Help with car dealership Jaguar Stratstone

[maximus999]

hi everyone,

 

I have a problem with a dealership where i purchased a car.

 

I am currently at deadlock with a well known UK car dealership.

 

Background.

I saw a car advertised on their website, I took it for a test drive and returned at a later date so my partner could take it for a test drive.

When she was out on the drive I saw a different car, one that i always wanted and this was not advertised on their website.

 

My partner returned and she told me she did not like the drive of the car she took out

i decided i would take the car that I was looking at when she was out on the test drive for a drive.

This was of some inconvenience to the salesman, he tried everything to get me to buy the newer car that I originally went down for.

 

The original car was newer, had a full service history, one owner from new and road tax was £30 per year.

The new car and the car I purchased turned out to be a 8 year old vehicle which came sold as seen

but turned out had 6 months warranty when he realised I was not going to purchase the original car i went down for.

 

We went inside to discuss the new car I had seen and the one I wanted to purchase.

The salesman sat in front of his computer, told me and my partner it had one owner from new,

they bought it from them and traded it back in,

it had full service history and tax was £180 per year.

The car was £12k and I paid for it on my debit/bank card.

 

I later returned to collect the car with a friend who took me to the dealership,

the salesman told us in a conversation that they dont normally sell a car of this age but it is of perfect condition, which it is, has one owner so they decided to sell it. He let me do the tax on his computer and it turned out to be £250 per year. I took the car home

 

a few days later the V5 document was delivered which stated 3 owners and I was the 4th,

I then looked at the service record and it does not have full service history.

 

I telephoned the sales man who was adamant it had full service history,

he got the photocopy of the service book that they copy for every sale.

 

He looked at the service and apologises and admits it does not have full service history.

He also stated that he couldn't understand why he said it had one owner and asked what i would like.

I left it in their court.

 

I reported to him at the same time several faults with the car even though he advised me it went through a 168 point inspection.

I heard nothing back for a while and i couldn't get an answer on the telephone as everyone was always in either meetings or with a customer.

 

I decided to reject the car within the 30 days as i was allowed,

they would not accept the rejection as I had not give them opportunity to rectify the faults,

I advised it was not the faults that I was rejecting it was the amount of previous owners and partial service history.

 

It has been 3 months since I purchased the vehicle

I do like the vehicle however i would not have paid the amount i did or I may not have purchased it knowing the true history of the car.

I did try to compromise and ask for a wheel package as a good will gesture to have the matter dealt with and they declined.

 

They have now had a solicitor write to me saying the company had no liability,

I took the letter down to the garage and spoke to the sale manager for the first time.

I could see he believed me somewhat but i guess he had an obligation to his staff member to carry on denying that i was mis-sold.

 

They are stating myself, my partner and my friend have been confused with the first car we took out for a test drive,

i know it was not this car he was talking about as he said the car i bought was £180 a year tax whereas the first car was £30.

 

I want to pursue the matter further!

Do you think I am wasting my time as I dont have any advertisements to back up m claim other than our personal accounts of the sale.

 

Either was a lesson learnt but you wouldn't think this of a dealership which boasts about customer service and that.

 

Thanks for any replies.

Edited November 27, 2018 by dx100uk
spacing

[sgtbush]

Car is missold/ not as described

They cannot sell a car sold as seen, they are a dealership.

 

Send them a letter before action if your willing to take them court, but you should be rejecting the car and asking for a full refund to give your claim validity

[maximus999]

Hi,

I have sent a letter to reject already, i have went through an ADR but i have been advised ny the dealership to go through the one they use for some reason.

 

I will take them to court but I am unsure if hearsay is enough evidence to prove to a judge

[BankFodder]

Yes, the "sold as seen" is nonsense.

 

Please will you tell us the name of the dealership and also the name of the solicitors you are dealing with and also please will you put up the solicitors letter in PDF format so we can all see it and have a laugh.

 

I have to say that your story is a bit of a mishmash and it's a bit difficult to follow. Are the cars different makes? It would be very handy if we could start off by saying – the Ford – and the Peugeot, or the red one – and the blue one.

 

You've been here since 2011 so of course you know what we say about recording calls and you have recorded all your calls haven't you?

[maximus999]

Hi BankFodder,

I didn't realise I was a member since then!

 

Sorry for the way I set it out.

The company name is Jaguar Stratsone.

 

The original car I went to look at was a red Jaguar Xe on a 65 plate reg, £30 a year road tax, one owner from new which was a lease company and it had full service history and came with two years warranty.

 

I bought a Jaguar Xf on a 2010 plate, apparently had one owner from new full service history and was £180 a year tax.

This is the car that turned out to have three previous owners, part service history and was £250 a year tax.

It is this car that me and my partner were advised from the salesman had one owner and full service history.

 

Sorry in hindsight I didn't think I would need to record any calls as at that stage I didn't realise how conniving they could be.

I did write them a letter stating I recorded the call to call their bluff.

I also have been advised from citizens advise to contact the commissioners office to have the telephone calls retrieved from Jaguar's systems.

 

I have attached the letter and the letter I wrote back (but I went to the dealership which was 40 miles away just to hand it in to them and for them to send it off to their solicitors and requested for them not to contact me again) & My reply

Jaguar solicitor.pdf

Reply to Jaguar Solicitor..pdf

Edited November 28, 2018 by dx100uk
merge

[BankFodder]

So you spent £12,000 on a second-hand vehicle, accepted verbal assurances as to the number of owners and as to its service history and didn't record any phone calls.

 

You are now proposing to rely on their phone calls. How do you know they have recorded the calls?

 

I suggest that you send them an SAR immediately and refer particularly to the recorded calls that they have had with you and that you want those recordings.

 

On the basis of what you have said so far, if you don't have a solid evidence then it will be your word against theirs. I expect if you put your case properly that the judge will tend to prefer your evidence but still by not having proper verifiable evidence, you narrow your chances of success quite seriously. Maybe to 60% chance of success. These are not odds which I like on the Fast Track

 

The second problem here is that if you do bring a claim then you are bringing it for well over £10,000. This means that you put yourself squarely into the fast track County Court process and this means that if you lose the case you will be liable for the other side's costs.

 

Did you record your calls? You didn't say so. How do you know that they recorded your calls?

[maximus999]

Hi BankFodder.

I really do like the car, however I would have bargained at the time of sale if I had of known the true circumstances of the history.

 

I was at a Jaguar main dealership and never thought in a million years this would happen, maybe naive!

 

I have asked for a compromise but they have refused, I also understand I would be liable for costs from the other side if I lose.

 

Would it not be worth me going down the route of a small claims and recovering say a fixed amount like a £1000 pound as this would be my argument that if i knew the true history of the car this is what i would have paid less than the sale price.

This would get around the fast track and other parties fees, it wouldn't cost that much for me if I lost the case to be honest but I would like to push on as it is sort of principle now.

 

Thanks for your advise so far.

[dx100uk]

at small claims cost are very limited. you can go upto £10k and it would be the same

 

look at similar cars what value do they sell for..

the diff would be the sum of my claim.

 

dx

[BankFodder]

at small claims cost are very limited. you can go upto £10k and it would be the same

 

look at similar cars what value do they sell for..

the diff would be the sum of my claim.

 

dx

 

Yes, this is exactly right. Go and compare some prices between the vehicle that you thought you were buying in the vehicle that you did by. You would try to start your claim for that.

 

However you still have the problem of evidence. Earlier on I asked you about the calls which you say were recorded but you haven't answered. Any special reason for that?

[maximus999]

However you still have the problem of evidence. Earlier on I asked you about the calls which you say were recorded but you haven't answered. Any special reason for that?

 

 

 

From previous post

Sorry in hindsight I didn't think I would need to record any calls as at that stage I didn't realise how conniving they could be.

I did write them a letter stating I recorded the call to call their bluff.

I also have been advised from citizens advise to contact the commissioners office to have the telephone calls retrieved from Jaguar's systems.

[BankFodder]

Haven't you ever read our customer services guide?

 

And what good has your bluff about having recorded their calls done you?

 

Have you not send them an SAR? And once again, how do you know they have recorded your calls?

[Hammy1962]

Don't forget the post on the Jaguar forum years ago where an owner took The Jaguar Guy Salmon to court as he claimed they damaged it whilst washing it. The concensus was he'd win. He nearly lost his house. It cost him a fortune and he only kept his house because he signed it over to his wife.

 

H

[maximus999]

Thanks for all the information provided so far.

 

I haven't read the guide and boy I wish I did.

 

I was just trying to call their bluff to see if I could apply a lite bit of pressure that's all.

 

I have been advised by a different dealership that they record all calls as governed by some kind of mandatory business law, I am just quoting this tbh.

The dealership manager stated he could go back and listen to any call as far back as he needed, but that is a different company. I would have thought Jaguar would be of the same stance.

 

If I go down the small claims as advised to recover possibly the difference I would have paid have I of know the true facts then I am under the impression there is no reason for any defence to counterclaimed cost as I have not caused any damage to them so therefore I think my best option is just to go to court and let the judge decide.

 

I have never read the background on the car wash claim but it is really sad that one could lose everything over a car wash but good for him to stand his ground.

 

With regards to the telephone call and SAR would I have to give a reason for asking for it. Also would one be able to submit a recorded call to the courts if the other party was not aware of the recording. I know I don't have the recorded call but I may ask for the SAR to work around me not having permission of the salesman to record but still persist that I do have it.

 

Thanks again.

[BankFodder]

No you don't have to give any reason for requiring a data disclosure. Simply send the SAR.

 

Stop bluffing or trying to trick your way through things. When they call your bluff then you will simply find that you have lost credibility.

 

The only way to win the senses by being very straight dealing.

[maximus999]

Thanks and you are right.

 

Could they just say they don't have the recording?

[BankFodder]

Yes they could - which why you always record your own calls

[maximus999]

Lesson learnt BankFodder I guess. It is sad that we have to live in a world like this.

I am self employed and I succeed I guess because I am honest and don't rip people off.

 

Anyways I have a small claims against haven holidays for damage to my caravan due to a decending barrier, the lies that have been said in their witness statements are horrendous, if the outcome is that I am at fault for that scenario then I think it is best just to lie like everyone seems to do.

 

Honestly that you for your help so far everyone. BankFidder is it ok to private message you and ask for advise on how to do a statement?

[maximus999]

Hi all,

I have exhausted all avenues and i am starting court proceedings. 

 

I have found similar cars of the age with the same amount of owners and service history to be around on average £1000-£1500 less.

 

A few other things to add which I am unsure if i can claim for.

At the end of the warranty I was involved in a car accident, non fault, I informed the warranty and jaguar that my car was taken for recovery but i had faults, they extended the warranty until I received it back from the repair shop.

 

After inspection they told me the rear wishbone was faulty and I advised them the rear door lock was also faulty but they never fixed them under the warranty. I have found that the exhaust is blowing also and advised them of this.

 

Since I purchased the vehicle over 9 months ago and within 6 months of advising of these defects (not covered under warranty) I have only done 2200 miles. Is this something I can claim (cost of repairs) within my court claim.?

 

Just to clarify  the vehicle apparently went through a 168 point check prior to handover (numerous faults found on day two) and I have two witnesses to what I was advised at the time of sale.

[BankFodder]

Well it's a bit difficult to pick this up again six months down the line. I notice that I suggested to you at least a couple of times to send an SAR. Have you done this? What did it produce? Did you get the call recordings?