Jump to content
tutty1

Northwest Parking Management Ltd windscreen PCN - Central Car Park, Peter Street. Carlisle

Recommended Posts

Hi,

 

I've read through a lot of posts, but can't find one that directly deals with my issue.

Please find attached the notice & pics sent to me.

 

I live in Scotland, so can't get any pics of any signage before the 14 days. I don't remember there being any notices except for the usual pay and display notices,

 

The problem with the parking bay was that if I had moved forward I would have had the front of the car over and I thought this would have made it more awkward for the cars next to me.

 

1 Date of the infringement 07/08/2018

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 13/08/2018

3 Date received 16/08/2018

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] No

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes

6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up your appeal]

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up No

7 Who is the parking company? Northwest Parking Management Ltd

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Central Car Park, Peter Street. Carlisle (stated on letter - I cannot confirm as I am not local to the area)

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. BPA

 

I'd really appreciate it for someone to take the time to read and offer some advice.

PNCharge.pdf

Edited by dx100uk
spacing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

from what I can see their signage fails to offer a contract for several reasons.

 

Firstly: the lettering signage with the core terms and conditions must be at least as large as the other main parts and this is impossible to read from google streetviews.

 

Secondly, the contract is only formed when you have read and agreed the conditions for parking and in this case the payment machine is actually in front of the sign so it can be said that in the absence of any conditions on the machine the other signage is meaningless as by paying the contract is formed before you get to that part so dont have to accept the second offer of additional terms if you dont want to.

 

Now the signs on the wall appear to be different from the main sign and neither have it clealry drawn to your attention that you are agreeing to pay them £100 if they feel like asking for it.

 

lastly, as we cant see the wording it is not clear what condition you have supposedly breached as what they say you have done must exactly match one of the terms of the contract.

 

Also there is a thing called "de minimis" where the breach is so small as to be trifling and not subject to legal action.

Your vehicle overhangs a white line but the bays themselves are not marked as closed bays so does that mean they would NOT ticket you if your vehicle was parked 2 metres further forward so as to just overhang the entrace to the bay because there is no defined "front".

This then brings into question as to how the bay is defined as there is no legal definiton in the case of off street parking, even for council car parks.

 

they say not parked correctly so that is open to any form of interpretation so makes the contract subject to testing as to whether it is fair or not because if it is only for one party to decide on what is correct and place the other party at a disadvantage.

 

Now your problem is that the parking co and POPLA wont consider these arguments because the parking co wont make money if they do and it is outside POPLA's remit despite being a sound legal argument. Many arbitration schemes are hamstrung in the same way so dont take that badly.

 

What to do?

 

i would sit on this and get a piccy of the signage and ticket machine in detail so if they do continue to try it on them you are in a position to let them know at ther last knockings that you arent ignoring them becasue you have buried your head in the sand but because you consider they have nothing worthwhile to say

Edited by dx100uk
spacing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many thanks for taking the time to look at my problem and for the detailed reply.

So that I am clear - for now just ignore the letter and wait to see if I receive any further correspondence, then take it from there?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes, I dont think appealing will get you anywhere because POPLA is hamstrung so might as well sit and wait and let the parking waste its time and money.

Keep every letter etc though and the parking ticket you bought as well

 

we still need to be able to read the small print so next time you are that way (or any other reader of this) get some piccies and post them up

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had exactly the same issue in the same car park.

I have had 2 different letters from different days parking there due to my bonnet being over the line (wheels were behind the white line).

I would be interested to hear what happened with yours as I am not paying the required amount for sucha trivial "offence", especially as on the days in question the car park was about 25% full.

 

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

star a new thread and post up the 2 letters with your personal details and any reference numbers, bar codes etc removed. leave all the date on though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

I've just received a letter stating they will be considering court action if I do not pay the £100 within 14 days.

 

I've not had chance to get back to the carpark, but a friend of mine took photos of the signs for me Unfortunately it is difficult to make out the wording.

It was noticeable that there were no diagrams relating to how a car should be parked within a bay etc.

 

If you in a position to take photos of the signs and post them up for us to look at that would be helpful for both of us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CONSIDERING. That is telling as it means not doing. I am considering going to the moon this afternoon but as I dont actually have a spaceship when I have weighed up the pros and cons I probably wont.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Love the example - although they would probably try to get land up there if they could!

I've attached some photos of the signage - split into top,middle,bottom so that they can be read.

 

It says must be parked within a bay, but the bay only has 3 sides to my knowledge.

I considered myself to be parked within the bay as all 4 wheels where inside the markings.

 

Scary to think how many of these letters they must be sending out for trivial things like this just hoping people pay it without question - not on really.

signbottom.JPG

signmiddle.JPG

signtop.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you pop those into ONE multipage PDF please

we will be able to zoom on them

 

please read UPLOAD


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

1. Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

2. Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

3. Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

4. The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hang on

this was a Windscreen PCN..ie a ticket was left on your windscreen?

 

how come they sent the NTK within 6days?

 

should have been 29-56 days..is this another vanishing ticket jobbie?


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

1. Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

2. Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

3. Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

4. The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No ticket on the windscreen - first I knew about any problem was when the letter arrived with the photos.

I've attached a pdf of the sign.

Thanks for helping.

NWPSign.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

short version is there is no defined limit to the bay so it doesnt exist. They say lines and not confines so if there was a wall there instead of a paint job would they claim you were in the wrong? Probably yes as they only make money by such pettifogging. They then rely on bullying to get you to pay up and most do.

 

If more people sued them for breach of the GDPR for obtaining keeper details under false pretences then they would have to change their business model

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, for now just keep ignoring the letters and wait to see if they decide to take it further?

 

Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes, they are unlikely to want to do court as it will cost them another £50-100 whereas a few scary letters cost £15

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi,

 

I've read through a lot of posts, but can't find one that directly deals with my issue.

Please find attached the notice & pics sent to me.

 

I live in Scotland, so can't get any pics of any signage before the 14 days. I don't remember there being any notices except for the usual pay and display notices,

 

The problem with the parking bay was that if I had moved forward I would have had the front of the car over and I thought this would have made it more awkward for the cars next to me.

 

1 Date of the infringement 07/08/2018

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 13/08/2018

3 Date received 16/08/2018

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] No

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes

6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up your appeal]

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up No

7 Who is the parking company? Northwest Parking Management Ltd

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Central Car Park, Peter Street. Carlisle (stated on letter - I cannot confirm as I am not local to the area)

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. BPA

 

I'd really appreciate it for someone to take the time to read and offer some advice.

 

Did you get anywhere with this. I’ve just had the exact same letter from them this morning. I parked my car and paid but I reversed into the spot. It seems that when I reversed in I thought all was fine as it seemed I was in the bay. However the photo shows that although my wheels were in, my boot overhangs the white line by a small amount - they say this is a breach.

I was intending to appeal it and then say I wil defend in court

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

, ignore them and let them waste their time chsing shadows. Enter ibntio communicatuion and you create problems that dont exist

DO NOT APPEAL but do start a new thread and give us the dates of your event and what you have received so far

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
, ignore them and let them waste their time chsing shadows. Enter ibntio communicatuion and you create problems that dont exist

DO NOT APPEAL but do start a new thread and give us the dates of your event and what you have received so far

 

Will do as soon as I’m home from work - thanks 😀

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

Please find attached the latest instalment from these jokers.

 

This is the 3rd letter I have received from them since my last post - it now threatens me with solicitors and the amount is now £170

 

I've also attached the information request from the DVLA - which took nearly 8 weeks to get.

 

What I find strange with the request is that it wasn't Northwest Parking who asked for it, but the debt agency ZZPS - how can they request the details before the NTK letter is even sent out?

 

The longer they persist with this, the more I want to turn the tables on them for breach of GDPR as mentioned by ericsbrother.

 

I'm assuming this is still just a case of ignoring until the court letter arrives?

 

Thanks.

Dreclett.pdf

DVLAReq.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

complain to the ICO about a 3rd party asking for youe keeper details when they had no reasonable cause to do so bearing in mind they have no "locus" and were outside the time permitted under the POFA

 

send a copy to the DVLA and pose the question to both as to what quality control is applied to these requests, particularly from a company that isnt involved in the first place. ask the ICO whether they think that ZZPS passing on your data is lawful as they had no lawful reason to obtain it in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to throw one in here - I may be wrong so am happy to be corrected by the experts - but have been reading something on Pepipoo where the RK is in Scotland and saw this from one of the regular contributors "Registered keeper in Scotland = outside jurisdiction of England & Wales County Court". Does that mean they would be unable to pursue or that they would have to raise the claim in Scotland?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

they would have to raise the claim in Scotland..but the muppets haven't realised that yet..to do that with their travel will cost 3 times the sum they are after.

 

the penny will drop soon..


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

1. Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

2. Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

3. Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

4. The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the event took place in England so english law decides. However, it will be dealt with in your local court and as said, their potential losses are massive compared to their potential gains.

If car park was in scotland then the POFA doesnt apply and ergo no keeper iability and that menas almost no lawful reason to obtain your keeper data. No trespass either so they cant claim for any losses that way either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi all,

 

Please find attached the latest instalment - a solicitors letter!

The longer this continues the more irritating it becomes - I think I will take ericsbothers advice and complain to the ICO.

 

Is the advice to just keep on ignoring until they do actually issue a court date?

 

Thanks for all the input.

sollett.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

redact the details off that letter pdq


The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Please fill in your quit date here

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    No registered users viewing this page.


  • Have we helped you ...?





  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • The “fact”, and I use that term guardedly, is that you allege a breach of contract so significant that it justified your resigning - "constructive unfair dismissal". That is the fact that you are claiming. You are discussing evidence here - something that proves the fact. Evidence does not need to be included in the ET1, and few would include anything more than a cursory overview. The tribunal does not "hear" your ET1.  They hear your evidence supporting the allegation you made in your ET1. Do you understand the difference? So evidence may still be collected and may come to light. Technically, right up to the hearing, although, in practice, you need permission to include any evidence not disclosed in the exchange of bundles.    If you have already exchanged bundles, although seems unlikely, then you would need the permission of the tribunal to add further evidence. 
    • You were of course quite within your rights to ask questions with regard to the member of staff’s authority over you etc, and all you legally have to supply is your name and address. It sounds as though he thought you were being difficult? This doesn’t help your case of course, but that’s how it sounded Reading your post.    I suggest awaiting any correspondence from the train operator and go from there. You mentioned you were read your rights, or words to that effect? You were cautioned, but it sounds like you chose not to answer any questions. This is of course your right, but in refusing to answer questions, you can’t really submit any defence for your actions should the matter go to court. That’s the whole idea of the caution.   reading your post, it sounds like you want to hold your hands up anyway, so is and when a letter does arrive, I’d suggest a ‘damage limitation’ approach and send the default grovelling reply asking to meet their reasonable admin charges to keep the matter out of court.
    • I'm sure it will. Take your time to absorb it and don't put yourself under pressure. You'll get there, lots of people have.   HB
    • Definitely, the more info the better for me... Hopefully some of all this expert advice/ experience will rub off and start to stick!   
  • Our picks

    • This is a bit of a lengthy one but I’ll summerise best as possible.
       
      THIS IS HOW THE PHONECALL WENT 
       
      I was contacted by future comms by phone, they stated that they could beat any phone contract I have , (I am a limited company but just myself that needs a business phone and I am the only worker) 
      I told future comms my deal, £110 per month with a phone and a virtual landline, they confirmed that they could beat that, £90 per month with a phone , virtual landline  they also confirmed they would pay Vodafone (previous provider) the termination fee. As I am in business, naturally I was open to making a deal. So we proceeded. 
      Future comms then revealed that the contract would be with PLAN.COM and the airtime would be provided by 02, I instantly told them that this would break the deal as I have poor 02 signal in the house where I live as my partner is on 02 and constantly complaining about bad signal
      the salesman assured me he would send a signal booster box out with the phone so I would have perfect signal.
      so far so good.....
      i then explained this is the only mobile phone I use for business and pleasure, so therefore I didn’t want any disconnection time in the slightest between the switchover from Vodafone to 02
      the salesman then confirmed that the existing phone would only be disconnected once the new phone was switched on.
      so far so good....
      • 14 replies
    • A shocking story of domestic and economic abuse compounded by @BarclaysUKHelp ‏ bank complicity – coming soon @A_Gentle_Woman. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/415737-a-shocking-story-of-domestic-and-economic-abuse-compounded-by-barclaysukhelp-%E2%80%8F-bank-complicity-%E2%80%93-coming-soon-a_gentle_woman/
      • 0 replies
    • The FSA has announced large fines against DB UK Bank Limited (trading as DB Mortgages) - DeutscheBank and also against Redstone for their unfair treatment of their customers.
      Please see the links below for summaries and full details from the FSA website.
      It is now completely clear that any arrears charges which exceed actual administrative costs are unfair and therefore unlawful.
      Furthemore, irresponsible lending practices are also unfair and unlawful.
      Additionally there are other unfair practices including unarranged counsellor visits - even if they have been attempted.
      You are entitled to refuse counsellor visits and not incur any charges.
      Any charges for counsellor visits must not seek to make profits. The cost of the visits must be passed on to you at cost price.
      We are hearing stories of people being charged for counsellor visits for which there is no evidence that they were even attempted.
      It is clear that some mortgage lenders are trying to cheat you out of your money.
      You should ascertain how much has been taken from you and claim it back. The chances of winning are better than 90%. It is highly likely that the lender will attempt to avoid court action and offer you back your money.
      However, you should ensure that you receive a proper rate of interest and this means that you should be seeking at least restitutionary damages - which would be much higher than the statutory 8%.
      Furthermore, you should assess whether the paying of demands for unlawful excessive charges has also out you further into arrears and if this has caused you further penalties in terms of extra interest or any other prejudice. This should be claimed as well.
      If excessive unlawful charges have resulted in your credit file being affected, then you should take this into account also when working out exactly what you want by way of remedy from the lender.
      You should consult others on these forums when considering any offer.
      You must not make any complaint through the Ombudsman. your time will be wasted, you will wait up to 2 yrs and there will be a minimal 8% award of interest and no account will be taken of any other damage you have suffered.
      You must make your complaint through the County Court for a rapid and effective remedy.

      http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Library/Communication/PR/2010/120.shtml
      http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/final/redstone.pdf
      http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/final/db_uk.pdf
       
      http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/consumerinformation/firmnews/2011/db_mortgages.shtml
      Do you have a mortage arears claim to make? Then post your story on the forum here
        • Like
      • 0 replies
    • 30 Day Right To Reject - Vehicle Casualty Report. Read more at https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/415585-30-day-right-to-reject-vehicle-casualty-report/
      • 57 replies
×
×
  • Create New...