lowell CCJ re: Cap1 card - now Warrant

[Ds3Sport]

Council tax were a nightmare. Had to get the local councillor involved but even then we still had to pay the full amount. It took endless submissions of I&E forms before they finally decided we could get a reduction but even then they insisted we pay the full amount of the arrears and took us to court. We had to use part of one months rent payment to avoid the bailiffs coming in. We managed to pay that bit back to our landlord but then got hit with another council tax bill and another threat of court action. Luckily my wife's disability payment started coming through and so we had to use most of that to pay £200 off the arrears each month. Now when we have finally got to the last payment, which is £154 and had our council tax reduced to £54 per month this Lowell thing drops on us  

 

Council tax were unwavering and just kept saying they had a statutory duty to collect despite us having no money and only UC as income. It's a ridiculous system. We just scraped by but there are plenty who cannot. 

 

I have started on the New Enterprise Allowance scheme which helps people who want to start their own business or just work for themselves and I do have better prospects further down the line so, there is some light at the end of the tunnel. Just that right now we don't have any wriggle room with the finances. Anyway, let's see how it goes.

[London1971]

I hear you,

 

It took us from 2014 to 2018 to turn it around.  Once you start getting out of it you have the luxury of being able to think more strategically, e.g putting more effort into getting better paid employment etc , rather than just fighting fires.

 

I am very surprised at the council tax though, my area were a lot more sympathetic, and my local councillor was excellent.

 

I really do think that Lowell will be easy for you to deal with, just get that payment down to a quid per month and keep us posted here.

 

If you haven't already, have you sent GP's note, informing Water & Electric?. If they know that there is someone ill in the house they will not cut you off.  

 

Your number one priority is your rent, is there a way you can make extra income without affecting your benefits? Even if it's delivering pizza's?

[Ds3Sport]

It's been a rough couple of years for us. My wife had a high paying job in the city before she became ill and when she could no longer work we dropped around £4k per month from our income almost straight away. I was able to fill the gap for about a year but then I also hit a brick wall with dwindling customers and the debts started to mount up. We did contact all our creditors though which is why they have been so accommodating in their responses. 

 

My case with Lowell is one of the exceptions on this forum because I followed all the advice given here but it didn't work for me. I should have accepted their offer of a 50% discount right at the get go but I held out and ended up in court with a CCJ for the full amount plus court costs and a monthly payment I could not afford. It was a risk and just didn't pay off. The judge said the whole thing should never have come to court but, it it what it is and we just need to deal with it.

 

My problems are further complicated by not really being able to leave my wife on her own. I won't go into details but it is just something I cannot do right now. The business I am working on with the NEA is a work from home one so it suits our circumstances very well. My goal is just to pay the bills for now and then anything else is a bonus.

 

Our landlord has been superb, never once pressured us for rent and is not hassling us at all for the arrears. I think she knows we will pay it eventually and we do take very good care of the place but we definitely cannot fall any further behind. She does now at least have guaranteed rent every month. The housing part of UC doesn't pay the full amount of course but it helps a lot.

 

As for council tax. Our local councillors are not that great really. It took three attempts to get an answer from any of them and although one did get involved it had no effect on the outcome. I have heard that councillors can intervene and stop court action if they want to. I have read about this happening for others.

 

So I would say right now the main priority is utilities like gas/electric and water. We are with OVO for gas and electric and they have been pretty good although they have now passed the debt onto a DCA but there has been no talk of cutting us off etc. My plan with this is to deal with the normal account and the debts separately. So  start paying what should be our normal £80 per month payment to OVO so the debt does not increase and then make an offer to the DCA taking our circumstances into account. It's laughable but we did apply to the OVO energy fund which is to help people with large debts but we were told "you do not have enough income to qualify"! 

 

With the water we have been put on the vulnerable people list so again I don't think we would be cut off but we really need to start making inroads into that debt too. 

 

All seems like quite a mountain to climb right now but I am sure we will get there eventually

[AndyOrch]

Threads merged for history....given that we didn't initially advise you or prepare a defence..so its untrue  to state.....

 

" My case with Lowell is one of the exceptions on this forum because I followed all the advice given here but it didn't work for me. "

 

Andy

 

Thread title amended 

[Ds3Sport]

Actually you did advise me about Lowell and I followed that advice. It is not a criticism, simply stating it doesn't always work in all cases. It is down to the individual to take responsibility. Advice from CAG is very much welcome but it doesn't guarantee a result only that odds are slightly more stacked in your favour. If it comes to court it then all hinges on which judge you get and what mood they are in. 

[AndyOrch]

We didn't prepare your defence.....which is the most important part of defending a claim...but I agree it all comes down to a Judge lottery..the secret is to get the claimant to  discontinue.....then there is no judge.....its all in the prep and defence.

[Ds3Sport]

I didn't think that was something you did? Anyway, the advice was sound it was just Lowell weren't playing ball in my case. They didn't even show at the first court hearing but the judge let it proceed to a second hearing when it should have been thrown out there and then. Just bad luck on my part.

[AndyOrch]

Get the N245 submitted today and suspend the Issue of Warrant....you can do it on the same form ..first box before box 1.

 

Lowell wont agree anything and its really pointless getting into letter tennis with them....they only see £ signs..thats why I stated get it on a legal footing ..rubber stamped by the court...otherwise they will hound you for a review every 3 months.

 

Andy

[Ds3Sport]

Just a quick update.

 

I sent the N245 off to the court that issued the warrant (Horsham) but at the same time I emailed Brighton County Court because they handle all the admin for Horsham. I wanted to check that I was sending it to the right place. N245 states it should go to the court that issued the warrant. 

 

This morning I received an email from Brighton saying that

Quote

Oxford County Court are the bulk centre for processing N245 applications for Surrey and Sussex, therefore you would need to send your application to them with the £50 fee

 

That doesn't make sense to me because surely the court that made the order is the one that decides what to do with it?

 

A bit concerned now because I don't want one court sending it to another and then another and so on.

[AndyOrch]

Well thats where it must be sent to...logic /common sense and the law are two different things 

[Ds3Sport]

So the N245 went to the right place (Horsham) or you think it should have gone to Oxford? 

 

The court system seems to be a complete mess in this country

[AndyOrch]

They have already told you...Oxford...send it to Oxford and attach the above...

 

" Oxford County Court are the bulk centre for processing N245 applications for Surrey and Sussex, therefore you would need to send your application to them with the £50 fee "

[Ds3Sport]

Too late. It already went to Horsham as per the instructions on the form. "send it to the court that issued the warrant" so that's what I did.

[AndyOrch]

Is  Horsham  Oxford County Court ? not my neck of the woods Ds3

[Ds3Sport]

No but Horsham is where the warrant was issued and on N245 it very clearly states to send the form to the court that issued the warrant. Oxford had nothing to do with the judgement or the warrant. 

 

On the warrant itself it states that payment of the amount due £212.25 should be made to the payment centre at Oxford but of course I am not paying that, I am applying for suspension of the warrant and variation of the order. 

 

As if it is not all stressful enough there is no clarity on where the damned thing should be sent!

 

I will send another form to Oxford and be done with it.

[AndyOrch]

You could give Oxford a ring first and check ?

[Ds3Sport]

Just a quick update on this. 

 

So I did send the N245 to Oxford. Horsham had not even looked at it so didn't lose any money there. 

 

I phone the court on Tuesday to check on progress and they confirmed they had received the form and forwarded it to Lowell who has 16 days to respond. They also said they had notified the bailiff. So that was good, something happening at least.

 

Then yesterday we had a letter pushed through the door, hand delivered, no postage and which was "Notice Of Visit By Bailiff" It went on to say:

 

Quote

 

A notice was sent warning you that the bailiff would call if you did not pay the full amount £212.25.

The Bailiff called today with a warrant to remove enough of your goods to sell at public auction in order to raise the amount due, plus any extra costs for arranging removal and sale.

There was nobody in. Please email [email protected] or call 07779 455227.

Your goods will not be removed if you pay the amount of the warrant.

 

 

Thing is, we were at home. No one pressed the buzzer or knocked on the door. The letter was simply pushed through the letterbox.

 

I emailed the address on the form and told them to check with the court and that the N245 had been submitted etc. Not heard anything back.

 

Seems that bailiffs just carry on with their initial instructions regardless of what anyone tells them?

 

Anyway, if they turn up again I am definitely not letting them in!

 

[AndyOrch]

Probably taking time to filter through .....still if he dont knock or ring the bell rather pointless letter.

[Ds3Sport]

Yeah that's what I thought. Why on earth come up to the apartment just to slip an unmarked envelope through and not even knock on the door? 

 

Anyway, not heard anything again today so hopefully Lowell have figured out this is a lost cause and will just accept my offer. If they don't I think it goes back to the court to decide?

[Ds3Sport]

Just thought I would update on the outcome of this whole thing.

 

Lowell failed to respond to the court within the 16 days allowed and so the court have determined that my offer of £10 per month is acceptable and have made an order to that effect. 

 

So now as long as I maintain the £10 a month, which I can do. Everything is sorted.

 

Thanks again for everyone's input on this. Helps enormously to be able to discuss these things with people who are experienced in such matters and perhaps have been through the process themselves.