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    • Hi.   Could you let us have the information requested in the forum sticky please? This will help us to advise you. In the meantime don't worry too much about this.     HB  
    • So last August my girlfriend went to Legoland with the kids (4 & 8) and her mum and then went to Pizza Express in Windsor. They parked at Castle Car Park.    They paid to park and went to eat. They were then a few minutes late back. There was already an attendant issuing a ticket. The attendant then waited until my girlfriend was over ten minutes late to issue the ticket despite her being there well within any grace period.   My girlfriend appealed to Ultimate Customer Solutions end of August but did not receive a response (they later said they emailed a rejection which my girlfriend never received until it was resent). Then in August she received the first debt collection letter. Then my girlfriend was advised to respond to UCS requesting an Subject Access Request (SAR) which they have not ever acknowledged or responded to.    So then we thought they had gone away until we received a letter from CSB solicitors (same address as UCS) advising they would be beginning court proceedings against my girlfriend. I told my girlfriend to complain that they haven't responded to any of our requests so she called the number of UCS and was basically accused of being rude to the t*** at the end of the phone. She wasn't but he wasn't very helpful and said they had responded to the appeal and sent it again. This was on the 16th January 2020.    On the 29th Jan this was sent after another chase to the solicitors:   I have reported UK Parkings ltd to the ICO as they are in beach of GDPR having ignored my SAR request. Further to this I was not notified that my initial appeal had been rejected and therefore cannot further appeal in a standard way and therefore I am awaiting further advice for ways to appeal against this unfair PCN.   As it stands should you decide to further contact me in regards to this matter without good cause I shall be seeking legal advice as per my statutory rights.   My girlfriend then received another letter from UCS threatening debt collectors (I told her not to worry about this) and so she wrote to the solicitors asking for an update:   Email dated 21/02/2020 I am writing to you regarding my email sent on 29th January, below. I still have not received a response from you and I left a voicemail for a solicitor to call me from CSB Solicitors, which I have also not received. I would like to speak to a solicitor regarding this PCN.   The solicitor responded via email the following: Dear Madam,   Thank you for your email.   Following your email below, we reverted this matter back to our Client for their instructions. We will only be able to respond more fully once these are received.   At this stage we have no further instructions other than to send out a letter to you dated 16 January 2020.   We hope to be able to respond more fully once these are received.   Yours faithfully,   Solicitor   So UCS are not actually doing anything they should do but nobody we have complained to has actually come back to us so not sure where to take this because I don't have time for court and I would rather just have someone take the (insert appropriate word here) to task on these unbelievably poor practices!   Any advice on next steps?   Thanks    
    • Hi Sneezer and thanks for your Site Donation which is much needed and much appreciated.   The info from the "Solicitor" makes sense if you were complaining about how CRS came to have your contact details. However, this is not relevant to your case. You didn't cancel properly and carried on paying for a gym you didn't use.   For the future, see the Guide here about how to cancel a contract properly and avoid trouble - https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/383678-cancelling-your-gym-agreement-get-it-right/     Come back anytime to update us but don't worry about CRS or anyone else who makes demands. Let us know if you need more for advice and reassurance.    
    • They were communicating with lawyers associated to me too   They can’t serve a SD on your lawyers, only you.   As I said earlier - the lawyer stopped communicating  around the date on the SD they incorrectly served.  And the bank told me the receiver was now handling things and not to deal with them anymore.   The receiver never asked me where I was.  But he did email and I did reply or he did get auto reply.   Since I did have email communication with them - I don't think they could say they did everything possible to find me,  All they had to do was ask!  And then we could have discussed the situation.    It almost is the reverse - they did nothing to try find me.  And if a PI is employed to do surveillance then he must have realised only one person - the wrong one - lived at the  wrong address.   Does anyone have any info re post #26 and #28 above?   The property is being marketed for sale and the receiver is negotiating offers, so there was no reason for me to expect bank/ lawyers to be trying to locate me to serve any papers.      Surely any loss to them has to be proven upon an agreed sale.  It hasn't sold yet,   They may still get a high enough offer to prevent any large debt?  There could then be a different discussion re terms of repayment?   So I was not expecting anyone to be trying to find me!   But this is a bit of a digression from what  should I be doing NOW? Should I send them an SAR?  If they do intend to serve me correctly this would be useful, yes?   I am sure they have added all sorts of unnecessary costs to the debt that could be challenged?   Also there is a question over if they even had a valid notice of assignment?  They would have to produce that in the SAR wouldn't they?   This was a real query for me ages ago but it never got pursued legally.
    • Expect them to bring up every communication and claim that you’ve been dodging them / not providing them with an address to serve to.......
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Hello,

 

a couple of days ago I had two HCEOs barge into our home around 7am demanding money or they would be removing goods.

Not having experienced anything like this before I just panicked and paid whatever they said.

 

I've just found this forum and have been reading the posts here.

From some of these earlier posts, it appears that this firm of HCEOs are well known for charging all the fees in one go which they did to me as well.

 

Does anyone here have any advice or suggestions as to the strength of my case?

 

This is what happened:-

 

First off, I was aware of the debt and do not dispute that I owe it.

It's not council tax or anything but a private individual that I owe the money to, I've been attempting to agree a repayment schedule with them but they declined my offers and the next thing I know the HCEOs turn up.

 

I have just made a subject access request to see exactly what data they have on me.

 

From reading the section on vulnerability I believe that I have a strong case to be described as vulnerable (I don't want to go into details as it may identify me).

 

They never sent a Notice of Enforcement.

 

When they turned up they initially demanded an amount of money that, now I have had time to read up on this, I now realise included both the Stage1 and Stage 2 enforcement fees.

 

I tried to pay this via credit card a couple of times but that was blocked (I later got a phone call from my cc company as they thought it was a possible fraud).

 

I then told them that I could contact a family member and they could get cash out of the bank when it opened.

They agreed to this but said that the fee had just gone up.

I now understand that this extra fee was the Stage Sale fee.

 

Eventually they got their money and left.

While they were in my home they just looked around the place and said that there was nothing really of value

(at that time I wasn't aware that certain goods were exempt and I thought they were going to take all my furniture).

 

I would welcome some advice on this and I also have a couple of questions.

 

My two extra questions are,

firstly,

what exactly does "taking control" actually involve?

At no time did they try to secure any of my property,

they did not write anything down,

they simply started walking around the home opening all the cupboards etc.

 

Secondly, I read on another thread here:-

 

The bailiff is also required to keep a record of the time that the notice was sent (posted).

 

With the exception of just a couple of smaller companies, all others use the same mailing firm and their software provides the time that notices are sent.

 

Is this something that will show up as part of my Subject Access Request?

Edited by tonyton

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why did you let them in?

there is no right of entry?

 

did they barge passed you?


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

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did they barge passed you?

 

No, I went to get my glasses to read the documents and when I stepped away from the door they just walked in

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opps 1st big mistake..

why say they barged passed you then?


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

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opps 1st big mistake..

why say they barged passed you then?

 

I'm a bit confused? I didn't say that. I said "they barged in"

 

Yes, I know now that I should have shut the door and locked it while I went to get my glasses, but as soon as I turned my back they simply walked into the house - that's what I meant by barging in.

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How much was your initial CCJ for and when was it granted?

How much did you end up paying them?

The good thing about paying in full is that you are not in danger from the knock at the door and can take your time collating all the info you may require.

 

If submitting a SAR then make sure you request in particular:

a - the fees that have been charged, the time they were charged for and for what reason

b - a copy of any Body Worn Video including audio

Edited by dx100uk
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How much was your initial CCJ for and when was it granted? How much did you end up paying them?

 

It's from four months ago. I don't really want to be specific about the amounts but it was slightly under £2k and the total fees came to about the same amount.

 

 

The good thing about paying in full is that you are not in danger from the knock at the door and can take your time collating all the info you may require.

 

If submitting a SAR then make sure you request in particular:

a - the fees that have been charged, the time they were charged for and for what reason

b - a copy of any Body Worn Video including audio

 

Yes, it's a small comfort.

 

I've requested details of the fees and camera footage, but I didn't ask for a break down of the times that they were charged.

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Approximations are fine. Let's see what they come back with. Were you left any documents?


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Hello,

 

This is what happened:-

 

First off, I was aware of the debt and do not dispute that I owe it.

It's not council tax or anything but a private individual that I owe the money to, I've been attempting to agree a repayment schedule with them but they declined my offers and the next thing I know the HCEOs turn up.

 

From reading the section on vulnerability I believe that I have a strong case to be described as vulnerable (I don't want to go into details as it may identify me).

 

They never sent a Notice of Enforcement.

 

If this is the company that I think it is, I cannot tell you how many times I hear the exact same comment about the lack of a Notice of Enforcement. If it is the same company, a recent High Court judgment ruled that the absence of the Notice of Enforcement was down the the fact that the company had FAILED to send the notice. Nothing can be more serious. I will copy the relevant extract from the Judgment later this afternoon.

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Were you left any documents?

 

They left two pieces of paper showing the two different amounts of money they wanted (as I mentioned above) and a receipt showing the total amount that I had paid in cash

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pieces of paper?

no document numbers or titles on them?


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

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I will copy the relevant extract from the Judgment later this afternoon.

 

Thank you very much for that. Is the judgment available on bailii?

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pieces of paper?

no document numbers or tittles on them?

 

OK, I've just got them.

 

One says "Action Taken" and there is a tick box for "entered premises" with a time of 7am

 

The next says "Notice after entry or taking control of goods (on a highway) and inventory of goods taken into control" which shows the enforcement fees for stage 1 and stage 2 added together as one fee. There is no time on this.

 

The next says "Notice that goods have been removed for storage or sale". It then goes on to say "This is to tell you that I have removed the goods listed at the back of the notice to secure storage or for sale" but there is nothing listed on the back. This also adds the Sale Stage fee and is timed at 7:15am

 

Then there is "Payment Receipt" for the amount paid in cash.

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At any time during the visit, was an inventory of goods listed down?

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If no inventory, how can they add the Sales Fee? Is this DCBL by any chance with the supervising HCEO in absentia?


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At any time during the visit, was an inventory of goods listed down?

 

No, nothing at all. and as I say, when I looked at the forms in more detail they entered the premises at 7:00am and by 7:15am they were charging the Sales Fee after my credit card payment had been blocked.

 

 

 

Is this DCBL by any chance with the supervising HCEO in absentia?

 

I don't like to names names in case it identifies me in any way but, as the old saying goes, if it looks like a duck ...

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Well I think we all guessed who it was from Post 1 as it is the MO of that company.


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No, nothing at all. and as I say, when I looked at the forms in more detail they entered the premises at 7:00am and by 7:15am they were charging the Sales Fee after my credit card payment had been blocked

 

There can be no possibility that you could in any way be liable to be charged ALL fees at the same visit. The agent himself even went as far as to confirm that you do not appear to have sufficient goods to remove. This is clear enough evidence that the 'Sale Stage' fee should never have been applied.

 

This madness regarding the fees charged for enforcing these judgments and more importantly; the manner in which this particular company 'front load' their fees and esclate to 'sale stage' at the drop of a hat NEEDS TO STOP. If it doesn't then all other companies enforcing High Court judgments are going to be tarred with the same brush.

Edited by Andyorch
Edited

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Hello,

 

As you asked, I have outlined my experience on that link that you sent me for the Ministry of Justice. I'm happy to do my bit to help.

 

As to next steps, I'll wait until I get the reply to my SAR back. But can anyone give me advice on the next steps? Is it through the County Court or do I need to go to the High Court?

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We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group The National Consumer Service

 

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If this is the company that I think it is, I cannot tell you how many times I hear the exact same comment about the lack of a Notice of Enforcement. If it is the same company, a recent High Court judgment ruled that the absence of the Notice of Enforcement was down the the fact that the company had FAILED to send the notice. Nothing can be more serious. I will copy the relevant extract from the Judgment later this afternoon.

 

The following is an extract from the above mentioned High Court judgment:

 

It is alleged that DCBL exceeded their enforcement powers by unlawfully seizing first a van and then a powerboat. Proper procedures were, it is said, not followed in respect of either seizure and, in the case of the powerboat, it is said that the boat did not even belong to the judgment debtor. It is said that these wrongful acts were compounded by the presence of a TV crew from a company called Brinkworth Films Limited, filming for the series "Can't Pay? We'll take it away".

 

On behalf of the claimants, I heard evidence from Mr S and his wife, from the third claimant, Mr H who, with the fourth claimant, Mr Davis, claims to be a co-owner of the boat. I heard from Mr W who was present when the van was seized, and I read a witness statement from Ms H who worked on the reception desk of the boat park from which the boat was seized. For the second and third defendants I heard from Ms M, who is an in-house solicitor in the employment of DCBL.

 

Remarkably, there was no evidence from the enforcement agents who carried out the seizures. Nor was there any evidence from the manager directly in charge of these agents, who I understand to have been Mr W

 

The facts

 

I will first set out the facts as they are agreed or as I find them to be. The fact-finding exercise begins with the notice of enforcement. DCBL use a software package called “Ethos” or “My Ethos”. As I understand it, this system generates the documents necessary to progress debt recovery and allows a record to be made of the steps taken, (though the complete record in this case has never been disclosed).

 

On 17 May 2017, a Notice of Enforcement addressed to xxxxx at its business address was generated. Ms M's evidence was that it was sent by first-class post. But there is no documentary evidence at all to support that. Ms Miah did not personally post the notice. Although Ethos is capable of generating reports, no report attesting to postage was produced. The evidence that it was posted was based on Ms M's understanding of how the system worked in normal practice.

 

The paucity of evidence was very surprising given that the giving of notice is, by paragraph 7 of Schedule 12 to the Tribunals, Courts and Enforcement Act 2007, a prerequisite to taking control of goods and that paragraph stipulates that the enforcement agent must keep a record of the date and time when the notice is given.

 

Both Mr and Mrs S'd denied ever seeing this Notice of Enforcement and there are two reasons why I find that it was never sent.

 

The first I have already alluded to. The means to demonstrate the sending of the Notice of Enforcement lay within DCBL's power and it was indeed absolutely incumbent upon them to prove this matter. But they failed to do so. I would add that their numerous further failings in the observance of proper and lawful procedures, which I will presently come to, do not inspire me with confidence that the Notice of Enforcement was sent.

 

Second, Mr S scrupulously produced every document that they received from DCBL and their solicitor, Mr J, visited their business premises in order to satisfy himself that he had been given everything relevant.

 

If I can say this without impertinence or disrespect, the Slocombes struck me as unsophisticated and artless people who would neither have suppressed the document nor seen any advantage to themselves in doing so.

 

Given Mr S's somewhat unwise and unreasonable stance in relation to the judgment debt, it is perfectly possible that, if the Notice had arrived, he would have ignored it. But that does not demonstrate that it did arrive.

 

On the balance of probabilities, I find that it did not arrive and that is because it was never sent.

Edited by Bailiff Advice

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Interestingly looks like Ethos is a free accounting package http://www.ethosaccounting.com/


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Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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A case of a step to far by DCBL.

 

I think they were getting far to blaze about the Notice of Enforcement issue, nice to see them get bit on the bum.

 

The law said that the first part of successful "delivery" process was for the creditor/bailiff to show that the notice "was sent "on the balance of probabilities.

 

The second part, for the debtor to show the notice was not received to be able to challenge.

 

Future litigants should take heart. In that the judge may ask the creditor to justify his claim in future claims.


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DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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Thank you very much for this. Do you happen to have the case citation by any chance?

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Thank you very much for this. Do you happen to have the case citation by any chance?

Sorry

I would love to but currently am unable, it should be publicly available soon if it isn't already.


DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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