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    • Court is selected by you if you get an n180 dq form from the court.   Lowell will need to provide signed agreement s for both accounts in their POC to succeed as well as things like notice of assignment and default notices.   If you search here lowell claimform you see they have backed off with better paperwork than you have..those are pants..no ip addresses either i will guess.. Goodluck Lowell!!   Dx
    • I can't read it in detail now, but just skimming over it:   1.  Where is the title?  Didn't we say "Particulars of Counterclaim"?   2.  Where is para 19 and 20?   3.  I think FTMDave suggested putting the individual subtotals and Exhibit numbers against para 18(a) - (d) to make it clearer for the judge?   4.  what is this £3000?    "A receipts in respect of 3 items (a) - see Attachment 1 – Page-4-8 for:   (i) £3,000.00 GTM piling"   Isn't that £3000 already included in 18(a)???????   5.  Why are there two 18(c)?   6.  I don't understand what this means:     A receipts in respect of 3 items (a) - see Attachment 1 – Page-4-8 for:   (i) £3,000.00 GTM piling,                                                      (ii) Rubble truck £387.12                                                     (iii) £250.00 to Mellor the roofer   The two priced quotes in respect of items (b) (1) Cheshire Bespoke Building Limited for £5,190.00,  and (2) Mellor Roofing Specialist. (c) – see Attachments 6 and 7 - are attached in support of this counterclaim   7.  Does the last sentence need a paragraph number as appropriate?   Read #131 et seq again...    
    • Why not ring the contravention unit (sic) of the council first. Find out why this has happened, but I've a funny feeling it will result in you using the appropriate forms in that link.   They might deal with the bailiffs for you, as there appears to be some comms breakdown .
    • My final ticket:      1.      The original Claimant agreed to undertake building work (Project 1) at the original Defendant/now Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property in relation to 3 specific areas of work for an agreed price of £4300.  The work was:   a. To underpin the bay window at the property, b. To replace and repair a previously-removed chimney breast and, c. To install a new beam to the patio door.   2.      It was agreed that Project 1 was to be carried out under the instructions of a structural engineer engaged by the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant and that the Claimant’s work would be as a result of instructions received following the structural engineer's assessment of the property.   3.      Between June and July in 2020 the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant provided the Claimant with a full copy of the structural engineer's report which detailed instructions to the Claimant for the works to be carried out.   4.      It was agreed between the parties that the works would commence on 13 August 2020.   5.      It was agreed between the parties that payments for Project 1 would be made in three instalments. The first payment would be made at the start of the Claimant's work. The second payment would be paid at the halfway point of the Claimant's work. The final payment would be made on completion of the total works.   6.      The Claimant commenced work on 13 August 2020 and the first instalment due was paid.     7.      On 24 August 2020 the Claimant asked the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to arrange an inspection of his work by the Building Control Inspector.  The Claimant also stated that Project 1 was approaching mid-way and the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant paid the second instalment due.   8.      The Building Inspector arrived to inspect the Claimant’s work but the Claimant was absent.  The inspector was obviously very displeased by the standard of the Claimant's work.  The inspector spoke to the Claimant by telephone, asking him why he was absent and interrogating him about the work he had done.  The inspector then gave him some instructions over the telephone and also left a list of instructions with the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to be passed on to the builder.  The building inspector then said he would be getting in touch with the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s structural engineer with his findings and the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant should hear from the engineer soon.   9.      The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant passed on the Building Inspector’s instructions to the Claimant who agreed to follow them.   10.  The structural engineer visited and recommended piling to complete the underpinning for Project 1.  The Claimant explained that he could not undertake this work. The structural engineer then suggested an alternative company to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to do the necessary work and this company was engaged by the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant to complete the necessary piling at an additional cost to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant of £3000. (See receipt at Exhbibit-1).   11.  The Claimant asked if the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant needed any more work to be done and, despite the problems encountered on Project 1, the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant agreed on 7 September 2020 to have more work done (Project 2) at an agreed price of £2580 and on similar payment terms to Project 1.   12.  As work commenced on Project 2 and was continued on the remaining work for Project 1, the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant had occasion to make several complaints to the Claimant regarding the standard of his work.   13.   Barely a week after starting on Project 2, the Claimant demanded payment for that work.  After a period of negotiation the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant paid the Claimant £1500 in cash.  Both parties agreed that this left a balance outstanding on Project 2 of £1080.   14.  It later came to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s attention that the Claimant had removed material (including a steel beam) from the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property that the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant suspects either belonged to him or had been paid for by him in connection with Project 1.  When the Claimant challenged admitted he had done this.  The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant has included the value of this material in his counterclaim detailed below.   15.    On 21 September 2020 the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant highlighted and sent a snagging list to the Claimant (Exhbibit-2).  Over a month later the Claimant sent an employee to attend to this work.  It was not carried out satisfactorily and resulted in an updated snagging list being sent to the claimant (Exhibit -3).  All of this snagging work remains undone by the Claimant.   16.  Apart from the outstanding snagging work referred to in para 16 above, the Claimant also left other work from Projects 1 and 2 uncompleted.  That work which was not completed is listed at ( Exhibit 4.)   17.  During the course of carrying out work on Projects 1 and 2 the Claimant also negligently caused substantial damage to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant’s property (as itemised in  Exhibit-5) by not executing the work with the skill expected of a reasonable tradesman.   18.  The Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant seeks an order from the court directing the Claimant to pay to the Defendant/Part 20 Counterclaimant the sum of £16,577.12 in respect of:   (a)   the cost of the piling referred to in para 10 above which the Claimant could not undertake and another contractor had to be paid to complete; (b)   the cost of completing work the Claimant had left undone from Projects 1 and 2 referred to in para 16 above; (c)   the cost of remedial work to put right the damage negligently caused by the Claimant and referred to in para 17 above. (d). the cost of the steel beam referred to in para 14 above put down as estimated.   A receipts in respect of 3 items (a) - see Attachment 1 – Page-4-8 for:   (i) £3,000.00 GTM piling,                                                      (ii) Rubble truck £387.12                                                     (iii) £250.00 to Mellor the roofer   The two priced quotes in respect of items (b) (1) Cheshire Bespoke Building Limited for £5,190.00,  and (2) Mellor Roofing Specialist. (c) – see Attachments 6 and 7 - are attached in support of this counterclaim.     The defendant/Part 20 counterclaimant is claiming 8% interest under the County Courts Act 1984 from the 26 October 2020 which was the last day the       STATEMENT OF TRUTH   I believe that the facts stated in this particulars of counterclaim are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.’.    
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Hi, my name is Vanessa.

Can please anyone give me some guidance regarding this problem that I'm going through?


Please see the full story below:


Last year I went to London and parked my car.

I didn't have any change with me, so used the application "Pay by Phone" to pay for the whole morning car park. 12£.


When I got back to the car, I had a penalty notice on the windscreen.


I came home and I was sure that I had paid for it, so I appealed for it online.

I thought this "paybyphone" app was something new and that the officer maybe didn't check my car plate online.

I asked if you could please check their online records because I did pay for it.


I'd a reply from Lambeth council saying that there was nothing on their online records and so they were rejecting my appeal.

I should then wait for a formal appeal, the Notice to Owner.


I checked my online records and realised that unfortunately I made a mistake on one letter of my plate, that's why they couldn't find it online. Instead of an "A", I put an "S" which is exactly the letter next to the A. My screen is broken and with the light from the sun, I didn't realise my mistake until I saw the receipt.

I was waiting the notice to the owner, but I never got it.


Instead, I received a letter from the Bailiffs saying that I owe them nearly 800£.

I couldn't believe...I read a lot online and phoned the Traffic Enforcement Court and was advised to fill in TE7 and TE9.

First thing they asked me was my address and I realised that they had my old address in their records.


I filled in the TE7 and TE9, send it to the TEC and they send that to Lambeth Council.

The court told me that the Bailiffs would be put on hold while the process was being investigated.


I received a letter from Lambeth Council rejecting my TE7 and TE9.

They said that I reply to them the first time, by writting, when I was appealing informally.

After that, my address was requested to the DVLA and several notices were sent to my address and I never replied to any...


Unfortunately when I moved I forgot to change my address, so obviously all the letters went to the wrong address.


I phoned Lambeth Council and asked if they keep a record of the letters that were sent to me. The confirmed it.

I asked to see a copy of the Notice to the Owner that was sent but the Council said "you have no right to see the letters, we send them to you once and that's it.

You appealed to the Court, we as a Council also have the right to appeal against it. We have to wait for the judge to decide"...


This weekend I've got a call from the Bailiffs asking me why I haven't paid yet.

I told them that I filled in all the forms to the court and that I was told that the Bailiffs would be on hold.

The Bailiff told me that they had no notification and that I have until Wednesday to pay everything...

She also said that not changing my address with the DVLA was an offence and so I had to pay for the full bill.


This started with a simple mistake made in one letter of the car plate when paying the car parking and it got so wrong and completely out of control with Bailiffs requesting me nearly 800£ to pay within days.


I'm sorry is such a long text.

I am so lost and stressed and I don't know where to go from here...


Any suggestions or anyone that has been through the same situation please?


Many thanks,


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moved to the bailiffs forum

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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You have received a copy of Lambeth Council's rejection to your Out of Time witness statement. You need to wait for the formal response which will come from the Traffic Enforcement Council. All enforcement of the warrant should be 'on hold' until then


What did you write on the TE7?

What is the date of Lambeth's rejection letter?

How old is your car and is it on finance?


I am assuming from the amount requested by the bailiff (of around £800) that you have 2 outstanding penalty charge notices?


Did you do Out of Time witness statements for both tickets?

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Thanks for your reply.


Unfortunately, the Bailiffs are not on hold. They called me Saturday (28.04.2018) and said that they haven't been notified of anything. They wanted to arrange a payment and that I have until Wednesday (02.04.2018) to pay..


Should I call TEC and ask about this? I don't really know where can I ask for help...


- I filled in both TE7 and TE9. I put on the TE7:

"Following my informal appeal, I never received the Notice to the Owner to be able to make a formal appeal.

I only received on thursday, 05 of April 2018 a letter of "Enforcement Process Commenced" from Bristow and Suttor requiring a payment of 754£ by Wednesday, 11th of April 2018.


I am asking for this Enforcement Process to be put on hold and time to receive the Notice to the Owner and make a formal appeal please. FYI, I moved to X on the 14.08.2017 (Proof attached).


- Date of Lambeth's rejection letter: Monday, April 16, 2018.


- My car is from 2009 and is not on finance.


No, I only have one penalty charge.

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I will be critical I'm afraid and unless I am, other viewers with similar problems seeking to make an Out of Time witness statement will be completing their applications with as little information as yours. Because of the title of your thread, it would be one that would be visible in google searches.


I have been drafting these applications for over 12 years and I can assure you that if one application is rejected, I take the rejection very personally indeed.


The first thing to remember with these applications is that they are COUNTY COURT PROCEDURES and unless a motorist has previously completed court documentation, they really should seek advice before they submit these forms.


Secondly....and this is something that you will NEVER be told beforehand.... is that over 60% of these applications are REJECTED.


Thirdly, you will also not be told beforehand that if your application is rejected, you can request that the rejection be looked at again (to have the rejection reviewed).........but that there is a fee to pay of £100....and that this fee is charged for EACH separate penalty charge notice (the fee is waived if you are in receipt of qualifying benefits). You would need to have a look at court form EX160.


The problem with your forms is that you were required on the TE7 to explain WHY you were sending the witness statement late (Out of Time) and on this crucial point you have merely put this....I moved to x on 14th August 2017.


Although we know from your initial post that you had not updated your V5C you did not mention on the form whether or not you had.


Did you update your driving licence? If so, it should be mentioned.

Did you have a postal divert in place....if so mention that as well.

Did you update your address details with other agencies....if so, mention that too.


What you need to be doing on the forms is to explain the reason WHY you had not received notices and the steps that you have taken to ensure that it doesn't happen again. For example, have you now updated your V5C?


I would suspect that the reason why Bristow & Sutor are pressuring you is because there is ANOTHER debt that they are enforcing (possibly another penalty charge notice). Depending on the contravention, the Lambeth ticket at warrant stage would be a maximum of £513. Bristow & Sutor are requesting £754.


There is definitely another account that they are enforcing and I would suspect that it is this account that they are seeking payment for.

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Please feel free to be critical. Thanks to you I now start to make sense of everything that has happened...


Unfortunately, because time was against me and TEC asked me to fill in the papers ASAP, I couldn't search for advice before.


When you say that I can have the application reviewed after rejected, is it referring to Lambeth Council or about TEC's decision?


I didn't know I had to put everything exactly like you're telling me unfortunately, because then, I could have added much more details.

I phoned the DVLA this morning

and I had my address for the direct debit correct.

Which means back in 2015 when I moved, I called them.

However, when I called them, I wasn't told that I had to post the V5C to be changed so I never did.

I ddin't know... I had send it today.


Unfortunately, back in 2015 I didn't know I could make arrangements with the Royal Mail to get my mail re-directed. I have always updated my address with HMRC, utilities and services, etc, unfortunately, I did not know that I had to change the DVLA (I thought that HMRC and DVLA would share data...) and when I phoned DVLA, again, they didn't tell me about the V5C.


I have an European Driving license so I do not need to change the address, that's what the DVLA also told me this morning..


I swear to you, that's what Bristow and Suttor said. I have 3 papers from them and I have to pay the total of all of them.


The papers say: "Notice of enforcement". Two of these letters have a total of 173£ and one of them have 408£ (for some reason?? it has the exact same numbers as all the others, Debt: 98£, Compliance Stage Fee: 75£ and a total of 408£? on the others with the same Debt and same Compliance Stage Fee the total is 173£)....


I spoke to TEC this morning and the lady that picked up said that they haven't heard from Lambeth yet!

I said that they sent the letter Objecting to my request on the 16th of April and I received it at home on the 20th of April (2 weeks ago).


The lady said to not worry about that because maybe TEC haven't processed it yet.


She said that I have to call Lambeth because they should have put the Bailiffs on hold.

She said they cannot just answer to you and put the Bailiffs on action again.

Something is not right...

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I would suggest that you call Bristow & Sutor and ask them to confirm exactly what debts they are enforcing.

The debt for £173 has increased to £408 to include the enforcement fee of £235.

That does not explain why they are requesting £754 from you.


I would suspect that they are enforcing TWO additional penalty charge notices.

(One penalty at £408 and TWO others at £173 each equals £754 !!!)


Please post back once you have spoken to B&S

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have you searched the dvla database to see if the vehicle you put the reg in for actually exists?

If it doesnt then Lambeth have little to reject your assertions on as they will have received payment for somehting that doesnt exist so they know it was wrong and must apply to somene else and that was you.


Now the law allows for "fat finger syndrome" but your problem is the amount of time lapsed.


Also you say you have a european driving licence

- how long have you resided in the UK as you require a UK one if you stay here more than a certain amount of time (i think it is a year)

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That's a good tip too! I checked the plate number and it is a Bus that has that plate..


I didn't know about that "fat finger syndrome", thank you.


I've been in the UK for 5 years now. When I came, I was told that I could keep my driving license that was no problem as it was the European one. When I called the DVLA about the V5C they always ask about my driving license and it was never a problem...

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Just as an aside to the thread topic....



If you have a valid EU/EEA licence, you can drive any vehicle covered by the categories shown on your licence for the periods set out below.


Ordinary licences:

Until you are 70 or have lived in GB for three years, whichever is longer.


The phrase 'Until you are 70 or have lived in GB for three years, whichever is longer', means that you can drive in the UK any vehicle covered by the categories shown on your valid EU/EEA licence until you are 70.


Vocational licences:


If you are younger than 45, until you are 45 or have lived in Great Britain for five years, whichever is longer.

If you are over 45 but under 65, until you are 66 or have lived in Great Britain for five years, whichever is sooner.

If you are aged 65 or over, until you have lived in Great Britain for 12 months.

You must get a British driving licence to continue driving in Great Britain after these periods.



We could do with some help from you.



 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group The National Consumer Service


If you want advice on your Topic please PM me a link to your thread

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Hello everyone... I have news. This situation is MUCH WORSE than what I was expecting.

I've been crying my eyes out since I called the Bailiffs...


This is the situation:


I phoned the Bailiffs and explained them that I couldn't understand why I had 3 letters if it was only one penalty charge from London. (other times I called them, they never denied that it was from somewhere different than London). The notice of Enforcement that I received with 3 letters inside it's not from London... It is from Bath!!


I went in October, Sunday to visit Bath for the first time and parked my car on Grand Parade.

As it was Sunday (10.09.2017), I checked the parking signs and I didn't have to pay for parking.


The Bailiff told me that the fine is related to "Pulpeney Bridge, Bath".

It couldn't be parking, because I didn't have a parking ticket in my car when I arrived.


I went and googled "restrictions driving on pulpeney bridge bath" and clicked on the first link, BBC Bristol news (I am not allowed to publish links, sorry).


I cannot believe that this is about driving on this bridge

I didn't see any signs at all and I was driving around looking for parking, probably passed there 3 times, therefor, 3 penalties!


I'm so so lost... I don't even know where to go form here...


When I received the Enforcement letters I called TEC (thinking they were about the London penalty), they told me to fill in a TE7 and TE9, relating to the Lambeth. All the info I put there is wrong!

Then Lambeth objected and so I'm waiting for TEC's decision.


So, what am I supposed to do now??? I'm desperate! I


The Bailiffs were very comprehensive, they realised I was caught by surprise and gave me one more week to deal with this... Problem is, I'm away Friday (04.05.18) and then I come back to be in the UK on the 08.05.2018 (Tuesday) and then I'm away the rest of the week!


How do I go about sorting this Bath problem now?

The TE7 and the TE9 I sent to TEC is all wrong!

Where is the warrant issued by Lambeth?

I never received it..

. Does this means I have 2 notices of Enforcement now?


Please... Help!


P.S.: Thanks Andy for that information

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I am confused here.

You have received at your current address 3 Notices of Enforcement.

Two are requesting £173 each and the other one has increased to £408.

Are you saying that ALL three relate to the same offence in Bath?


There must have been another PCN for Lambeth as otherwise, how could you have submitted an Out of Time witness statement.


Where the address box is on the Notice of Enforcement it may say what the contravention relates to (which would be a CCTV) contravention and hopefully the PCN numbers (which will start with 2 digits and be followed by 8 numbers). Please don't post them on the forum...but do let us know whether the numbers have been given. Otherwise, you will need to call Bath Parking Services and ask them. Can you also ask them for the time when each contravention occurred.


What date are the Notice of Enforcement's dated and what is the 'cut off' time for payment to be made.
Roughly how old is your vehicle and is it on finance?
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YEs, it is the same offence. The Bailiff yesterday told me that it was related to the Pulteney Bridge in Bath. All I can think is that I pass there 3 times (I was looking for parking and I clearly didn't see the signs).


The PCN for London I have the number as it was related when I parked in London (they left the parking ticket on my window screen) when I made the mistake with the plate number.

All the info I submitted for the TE9 and TE7, I applied to the London PCN basing all the info I wrote there on the enforcement letter I got from Bath (It never occurred to me I have committed a mistake in Bath, so I always thought this is all about London.. all this time..)

TEC haven't processed any of my TE7 and TE9, and I'm thinking because it doesnt make sense the info I provided?


I have the letters with me. They don't say what the contravention is about. (I guess it should be CCTV?) but they do provide the numbers that you say. There's 3 different numbers. Starting with 2 letters and then 8 numbers...


The warrant were issued in Jan 22, 2018. All of them.

The Bailiff yesterday understood that I knew nothing about this and she gave me a week to sort this!


My car is 9 years old and is not on finance.

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Can you call Bath Parking dept and obtain the times of the contraventions.


You mention that TEC haven't processed any of your TE7 and TE9 forms. Have you submitted witness statements for these offences? Please do not do any more at the moment. The forms are the wrong ones. As these contraventions are for CCTV (moving traffic), you will need forms PE2 and PE3. They are a real pain as you will need to print them off and take them to either your local county court or a solicitor to get witnessed. If you take the forms to the court there is no fee to pay. A solicitor will charge £5 each

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I'm sorry for taking so long, but at work I cannot get on the phone :(


They told me: times are for each of the 3 of them: 11:53min; 11:12min; 11:53min. How can they charge me twice for the same time?

They told me to call TEC and explain them what's happening to get the correct forms first?


Do you think I should ask help of a solicitor for all this??

I have the proof that when I called the DVLA back in 2015, they updated their records online for payments etc but they never told me to send the V5C. So I didn't know that it haven't been changed... all went wrong from here.


Can we just pop in to a county court or does it has to be booked with them in advance?

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  • 2 weeks later...



I filled in an OOT declaration regarding a parking ticket, last month. However, the information I put on this form was wrong (because I've mistaken the case with another PCN I had, which I also didn't know about (never received any letters from the Council at all, due to V5C address not updated)).


For this reason, TEC has refused my application.

In the letter TEC sent me, they say that I should look for legal advice before contacting them and that I should fill in an N244 form.


Can you please recommend me someone that I can contact to help me to fill in the forms that I need?



Many thanks for your help.

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so BA was right it was another PCN from the ones you already had...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Apologies for that.


I got help me to fill in all 3 OOT's, so I'm waiting for that answer from the Court.


However, I can't contact BA at the moment, perhaps BA is away...


I have 14 days to fill in my documents and 5 days have passed since they sent me the letter.


So I'm starting to worry about it...

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You have 14 days from date of service (and not 14 days from the date on the letter) to submit an N244. It is really important to get a copy of the local authorities statement outlining their reason for rejection. I will draft the wording for you in the morning.

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