of already being seriously ill) and how i'm supposed to pack up a house and move is beyond me. I'm in serious negitive equity as I bought just before the housing crash (about £30k) so I think the next fight will be them chasing me for that.

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Hi there, sorry to hear your recent troubles. Make no mistake ECL are NOT a mortgage company, when we went through the same thing in 2011, I was told by one of there Helpful staff NOT, that they bought a" book" of mortgages, these are ones in trouble that say, Future don't want on there books. What ECL do is add charges let the account run into more trouble, then try to repossess your home so they can sell it and make a profit, they can afford to sell your home at a knock down price because they probably didn't pay much for the mortgage in the first place.

 

This will always be their endgame, we asked the same as you capitalisation etc and received the same answer, " you can't afford it " that was after we sent them expenditure forms, which they juggled to suit themselves. If you have any money at end of month, they want it, if you show you haven't any then you can't pay any extra. We have stopped speaking to them on the phone as we found it too stressful and found we got nowhere. we only correspond in writing and make sure we keep everything, when we went to court the judge picked up on the fact that they had not considered any other option but repossession, I recently noticed they have taken a phrase off their letters that said " repossession is the last course of action we would undertake " the judge noted that it was the first course they had taken.

 

If you see my post earlier in this thread, we replied to their request and refused to fill out an expenditure form, stating that the £600 we pay now included £77 towards the arrears and not the original £50 we agreed, and that we would continue to pay this. Their reply basically said they agree to carry on as we are but would review it periodically. I would suggest that a visit to Shelter would be a great help they gave us so much support and although they couldn't represent us in court they wrote a letter to the judge, making recommendations etc, with your circumstances they my be able to go with you to court, make sure you have any letters from ECL and from yourself to them , this was crucial in our trip to court.

 

In their recent letter they say that it is their policy to only capitalise once within the term of the mortgage, which for us they did very early on after they took over. If they haven't done this for you then ask why it's not possible. We hope things work out for you, once again go and get as much advice as you can and go armed to the teeth to fight these sharks. Take care.

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Hi there, sorry to hear your recent troubles. Make no mistake ECL are NOT a mortgage company, when we went through the same thing in 2011, I was told by one of there Helpful staff NOT, that they bought a" book" of mortgages, these are ones in trouble that say, Future don't want on there books. What ECL do is add charges let the account run into more trouble, then try to repossess your home so they can sell it and make a profit, they can afford to sell your home at a knock down price because they probably didn't pay much for the mortgage in the first place.

 

This will always be their endgame, we asked the same as you capitalisation etc and received the same answer, " you can't afford it " that was after we sent them expenditure forms, which they juggled to suit themselves. If you have any money at end of month, they want it, if you show you haven't any then you can't pay any extra. We have stopped speaking to them on the phone as we found it too stressful and found we got nowhere. we only correspond in writing and make sure we keep everything, when we went to court the judge picked up on the fact that they had not considered any other option but repossession, I recently noticed they have taken a phrase off their letters that said " repossession is the last course of action we would undertake " the judge noted that it was the first course they had taken.

 

If you see my post earlier in this thread, we replied to their request and refused to fill out an expenditure form, stating that the £600 we pay now included £77 towards the arrears and not the original £50 we agreed, and that we would continue to pay this. Their reply basically said they agree to carry on as we are but would review it periodically. I would suggest that a visit to Shelter would be a great help they gave us so much support and although they couldn't represent us in court they wrote a letter to the judge, making recommendations etc, with your circumstances they my be able to go with you to court, make sure you have any letters from ECL and from yourself to them , this was crucial in our trip to court.

 

In their recent letter they say that it is their policy to only capitalise once within the term of the mortgage, which for us they did very early on after they took over. If they haven't done this for you then ask why it's not possible. We hope things work out for you, once again go and get as much advice as you can and go armed to the teeth to fight these sharks. Take care.

 

top post!!

 

i'm currently battling with them after court hearing was listed without notice - i'm also pursuing an ombudsman complaint. i'm looking for as many examples of their true motives as possible so the more case studies the better. i may even include elements of this thread in my court papers by way of evidence of their well-versed malpractice

 

keep the faith

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Similiar situation with us, I'd be happy to add my name to any group action.

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Similiar situation with us, I'd be happy to add my name to any group action.

 

was thinking something in the way of knowledge-sharing. ie. people like me include the experiences of others in our court defence and then we "feed back" back to the forum so others can benefit from the information gathered here

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Well I would certainly say I'm another one who has suffered at their hands. They bought the debt from future Mortgages, immediately set about charging me for everything they could, soon started repossession action, I tried to offer amounts towards it, they wouldn't listen. Eventually I agreed to go to court, their solicitor approached me before hand and tried to get me to agree to whole payment each month plus a huge amount per month in addition. I took every piece of paper and bit of advice with me and offered to pay £275 per month which the judge felt was too high and decided we should only pay £225 per month. We have been for 14 months and now they are trying it again and yet we have paid every single payment on time, which must be really upsetting them!

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hi - adding my name to list for any group action - I too had this done to me and, outrageously, they took me to court first making my incur lots of legal costs then after that they agreed to capitalise arrears - god only knows why the judge let them get away with it, have been passed on to another company who act in the same way, trying to get repo and adding charges. I also sent all this in to the FOS and they didn't uphold my complaint but wasted two years of my life. I have complained to JP Morgan too but they have done nothing either - when will the government act for the public against these companies!

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Well I would certainly say I'm another one who has suffered at their hands. They bought the debt from future Mortgages, immediately set about charging me for everything they could, soon started repossession action, I tried to offer amounts towards it, they wouldn't listen. Eventually I agreed to go to court, their solicitor approached me before hand and tried to get me to agree to whole payment each month plus a huge amount per month in addition. I took every piece of paper and bit of advice with me and offered to pay £275 per month which the judge felt was too high and decided we should only pay £225 per month. We have been for 14 months and now they are trying it again and yet we have paid every single payment on time, which must be really upsetting them!

 

as you've kept to the court's order, on what basis can they "try it again"?

 

I provided details of income and expenditure before the first hearing and also made a reasonable offer to pay off the arrears over 3 years. engage then attempted to argue that my offer was unaffordable whilst at the same time trying to prove my spending habits showed that my arrears are not a priority. have another hearing in a couple of months but in the meantime judge order I make payment in accordance with the offer made and re-send income details (which engage can then make inquiries into)

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hi - adding my name to list for any group action - I too had this done to me and, outrageously, they took me to court first making my incur lots of legal costs then after that they agreed to capitalise arrears - god only knows why the judge let them get away with it, have been passed on to another company who act in the same way, trying to get repo and adding charges. I also sent all this in to the FOS and they didn't uphold my complaint but wasted two years of my life. I have complained to JP Morgan too but they have done nothing either - when will the government act for the public against these companies!

 

so let me get this right..........they were forced to capitalise arrears and then they sold your account to another lender (ie. from future to engage to a new lender)?

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as you've kept to the court's order, on what basis can they "try it again"?

 

I provided details of income and expenditure before the first hearing and also made a reasonable offer to pay off the arrears over 3 years. engage then attempted to argue that my offer was unaffordable whilst at the same time trying to prove my spending habits showed that my arrears are not a priority. have another hearing in a couple of months but in the meantime judge order I make payment in accordance with the offer made and re-send income details (which engage can then make inquiries into)

 

They said that the account was up for review and we should look to up our payments to clear the arrears sooner. Well if our income hasn't changed then surely what the Judge decided in his judgement still stands? ~Certainly the way I see it but will that stop them wanting the info? Doubt it!

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Evening All,

 

question, i'm not sure if its fake news or just to catch people attention, but I saw an article claiming that if you had an over draft you might be entitled to refunds, in a similar fashion to PPI.

 

does anyone have a view, is it true/false..

 

I mean many moons ago I used to use my over draft and from time to time I used to go over and of course our good friends at HSBC used to charge me the earth for it.

 

 

frankly I don't see the correlation between PPI and having an overdraft and where I could be owed anything.

 

cheers - Red

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PPI of a fashion but not really..... PPI on overdrafts does exist but it is extremely rare......only offered by certain Banks...... and was more of a Loan Guard insurance if your current account fed your loan payments....with the same bank.

 

Regards

 

Andy


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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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Hi All, just peace of mind really, since i'm not sure about it. back in the day 3 years ago. I had a mortgage which started off with Future mortgages, but the after the 2008 crisis became engage credit.

 

eventually I sold the property at the end of 2015 - ad paid off all of the Mortgage. looking at the paper work I can't seen any PPI on it of any kind.

 

Even when it was moved over to Engage Credit. Any Though as how I could verify if Any PPI was on my Mortgage Account?

 

Cheers Red

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Sat them


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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Hi dx100uk - thank you and apologies but what does "Sat" mean

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no its the ruddy auto correct again...…..sar

 

dx


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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Afternoon all, a while back I had a mortgage with Future Mortgages a spin off of CITI bank, who after the 2008 crash sold its on to Engage Credit. I sold that property and covered all that was open, but I had doubts since it wasn't a standard Mortgage product. anyhow.

 

long story short - i wanted to check for any PPI, or if it the product was miss sold to an extent. so i sent Engage Credit a SAR request on the 15th of March, we are on the 27th of April and no reply from Engage Credit.

 

i know we had the Easter break - but the 30 days for responding are well and truly over - what are my options and next steps please?

cheers

 

Red

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give them a ring

what address did you use?

dx


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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numerous threads merged for complete history

 


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, DCA;s would collapse overnight.

 

 

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