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    • you need to realise that for every person that does come to CAG and register and tell their story...there are poss 10'000 that don't but search the interweb whereby threads that are here pop up relating to like issues they are searching upon.   Most CAG siteteam and many other registered Caggers give advice that bears this in mind and post information which not only informs the starter of a thread upon what to do, but also takes into consideration the readers from the interweb that also read the relevant advice given that might not be brave enough to register and fess up.   to that end, there is very little alternative than to appear to give 'grief' [you deserve it - tough] to a cagger should certain previous advice not have been followed.....yours is a very classic case of such. hey I've found a backdoor CCJ.   to put it bluntly, had you have followed such previous advice, you most certainly would not be in the situation you are in here now.. .so by example, not giving you grief, for future readers...………..   ...never ever move without informing a debt owner of a move of address on any consumer debt that you last used or paid within the last say 7yrs. your credit file is a major key to ascertaining that information.... .but don't just read this advice come to the consumeractiongroup.co.uk website and let us help.   lecture over... what can you do..or more importantly....what can a claimant do now they have a default forthwith judgement against you. well we can't guess.... they might simply ignore it as 1000's of people with CCJ's find out..but it becomes an issue should you wish to say get a mortgage, remortgage or further credit.   i'm not going to enter into any of that here...that's for the reader to start a thread here and seek advice on their individual situation specific to them as you have done....   so...  bearing the all of the above in mind...over to you with regard to this backdoor CCJ.   as for the other debts that you didn't action before...go read your old thread and action what appropriate advice is given there for each type of debt that has been given should you wish to avoid any further backdoor CCJ's.   dx                    
    • hello my very good helpful friend. I am afraid to say that i did not. As i did not realise the relevance of it.   Should i be doing this right now of anyone on my credit file ?   Plz don't give me grief if u have already advised me...   do i do the ccs request now to everybody in that thread ?    
    • aha busted and stupid ...no wonder you've got mixed information here. never trust anything they say ..they have a very bad reputation for stating the truth.   now can you go get your credit file please..   there are cases whereby a council on historic CTAX debts do go for a county court CCJ, but a liability order from a magistrates court has far more clout legally than a county court CCJ and i've never heard of a court sending a bailiff out for 'multiple' CCJ collection.   me thinks he is pulling the wool here a bit and has looked at your credit file and seen CCJ's too so thought he'd chance his arm and use those as further leverage.   don't worry about the sat visit simply ignore do not answer the door if he appears. your task is too gather data at present.   credit file please..        
    • Hi there, the company name on the bit of paper is:   Bristow & Sutor   Says the total amount £990.49 and this includes £235 enforement stage fees,  The CTAX was owed to North Tyneside Council. The guy also said that it wasn't just for CTAX. Other debts were combined.   I did leave other debts behind too when I moved. Perhaps a utility bill, credit card debts and a Provi doorstep loan.   I think the guy said that he would be back Saturday too. This is what I'm trying to avoid multiple visits. Don't want my mam to get upset.   Thanks for the help.   Bear
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dalesford

Cwd I have had a judgement in default set aside

style="text-align:center;"> Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 1704 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

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Hello,

 

I can see that a lot of people here are awaiting information regarding the progress of cases through the courts regarding CWD.

 

I can confirm that I have had a judgement in default set aside and that the poor young girl that CWD sent to the court was instructed to apply for costs (totalling around 3 grand), which the judge also declined.

 

I didn't get a solicitor and instead represented myself.

I am by no means clued-up in this respect, but a bit of research and advice helped get me through it.

I will keep people updated as to what happens next.

The judge has asked for: 'an amended defence within 14 days' and a 'Directions Questionnaire' to be completed by both parties by 10 December.

 

I plan to seek advice on my next step, as I'm not sure what this means.

Contest Jurisdiction as a first port of call, or file a defence

- both of which I shall be doing myself as I cannot afford a solicitor.

 

The UAE bank refuse to talk to me or respond to my letters and simply direct me to CWD as they have 'assigned the 'debt' to them'.

 

I of course have copies of all correspondence sent to the bank in the UAE.

Hardly helpful in resolving the matter...

Also flies in the face of what CWD stated in their earlier letters to me about being solicitors and acting on behalf of the bank in' the old-fashioned sense'!

 

Keep fighting this folks...!

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It might be worth asking for proof of who owns the debt, as if a Solicitor has bought the debt or has direct interest in the debt,

then they would have to declare this to the court.

 

A firm of Solicitors who issued a court claim about internet copyright infringements got into trouble,

as they had a 50/50 deal with the copyright owner, which they did not advise the court of.

 

This is something to look into.

There may be a CPR you can use to ask for CWD to disclose

whether they have direct financial interest in the claim they are making.

 

It is worth looking through some of the recent threads involving CWD as someone posted some useful information about how to dispute jurisdiction.

It wasn't just saying that the case cannot be heard, as UK courts can hear cases about foreign debts,

but it was a procedural tactic that can be used.

 

If my memory serves me right, it was not being able to defend because you would not have access to an expert on Dubai banking law

and could therefore not advise the court of information that they may consider.

And that no court case has been bought in Dubai in regard to the debt.


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dalesford, who is the claimant mentioned on the court documents? The bank or CWD?

 

It sounds like you have already filed a Defence. My best guess is that the judge has given you a chance to file a new Defence. This might be because he feels that (1) the existing Defence is not adequate, or (2) the existing Defence is not consistent with the arguments you tried to raise in court.

 

It might be a bit late to contest jurisdiction at this stage, if you have already filed a Defence.

 

If you want to get help on this through CAG, please start your own topic and fully explain the background.


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Dalesford this is great news to hear that someone has had a victory against the bully boys at CWD and thanks for posting your experience.

 

Please keep us updated on how things progress.

 

I'm sure everyone who has been in the same position as you will take heart from this.

 

It would be great if you could share the details of the argument you used to have the SD set aside so that those still fighting can benefit and prepare themselves.

 

Although hopefully now that CWD have suffered this defeat it might stop them from continuing cases against other people.

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So, theres a twist in the tale ,

it seems CWD HAVE been assigned these debts which means they are a DCA not a solicitor in the sense of acting on behalf of their client...

 

Therefore,

they must supply proof of assignment and the date in which they acquired these debts on my understanding..

 

Along with all other genuine certified copies or originals of paperwork, dont settle for anything less..

 

Id be inclined to also inform the SRA of their tactics...

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I don't know where budwiser gets the idea from that C W D have purchased these accounts rather than acting on behalf of.

 

If this on the basis of dalesford's reporting that a UAE bank said their account had been "assigned" to C W D,

don't forget that we're talking here of a non-UK, multinational banking environment where terms are used differently.

 

Even within the UK assignment, strictly speaking, includes collection "on behalf of" as well as sold debt - equitable vs. absolute assignment.

 

If, as stated above, Coyle himself claims to be holding thousands of accounts for ten Gulf client banks [and note the word "client"],

it would seem unlikely that yer typical high street solicitor would wield the buying power for such purchasing, even at the knock-down rates presumably negotiated on these obviously toxic debts.

 

I was interested to note the peculiar, chatty style of Coyle's letter above.

Bears more than a passing resemblance to the convoluted threat letters they send out, so presumably he does them himself.

 

Tracing services not regulated by F C A? I didn't know that. If so, then by whom?

 

@dalesford

 

Well done for having the guts to stand up to this bully single handed.

There has been an awful lot of talk-cum-anecdote, numerous abandoned tales but precious little action.

 

So as to enable ppl to view clearly the progress of your case from start to Victory [!?] ,

I think that you would do well to start your own thread,

rather than let it become diluted and mixed up by tagging onto this and other threads .

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dalesford

 

I strongly advise you to start a thread in financial legal issues forum with heading along lines of Coyle White Devine claim issued for UAE Debt.

 

Copy out their claim. List your grounds for requesting set aside.

 

These just for starters. Then you can get the appropriate help.

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Thanks but I've already got a set aside and I know how to proceed from here.

It's not difficult.

I posted more to help others.

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Forgive me but I thought from your thread two days ago that you were unsure how to proceed. Sorry.

 

Even so, an independent thread of a real court case would I think be of great benefit.

 

Either way, good luck. Glad you're not intimidated.

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@ Oleg yes thats a fair point,i agree,im only going by Dalesfords post,im just very suspicious of CWD!!!

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dalesford it would be great if you could post details of how you were successful in getting the set aside and the argument that you used so that others can benefit.

 

Thanks

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Hi Dalesford

 

Do you have any update on your case?

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Hi All,

 

I posted some time ago about getting a judgement in default set aside from CWD.

I am due to go back to the court in a couple of months for a directions hearing.

 

I have contested jurisdiction with the court, but didnt get anything back from them about this.

I will check with the court tomorrow what they say about the jurisdiction and report back.

 

My situation is much like mikey505,

debt paid prior to leaving,

plus some other complex issues.

 

I have asked the bank to investigate - they didnt reply.

 

CWD demand that all correspondance goes through them.

So I give them all the details I have previously given the bank

and they get back to me a cursory couple of days later to say 'their client' says they cant find my payment from 2009.

 

Clearly they looked REALLLLLLY hard - and I am being sarcastic here!

 

I find it amazing that CWD can say they have looked for my payment, yet over the years before this got to this stage, the bank in question couldnt even answer my emails or letters.

 

The bank who allege I owe them money also contacted my previous employer on numerous occasions, demanding money was deducted form my salary at source.

 

They also harassed me via social media - messages on Facebook and so on.

I kept them by the way.

 

I had to go and explain myself to my boss about the phone calls and faxes and he wasn't best pleased I have to say

- they shouldn't even be discussing this private matter with my employer.

 

This is despite, every time this happened, I contacted the bank, asking them if this was some sort of sick hoax and could they please get in touch with me. No one got in touch ever!

 

I do believe we all need to get together and fight this.

I have a meeting with an international lawyer a friend has put me in touch with shortly and will report back with any information I can glean - if anything.

 

Has anyone else been to court yet or have any other news?

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Hi Dalesford

 

Thanks for coming back and providing an update on your situation.

I am in a similar position,

received the standard letter from CWD just recently regarding one of the banks I allegedly owe money to.

 

 

The banks and collection agencies have been resorting to all sorts of disgusting behaviour,

calling my parents and sending emails to random people in the company that I work for trying to cause embarrassment.

 

 

I agree that there needs to be some collective action so that people can fight back against these bullies as individually it is very difficult for people.

 

I strongly believe that the legal argument that CWD is basing it's claims on is very shaky,

hasn't stood up to scrutiny by a reputable city firm and that they are only targeting people in the main with properties in the hope of bullying and frightening them into entering a payment agreement.

 

I work for one of the largest global law firms,

I'm not a lawyer and the firm only deals in corporate law

but I am getting some informal advice on the matter.

 

 

I would like to setup a support group that people could join in the hope of getting some sort of class action together to take the fight back to CWD. I'm sure people in the same position would benefit from a collective approach.

 

I have tried to post an email address on here before but it has been removed by the moderators to protect people so that advice can be given in the open on the forum.

 

 

I respect that but this is a plea to the moderators to allow people to reach out and communicate to others in the same situation. Could I post an email address please?

 

Thanks

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Hi Czar, I can see that you only have 8 posts,

but I think you can eventually pm me your details should you wish to connect.

 

I have to say I am slightly distrustful of online forums and would need to make sure that folk are who they say they are before divulging any details.

 

However, yes, I agree in principle that we should all group together to employ some expert legal advice to fight this.

I will let you know here when I have spoken to my contact.

 

Would anyone else be interested in joining together to fight CWD?

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Hi Dalesford

 

I think that you need 10 posts before you can send a PM to another member so I'm almost there.

 

I agree that you have to be cautious of online forums but if a group is setup I'm sure you can protect yourselves and others by having people sign up to a disclaimer etc and getting them to provide proof of themselves and their CWD engagement.

 

Let me know when you hear from your contact and yes anyone else please express your interest in forming a group.

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Hi there, Quick update.

 

I filed an acknowledgment of service document to the court,

 

then filed a defence,

 

the defence was not heard by the court as it was not submitted in the correct form.

this enabled CWD to get a judgement in default.

 

I asked for this to be set aside.

I got it.

 

CWD tried to claim around 4k for costs.

Judge rejected it.

Judge then gave us two weeks to submit new documents

 

thats when I filed a new AoS, stating all of the reasons why it was unfair to hear this case in the UK court and how it prejudiced my case, as I was not able to adequately gain access to documents in the UAE (except without returning there and going to jail as an alleged debtor .... err, no thanks, I don't want to risk even the possibility of that, even though I don't owe anyone any money....)

 

I didn't hear back from the court about contesting the jurisdiction

so I will call this week and see what they say.

 

I technically havent filed a defence yet, as it was not submitted to the court.

 

The Claimant mentioned in the documents is the bank in the UAE,

but one of their employees who responded to me AFTER CWD got involved

(who now incidentally no longer works for the bank - sacked...?)

stated that the debt had been ASSIGNED to CWD - in writing.

 

I suspect that there is some sort of 50/50 deal going on here that is undisclosed

and will push that any such is disclosed in court.

 

I have also contacted the SRA to make a complaint in this respect and provided them with the evidence.

 

I now have a Directions hearing in a couple of months.

 

I need to do some more prep for this,

but after I have spoken to a contact who works in international financial corporate law.

 

I would be interested to hear how others are faring in court matters,

but they dont seem to bother to post back..

 

. Any info appreciated.

 

Thanks

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Any news on the creation of the specific forum?

Any news on your case?

Are UK courts taking jurisdiction over these cases?

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Nothing further to report on my case as yet but setting up a basic forum via one of the hosting companies should be quite easy to do.

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Oh and it's now 30 posts until you can send someone a PM :sad:

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Hi

 

You should have a read of the court rules on this at https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part11. Particularly part 5, which is self-explanatory.

 

-(5) If the defendant

–(a) files an acknowledgment of service; and

(b) does not make such an application within the period specified in paragraph (4),

he is to be treated as having accepted that the court has jurisdiction to try the claim.

 

What exactly did the order made after the set aside hearing ask you to do? It would normally give a deadline for filing a Defence.

 

 

Apart from the procedural stuff, the difficulty with contesting jurisdiction is that Defendants should be sued where they are 'domiciled' (i.e. where they live) and there are very few exceptions to that. You would essentially have to say that another court is more appropriate for hearing the case but I'm not sure what that court would be given that you don't want to have the case heard in the UAE.

 

You need to think about fighting this on the merits as well as the jurisdiction stuff. Get your CPR 31.14 request in for a copy of any documents mentioned in their particulars of claim.


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This case may help you. It is different because the defendant accepted and took part in the foreign courts proceedings. If you don't take part in any court proceedings in Dubai, then you may be able to argue that a UK court cannot properly hear a case, because you could prepare a defence having access to all documents in Dubai. The large legal firm Ashfords have some experience with dealing with foreign debts, but whether they would help in this situation, I don't know. Some only represent businesses.

 

Sun Legend Investments Ltd v Jade Yuk Kuen Ho [2013] BPIR 533

The English High Court held that a bankruptcy petition based on a debt evidenced by a Hong Kong Court judgment could proceed despite the absence of an English Court judgment.

 

 

Sun Legend had presented a bankruptcy petition against Mrs Ho who was resident in England. The petition was based upon a debt of HK$3,655,516 which was the subject of a judgment of the Hong Kong Court in favour of Sun Legend.

Before presenting the bankruptcy petition, Sun Legend had served a Statutory Demand on Mrs Ho, comprising the Hong Kong debt, interest and costs.

Mrs Ho made no application to set the Statutory Demand aside. She did, though, make an offer to settle the Demand. She had also made a previous offer to settle her liability, prior to the final Hong Kong Court hearing. Neither offer was accepted by Sun Legend.

Mrs Ho opposed the petition and argued that, after Hong Kong was handed back to China by the UK, no treaty existed that enables a creditor to register a Hong Kong judgment in England and Wales. To enforce such a judgment in England and Wales, a creditor would need to bring an action on the Hong Kong judgment, seeking an English judgment based on it. As Sun Legend had not done so, Mrs Ho argued that the petition was an abuse of process.

Sun Legend submitted that, rather than seeking to enforce the Hong Kong judgment, they simply relied on it as evidence of Mrs Ho's debt.

The Court held that Sun Legend's petition may proceed. There was no requirement for a creditor to hold an English judgment as a precondition to presenting a bankruptcy petition. Liability had been acknowledged by Mrs Ho, who had previously made proposals to settle the debt in open correspondence.

The Court further held that a bankruptcy petition did not amount to enforcement of the Hong Kong Court judgment as the bankruptcy jurisdiction is a separate one involving a class remedy.

The Court held that a foreign court's judgment in personam may be recognised by the English court under English common law, if the person against whom the judgment was made had submitted to the foreign court's jurisdiction by voluntarily appearing in proceedings. In this case Mrs Ho had participated in the Hong Kong proceedings. Mrs Ho had raised no argument as to why the Hong Kong judgment should not be recognised under English law.


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Hi Dalesford, any update following your engagement with a corporate solicitor.

I have setup a collaborative chat room and group email address for people affected by CWD chasing UAE debts.

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Hi, I also had Credit Shield on my account.

 

I settled in full before leaving Dubai, but FGB refute this.

 

They have also not replied or responded to any of my contact over the years.

 

They also only seem interested in a lump sum, which I don't have

 

- I'm a full time carer and have no assets,

 

I struggle to pay my bills and rent, never mind a trumped up 'debt;

 

- what's the worst they can do?

 

I have nothing to lose!

 

I go back to court soon.

 

I shall report back on how it goes.

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court soon on what?

 

 

dx


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