Smart Parking ANPR PCN - Havens Bank Retail Park Exeter

[Mrfish110]

1 Date of the infringement 09/06/2018

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 22/06/18

 

3 Date received 25/06/2018

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] No

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes ANPR of car arriving and leaving the car park

 

6 Have you appealed? No

 

7 Who is the parking company? Smart Parking Ltd

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Havens Bank Retail Park, Exeter

 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. BPA

 

My intentions are to ignore as per the other threads (been doing my research before posting). Grateful for any advice.

 

Please find attached the NTK

[Bazooka Boo]

So date of offence is 09th and you received the NTK 16 days later?

 

 

 

If this is local to you, have you got, or can you get photos of the signage they're relying on?

[Mrfish110]

Correct the NTK was issued on the 22nd and we received it in the post today (25th) 13 days from Offence to Issue, 16 days from Offence (9th) to Receiving in the post.

 

I will have photos for all you lovely people on Wednesday (if the other half can take decent photos... failing that the weekend.)

[dx100uk]

https://cse.google.co.uk/cse?cx=partner-pub-0964707606882478:652l7hswbgv&ie=UTF-8&q=Havens+Bank+Retail+Park+Exeter+&sa=Search+CAG

[Mrfish110]

After re-reading POFA12 I now understand that if they sent it on the 22nd (13 days) it is presumed..

. unless they can prove other wise to arrive two working days (working days being not saturday, sunday or a bank holiday) after it was posted.

That would make it the 26th so a total of 16/17 days.... Very nice

[Bazooka Boo]

That would make it the 26th so a total of 16/17 days.... Very nice

 

 

Great isn't it

[steveod]

The first thing I would do is send them a subject access request under the GDPR.

 

I would also ask them why they processed the personal data of the registered keeper without providing a GDPR compliant privacy notice to the registered keeper.

 

And give them 14 days to pay you £250 compensation for the unfair and non transparent processing of your personal data.

 

I can help you draft this letter.

 

Their signs at this site are non compliant with GDPR.

 

They also don’t even offer a contract so you have plenty of scope to defend their claim in addition to the non PoFA compliance.

[Mrfish110]

If you're telling me I can turn the tables and attempt to gain money from them, then you are my new favorite person.

 

I will quite happily take you up on that offer.

 

I should have up to date pictures of the signs by Wednesday.

[silverfox1961]

Hi

Don't be too surprised if (Not so) Smart Parking deny they are out of time. I bet the envelope it came in either doesn't show a date or if it does, it was sent 2nd class post. If it was sent first class post they could argue that it should have reached you on the 23rd (just in time) but as Royal Mail often state, they aim to get 95% of first class post delivered the next day. You could easily be in the other 5%.

 

 

Havens Bank seems to be having a few problems of late, This is the fourth thread I have seen in the past couple of months. I couldn't see from the letter what they are accusing you of (unless I missed it) Up to date photo's are a must as the ones I have seen are from 2017

[ericsbrother]

it is not WORKING days, it is 2 days for service hence a max of 14 days starting with the day after the event.

If it was otherwise the Act would say so.

 

After re-reading POFA12 I now understand that if they sent it on the 22nd (13 days) it is presumed..

. unless they can prove other wise to arrive two working days (working days being not saturday, sunday or a bank holiday) after it was posted.

That would make it the 26th so a total of 16/17 days.... Very nice

 

They had the option of hand delivering if they thought that RM doesnt deliver on a sunday. That is in the law. tough luck to them that they dont own a calendar so it is 1 day late but that is still too late

[Mrfish110]

Exactly what I thought, such a pity they can't count to 14.

 

Just for my future knowledge, I understand that the NTK must arrive no later than day 14 with the day after the alleged 'offence'. So in this case Sunday 24th. (So either way I am more than happy that they have not complied with POFA12 as it arrived on the 25th day 15.).

 

However when I read this paragraph from POFA12

 

A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted; and for this purpose “working day” means any day other than a Saturday, Sunday or a public holiday in England and Wales.

 

So in my head the NTK was dated 22/06/18 so most likely posted on that day the friday. So if I add two working days from that would take it Tuesday the 26th. Meaning a total of 16 days have passed. So I'm a little unsure if I have been 'given' the NTK on day 15 or day 16 but I would just like to know for the future if I have read this correctly... either way Not so smart parking have no leg to stand on.

 

Mrfish! (P.S Not my name)

[ericsbrother]

this is about whether delivery actually occurred. If there is no argument about the date of service then this doesnt matter.

[Mrfish110]

An update for everyone I have the signs installed at the carpark attached.

 

Question are they compliant with various regs?

 

Does it comply with GDPR?

 

Do I play them at their own game or do I appeal on various grounds go to popla and use POFA12? I do fancy having at a go at GDPR but I wouldn't know where to start.

[ericsbrother]

You dont appeal.

If your NTK was the same as others we have seen from here is it just illiterate gobbledygook.

 

Let them watse their time and money chasing you and when they run out of patience you hit them with a short and smart (unlike them) denial of their claims.

 

A breach of the GDPR would occur if it can be shown they they knew they are talking out of their hat and thus obtaining keeper details under false pretences.

 

You need to understand though, the DVLA think they are not an arm of government but a private company given a golden egg to make money with so they are not averse to telling untruths and hiding the truth from parliament just to make a few bob.

 

Sadly tht is the culture of the public services these days, the NHS is worse than them because they also think they are a religion and thus can do no wrong ever.

Edited June 28, 2018 by dx100uk
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[Mysteriouslurker]

So will you respond MrFish stating those arguments or just ignore them?

[ericsbrother]

You ignore them and their pet dca's unless they send you a letter before action or letter before claim.

 

you then tell them why their name is an oxymoron with the emphasis on the last 2 syllables.

 

Make them waste their time and money getting nowhere.

Edited June 28, 2018 by dx100uk
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[steveod]

Nothing on their signs is compliant with GDPR.

And luckily they have included loads of privacy notice info mixed up in their terms and conditions which makes the whole lot not transparent or fair .

 

their privacy info is not GDPR compliant in anyway whatsoever.

And as anpr is used how have they provided the notification under article 12 and 13 of the GDPR where the driver is different from the RK.

 

Besides their main sign at the entrance is the one that counts and then they try add terms on with the other signs which is totally not valid.

Edited June 28, 2018 by dx100uk
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[silverfox1961]

I read those terms and conditions and privacy notice. It took me almost eight minutes to read, go back and try to make sense of it so the chances of making any payment within 10 minutes is going to be hard, especially if someone else was using the machine. Just a thought and nothing whatsoever to do with an out of time NTK

 

 

Signs at the entrance saying 'See terms and conditions on signs' is an invitation to enter and read but of course with ANPR the 'parking event' occurs when you pass that sign and then you have to find somewhere to park as it's not that big a car park then go and read the signs which would easily take over 10 minutes. That was just another thought. Nothing whatsoever to do with this case

[steveod]

in my opinion SP signs are not fully GDPR compliant which is a breach of GDPR regs. in any event as ANPR used, their data protection terms state "we gather information about YOU and YOUR vehicles information". The OP may not have been the driver and therefore they have gathered information of the RK and therefore have not provided the information to the data subject at the time of processing the personal data. this is a breach of the GDPR regs.

The GDPR regs also only allow processing of personal data where there are no other alternatives to that processing, and ANPR is not necessary and the alternatives are to use barriers or manned personnel.

The DVLA are also not compliant with the GDPR - they had legitimate reasons under the old DPA or could rely on the section 35 exemption clause under the old DPA but under the GDPR and new DPA they cannot rely on these.

[ericsbrother]

If it takes you 8 minutes to read the signage and you still cant understand it then it is not a binding contract. However, that is for the future should the point need to be argued with the other ones about sigange, etc. the number of complaints about this site makes it evident that all is not well. Bit like Excel and the Peel Centre