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    • I came back home on Monday and found this Claim form in my letter box. In the light of what I have explained earlier in regards to this debt claim, can anyone tell if I have any chance fighting it in th Court. SW in the last conversation request the proof of me living somewhere else, which I can't provide. They have info from the landlord of property being rented to me, I was there on electoral register, had bank account opened on this address, Driving licence had this address etc., but I wasn't living there.      Name of the Claimant -  Southern Water services   Date of issue – 12/06/2019     Particulars of Claim   The Claimant is statutory...etc The Claimant claims the sum £969 for unpaid water and or sewerage charges payable under s. 142-144 of the act and the Claimant Charges Scheme. The unpaid sum of £969 is for period 01/04/2014 - 08/07/2015. The claimant claims interest under section 69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at the rate of 8% a year  from 08/07/2015 to 11/06/2019 and also interest at the same rate up to the date of the judgment or earlier payment at daily rate of £0.21   What is the total value of the claim? £1423   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC ( Pre Action Protocol) ? yes Letter before Action   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred?  Yes, COA address.   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? No Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account?    No, water charges   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? Allegedly after - April 2012   Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? No   Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/ Equifax /Etc...) ? No, no anymore   Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Southern Water - original creditor   Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment?   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? No.   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Default sums” – at least once a year ? No   Why did you cease payments? Never. I wasn't aware of bills.   What was the date of your last payment? Never   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? Yes, creditor did not take my notice of bills being wrongly issued in my name.   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No  
    • If the case was brought before a UK civil court would UK rules apply or foreign rules?   I wonder if the original contract would strate what jurisdiction it's terms would be decided by?   I note that UK contracts frequently have a clause that says in so many words that any disputes  will be interpreted under UK law.
    • http://www.hadefpartners.com/News/333/Limitation-periods-in-the-United-Arab-Emirates   One of the key limitation periods to be aware of is the limitation period for a claim for breach of contract. We have been approached by many clients (including in-house counsel at large multinational and local companies, and even international law firms) who believe that the limitation period for a breach of contract (including a commercial contract) in the UAE is 15 years. What they are often not aware of is that the limitation period for commercial contracts (as set out in Federal Law 18 of 1993 (the “Commercial Code”)) is usually 10 years. Therefore, multi-million dollar claims dating back over more than 10 years may now be time-barred.   https://www.jstor.org/stable/3381662?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents
    • how long did you sign up for ? if they claimed DD after that period …….
    • If this thread was started about your friend, please don't ask Q's about your dad or anyone else.   Keep this thread on track and use a new thread to discuss issues about YD, thanks.   Keeps thread simple and focused.
  • Our picks

    • Future Comms is a Big Con. How to get out of it. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/417058-future-comms-is-a-big-con-how-to-get-out-of-it/
      • 4 replies
    • Future Comms issues. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/416504-future-comms-issues/
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    • This is a bit of a lengthy one but I’ll summerise best as possible.
       
      THIS IS HOW THE PHONECALL WENT 
       
      I was contacted by future comms by phone, they stated that they could beat any phone contract I have , (I am a limited company but just myself that needs a business phone and I am the only worker) 
      I told future comms my deal, £110 per month with a phone and a virtual landline, they confirmed that they could beat that, £90 per month with a phone , virtual landline  they also confirmed they would pay Vodafone (previous provider) the termination fee. As I am in business, naturally I was open to making a deal. So we proceeded. 
      Future comms then revealed that the contract would be with PLAN.COM and the airtime would be provided by 02, I instantly told them that this would break the deal as I have poor 02 signal in the house where I live as my partner is on 02 and constantly complaining about bad signal
      the salesman assured me he would send a signal booster box out with the phone so I would have perfect signal.
      so far so good.....
      i then explained this is the only mobile phone I use for business and pleasure, so therefore I didn’t want any disconnection time in the slightest between the switchover from Vodafone to 02
      the salesman then confirmed that the existing phone would only be disconnected once the new phone was switched on.
      so far so good....
      • 14 replies
    • A shocking story of domestic and economic abuse compounded by @BarclaysUKHelp ‏ bank complicity – coming soon @A_Gentle_Woman. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/415737-a-shocking-story-of-domestic-and-economic-abuse-compounded-by-barclaysukhelp-%E2%80%8F-bank-complicity-%E2%80%93-coming-soon-a_gentle_woman/
      • 0 replies
workaholic duck

Future Comms mobile contract

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It is clear on the evidence that you supplied above that they don't stand a snowflake's chance in hell of winning.

I can imagine that you would like to save yourself the trouble of having to go down to their court if there is a hearing. It would be nice for you to get your money, you have taught them a lesson, and to be certain that they know what will be coming the day after next payment date if they miss the payment.

I think that they can be certain that they shouldn't miss another payment. So that objective has been met.

Now it would be a good idea for you to try and get your money without any further hassle.

I would suggest that you write them a letter:

 

Quote

Dear Liam

As you know I've issued a claim against you for the money that you have failed to pay to me. As you also know, I have sent you a recurring letter of claim and you should understand by now that any further missed payment dates will mean that I will issue a claim against you and without any further notice. If you want to rack up court fees then that's up to you.

In the meantime, you seem to be saying that you have only agreed to pay me £100 termination fee and also only £18 cashback per month.

This clearly is complete nonsense and for your benefit I am enclosing to emails which I have received from your company – one from Megan and one from yourself – which I shall be producing to the court at the inevitable hearing. There is no doubt that when the judge sees this, you will find in my favour. In fact your denial of what we agreed is so outrageous that I should probably ask the judge to award me some litigant in person costs which are currently about £18 per hour.
I'm going to do you a favour. You can avoid these costs if you simply pay the value of my claim in its entirety including the claim fee. Once I have this money then I will withdraw the claim. Just to point out, that in addition to getting rid of this problem, you will also save yourself the hearing fee which will be awarded against you plus my reasonable cost of travel which will also be awarded against you. I suggest that you make a sensible business decision on this.

However, please note that my recurring letter of claim still stands and not only that, the claim which I have issued so far and all of this correspondence will be produced before a court if you play games with me again in future.

I'm fully aware that this is the way that you treat your customers but as far as I'm concerned it's at an end.

Over to you

Believe me

 

What I've written above may not be your style – but frankly I suggest that you send it as is.

I can't imagine he will be stupid enough not to pay you out – and this is his opportunity to avoid any further costs. I think that you have given them a good warning. Hopefully they will give you your money back and you can carry on with your life and hopefully they won't bother you again. However, don't waste a moment issuing another claim if you have to

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Did you put in a claim for interest?

What is likely to happen if they don't settle up immediately is that they will allow the time limits – as they see them – to arrive and then they will pay you out so that eventually the value of what you're claiming will be reduced. However, if you have claimed interest then that will continue to accrue on the unpaid portions.

However, by the time that the date for the hearing arrives, it is likely that they will only owe you the difference between their version of the termination fee – and your version of the termination fee – about £56.

However, you should stand your ground on every last penny because also you will want your claim fee. There is no reason why you should give ground on any of this and as I have already said, if there is a hearing then you will be required to pay hearing fee – but you will get it back. You will also be required to pay your reasonable cost of travel – but you will get those back as well.

If they decide to take it to a hearing then the whole thing will be a huge nuisance for you but at the end of the day I think you have to deliver the slap and you are doing very well – although it could have been done a bit more carefully.

At some point you will get directions questionnaire and one of the questions they will be which court should it be heard in. Please come to us so that we can help you answer these questions. Although in principle because you are two businesses, and they are the defendant, the claim should be heard in their local court – we will try to express your preference in a way which may persuade the court administration to transfer the case to your local court. That would certainly produce a lot of pressure on Future comms to settle the problem – if you haven't done so already because they absolutely won't want to have to go to the time and trouble of travelling to your local court – especially on a claim which will only be worth about £50 and which they have no chance of winning


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Like the sound and tone of the letter, thank you!

Looking at the part admission form I received I have to respond with what I want to do before 24th April.

The first option of 'I do not accept the defendant's part admission' seems most applicable. Shall I send the letter to FC on Monday and wait for a few days before returning the form? FC will likely not respond quickly! And we have Easter in between.

 

It does say on the form that they will decide which court, small claims or fast track etc. From Cornwall to Gosport is quite a trip!!! Either way it's costly. Let's hope they settle before going to court.

 

Yes, I did add interest fees to the claim. I do intend to claim every last penny.

 

A productive day, I'd say! Thank you for ALL your help and patience. Let's hope more people will be encouraged to act in the same way.

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Please could you post up the document that you are referring to which talks about the allocation of the claim.

You haven't answered my question about claiming interest.


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You still haven't answered my question about whether or not you claimed interest. I have to say that getting information and also documents out of you is a bit like pulling teeth.

Yes, indicate that you don't accept the part admission – box A. You have to return a copy of the form to the court and also send a copy to the defendant. I suggest that you send a copy to the defendant immediately together with the letter that I suggested above. That way there is no doubt. I suggest that you send it recorded delivery.

You will get a directions questionnaire in the next few weeks. Let us know when you receive it.

Would you like to tell us eventually whether or not you claimed interest


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Posted (edited)

 

Yes, I did add interest fees to the claim. I do intend to claim every last penny.  SEE POST 126!!!! Or about 3 posts back.

 

I know I provide a lot of reading material but I do try to answer every question you ask me!

Edited by workaholic duck

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I don't have a problem about the number of documents you are providing. What I find a bit difficult is having to ask for them almost one at a time.

Anyway, I think we've got enough now and as I have already suggested, if you complete the form and send a copy to the courts and also one to Future comms together with the letter that I suggested or an equivalent letter then there is nothing else to do until either you receive the money or else you receive the directions questionnaire.

I don't know if you have put a review on trust pilot – but if you have, you might want to go and edit it and say very briefly that you have now started a court claim and it has already produce some results. This might start to provoke a little more interest. Also you could put exactly the same message up on the Google review and there if you want you can tell them to come to this forum for help. If you put that message about us on the trust pilot review I expect it will be removed. If you put it on Google, it will stay there.


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Update! Well, FC decided to defend my claim against them. I received the court papers to complete and return which I have duly done.

What their defence is I have no idea, it wasn't included. I did agree to a phone call mediation since I am so far away from Gosport, although I did fill in my local court as preference.

 

They did pay last month's cashback, so I suppose they think that's sufficient. But the early termination fee promised by 18th April still hasn't been paid (and that was put on the court form!). Now we are past 18th May and no cashback...….here we go again.....interesting to see how the courts respond. 

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Thanks for the update.

Unfortunately the usual rule is that the case should be heard in the defendant's local court. If you simply expressed a preference that a hearing should be in your own local court then the chances are that they will not agree.

We would have suggested a form of words which would have increased your chances of getting it heard in your own local court. I hope you won't mind me saying that I think in future if you have forms to fill in or anything else to prepare that you should let us know in advance to take our advice. If you go it alone then you won't necessarily do the best for yourself.

I notice on the Facebook group there are over 20 people now who are members and who are complaining that they haven't been paid. One person has apparently owed over £2500 and yet are not aware that he has actually sent them a letter of claim.

If you have any way of encouraging these people to start threatening and then bringing their legal actions, it would be probably helpful to all of them if you would do so by posting up on the Facebook group.

Once again, I'm frankly amazed at how so many people who apparently business people and therefore should be worrying about their balance sheets have been prepared to go along with all of these broken promises again and again and again and without taking any action and without getting anywhere.

I'm not surprised that future comms is continuing this business practice. They are probably amazed as well how they can get away with it.

Anyway, as I said, thanks for the update – but I suggest that you come to us first before taking any further action. It's completely free so there's no downside. Once we've given advice then you can disregard it if you want


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Well, I had every intention to but left it to the last minute and was anxious to get the form back in time. I doubt much will happen quickly - I am away 23rd May-10th June (stated on the form as unavailable between those dates).

 

The trouble with 'all us self-employed' is that we ARE looking at our balance sheets and keeping orders going out on time, paying bills, keeping stock levels up etc.... that when something like this comes along (FC con-men) it can take up a lot of precious time. It may seem to an outsider that we are being apathetic but it is only one part of many things to keep on top of. I am guilty of this myself. It IS tiresome! Them defending my claim frankly took me by surprise (but that's what they love to do!).

 

I suspect a lot of 'victims' have small businesses that are labour-intensive and these are the very people who have little time to deal with businesses who are out to con us. So, from that point, CAG is wonderful in that it helps enormously with these burdens. From FC's point of view we are easy prey.

 

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as you are suing a business it will be heard at your local court, not theirs. If you lose they will claim a fortune in travel costs etc but they will get nothing fortheir rep's time as they ahve to pay people anyway

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Update: Letter received today from court informing me that the defendant failed to  return the Directions Questionnaire by the date specified.

They have until 16th, 4 days to do so.

 

If they don't comply the  order will be struck out  and looks like I will be at liberty to enter judgement.  That'll be interesting; if they can't be bothered to reply to the courts, what chance is there of getting my money???

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Can you remind me how much they owe you and also has the debt increased since you first issued the proceedings?


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£175 give or take......they owed 2 months cashback but during court paperwork paid those . Now they owe for May, and next week, for June. 

I say give or take because of the VAT part. They say no VAT but in an email they promised to pay the VAT. Plus the court fees and interest at 8%.

 

So, nowhere near the £600 for super-efficient bailiffs!

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Thanks. Once you apply the judgement – and you receive confirmation that it has been granted, you can either hand the matter over to the County Court which will cost you about 50 quid – which you get back if reinforcement is successful, or you might possibly proceed against their bank account if you can find out their bank account details. It's called a third party debt order and you need to obtain a form n349 and the fee is £110 which you will also get back if the enforcement is successful.

I'm not sure how you will get the bank account details – I think you would have to start looking on the Facebook future comms problems group to see if anyone there has received a cheque for somehow or other has the bank details of future comms.

I'm afraid as with all of these things, enforcement can be tricky if the company is determined not to pay up – as seems to be a great possibility here.

I would certainly send a copy of the judgement to citizens advice and also to Ofcom – although they won't be interested but you may as well do it and to O2 for the same reason. Also if you can let me have a copy I will make sure that it finds its way directly to Trading Standards.

I would also put a copy up on this forum and also on the Facebook group and also refer to it on trust pilot and also Google reviews.

 


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If they don't comply will that mean a CCJ against them?

 

Also, I guess they won't like me too much now......probably with hold  all future  cashbacks!  OK, so what are my chances of being released from this horrendous contract, since they are clearly not sticking to their side of it????

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As soon as you get a judgement – that is a CCJ. If they failed to satisfy the judgement within 30 days then it will be entered against them on their credit score or whatever they have six years. However, I have already seen that they have got four or five judgements against them which remain unsatisfied and so clearly Future comms don't seem to be too bothered.

I'm afraid that the chances of being released from the contract are almost nil because you are talking about the contract with O2 the airtime provider. However, it is not O2 which is breaching the contract. You want to be released from your contract with Future comms but because you have carried out your part of the bargain – you have entered into a contract with O2, there is no point in saying that the contract is terminated because that would simply release future comms any obligation to pay you any money – which is what they want. This is why the whole thing is so one-sided and this is why future comms clients have so little power over future comms. Future comms are sitting pretty and it's a nice little earner for them.

If you can discover something in the various codes of practice which place an obligation on O2 only to use brokers such as future comms to behave in a certain way or to adhere to certain standards then you may be able to argue that O2 have breach their contract – but unfortunately I don't see that O2 are doing anything wrong. This means that they are in a nice position as well because they simply wash their hands of future comms but they're happy to use the clients that future comms creates for them. The whole thing is a very nasty little trick


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Shame! Let's hope they go bust before long.....they're collecting CCJ's like trophies.

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I hope so too - but I doubt it somehow.  Not enough people taking action about it, unfortunately.  However, if you put the bailiffs in, it might produce a result


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This is worrying but exactly the response I got from O2 when I complained (a lot) to them. They quickly fobbed me off to the Ombudsman saying we had reached 'deadlock'. What are we to do when faced with BOTH of them????

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Yet, I have SOME sympathy with O2.

 

Your cashback deal with FutureComms is independent from your contract with O2, and O2 aren’t responsible for FutureComms failing(s) .

 

Likely O2 are fed up with such firms offering cash backs, not paying them, and people then complaining to O2 about it, where O2 aren’t being unreasonable in saying “nothing to do with us”. What can O2 do?

they can’t really release people from their contract, they can’t really pay the cashback (since they’ll likely have paid FutureComms their commission already).

 

So, what could O2 do?

a) cut off any poorly behaving firms like FutureComms, so they can’t impinge on O2’s reputation, but this is “shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted” but might warn off others from behaving that way

b) Delay any commission payments, or stagger them,  making them contingent on the firm paying the cashback(s) 

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