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whatever happens knowhow cover

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Hi Peepz

Firstly, new to this forum so Hello to all.

 

I need some help & advise.

 

I had my daughter tablet, a nexus 7 2nd gen 32gb covered for accidental damage for the past 4 years.

Last week she put on the side of the bath to use the toilet and it fell into the bath which her mom had just ran for her, She is only 6.

It caused the tablet to become water damaged,

 

nowhere on the knowhow's policy does it state anything about water damage.

What is more annoying is that it is called whatever happens & they state "mishaps & accidents do happen" but when I used my cover they have rejected it & returned it back to the store.

The engineers report has said it could be neglect & that I have to write to head office, which I have but I'm not holding my breathe.

 

What I need to know is, is it worth me trying to take them to small claims court to repair or refund me my money or am I just wasting my time?

I have done some reading I know you cant use FOS as these big companies have some sort of get out clause.

Will it just cost me too much & take too long that it won't be worth it or do you think I have a case?

 

How can they say a child deliberately did this or it was neglect? it is a very grey area, how do you define neglect?

if it's caused by an adult then I can understand but then a child doesn't have that state of mind to even think it.

Any advise is appreciated

 

The tablet cost about £225 new about 4 years ago

or shall I try watchdog or trading standards etc...

 

really angry that I've paid them all this time for a worthless cover

 

thankz

ice

Edited by dx100uk
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Could you do a bit of research and see what the replacement value is of a similar condition similar age tablet on eBay, for instance.

 

Secondly, can you tell us how much you have paid for this cover over the four years and also have you ever invoked it at all.

 

Also, who provided the cover and were they the same people who sold you the tablet


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pers i'd go for a full refund of the policy itself.

extended warranties etc etc have always been a total waste of time.


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Yes bought tablet from pc world who also sold me the cover. Paying £4.50 a month. Over the past for years i used it once before a few years back when my daughter dropped it and broke the screen.

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pers i'd go for a full refund of the policy itself.

extended warranties etc etc have always been a total waste of time.

 

in principle I would agree with this – but you made a claim on it already and that complicates matters slightly.

 

I've had a look at what I believe to be a description of the cover that you are purchasing and certainly don't say anything about water damage et cetera. Looking at what passes for the policy I would say that you are entitled to an equivalent replacement. I wonder what the equivalent of a 7 inch Nexis is now and how much it costs from PC World?

 

It all depends on what you are prepared to do about it. PC World/Currys are a nasty small-minded non-customer-facing bunch and when things go wrong we often find that they try to betray their customers and deprive them of their rights. Here you are specifically purchased to cover which as you point out appears to cover for everything including breakdown and "mishaps". Currys/PC World are very happy to sell this kind of cover and take the money even on an old outdated device such as the one you are talking about that when it comes to coughing up and they immediately get defensive and get into loss-denial mode.

 

We have had lots of experience of this company. We would advise people to stay clear and go to John Lewis. We have scarcely had a single complaint in 13 years on this forum about John Lewis.

 

Of course Currys are crazy because they can sort this out by sourcing an old reconditioned item which would scarcely cost them anything and hand it to you and get lots of goodwill in return – but they simply don't have the morality or good business sense to do this. Instead they keep on getting you to pay £4.50 a month which when the item was new would have required them to give you a brand-new item and now it is four years down the line, they could get away with giving you an item which was severely reduced in value even though you are still paying the same £4.50.

 

As I say, it's up to you. The normal procedure with this company is to have to threaten legal action in the Small Claims Court and then normally issue the papers. Once they have the papers in hand then they generally speaking start to see sense and they realise how expensive it is going to be for them to defend the matter, to send somebody to attend the hearing and then to risk losing.

 

However, if you threaten legal proceedings then you must threaten them with the intention of going through with your threat – and when they failed to respond positively to your letter of claim then you should issue the claim using MoneyClaim immediately and without any further notice to them. If you are prepared to do this then we will be very pleased to help you because this company needs a slap – in fact it needs several slaps to start to understand that it is more costly for them to try to deny the rights of their customers then to simply do the decent thing that any reasonable company would do if they had any self-respect.

 

If you did bring a legal action then on the basis of what you say I would expect that you have a better than 90% chance of success. I would say that there is a better than 80% chance that they would put their hands up and simply pay you out your claim plus your court costs.

 

I'm trying to work out exactly what their cover says they would provide for you. It's not clear to me whether they would be obliged to provide a new item simply one which is equivalent in type and in condition to the one that has been damaged.

 

Probably the best thing to do is to cost up the cost of a replacement on eBay. Get a good one – don't simply go for the cheapest. I can imagine it might be something like £75. On the basis that you are claiming for £75 then I expect that the cost of the claim would be about £35. They were probably a hearing fee and I think that is quite expensive now but the chances are that PC World will put their hands up before then – but if they decided to try and bluff you to test if you are prepared to pay the hearing fee then I think that once you paid it they would cave in and pay you everything. The chances are that they would cave in well before that.

 

This company is stupid and they would rather smash up their customer relations and the customer trust and the customer goodwill and also pay out a sum much greater and the cost of fulfilling their obligations, then simply treat you decently and that you have what you paid for. Lots of companies like this – but it is usually banks and financial institutions. I have a feeling that PC World and Currys are probably run by ex-bankers because they are all morally bankrupt.

 

Let's know what you want to do. It might seem like a load of hassle but it would be interesting and should produce a very satisfying victory


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Yes I dont want to lose out to these clowns but how much will it cost me? I written to them so will i have to wait for their response first?

 

Thanks

Ice

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If you win – which is highly likely then it will cost you nothing. If you lose which is highly unlikely – although you have to count on the remote possibility, then you will lose your court fee and the hearing fee. If you end up losing those then you will think that it really wasn't worth it.

 

Certainly you should write to them and wait to see what happens – but don't hold your breath.

 

Come back here and let us know what happens. In the meantime do some research and get the eBay prices of two or three good ones. Don't look for the cheapest. Look for above average prices and take into consideration the delivery costs as well. Print out what you find for your records.


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neglect is leaving it out in the rain, accidental damage is knocking it in the bath.

 

A 6 year old cant deliberately do anything in law so that is a non starter as far as they are concerned so no neglect or deliberate act.

 

If you do go down the legal route you will be suing them for the value of the computer as it stands so yes, get some prices from ebay or a local Cash Converter or independent retailer of such goods. You can also claim for the cost of the policy as they see fit not to honour it.

 

also, go to their facebook page, instagram or whatever social media they are on and flame them for this.

make the point that if a 6 year old is below the age of criminal responsibilty why can they say that it was a deliberate action when a child doens t know or isnt expected to know the consequences of those actions?

what do we have insurance for- just this sort of unforseen event.

Edited by dx100uk
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Thanks for all the advice you have a really good community here.

 

I will await their response and come back and update you.

I will need help raising a case as its not something ive done before.

 

On the extreme case it does go to court i dont have to take my daughter do I?

If I do I wont bother putting her through that.

 

What is max I could lose as I have to account for that.

What is fee to log a case and then the court fees? Approx.

 

I have put a few tablets on watch on ebay as they on auction to see what they going for.

There is one on there brand new boxed for £249.

Thanks again

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urm not sure I totally 100% agree with a court claim here

you wont get a new one either but a financial payment after fair use/wear n tear is taken into consideration

and that after 4yrs wont be much sadly.

 

dx


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urm not sure I totally 100% agree with a court claim here

you wont get a new one either but a financial payment after fair use/wear n tear is taken into consideration

and that after 4yrs wont be much sadly.

 

dx

 

 

I have put a few tablets on watch on ebay as they on auction to see what they going for.

There is one on there brand new boxed for £249.

Thanks again

 

Going for a brand-new replacement is pretty unrealistic and I don't expect that PC World or a County Court judge would agree with this.

 

I think that I suggested that you look on eBay for a unit which is in equivalent condition and equivalent age.

 

Site team member DX is right that you won't get a new one – but on the other hand I don't think you should settle for a cash payment which won't buy you a replacement. You've been paying this insurance for years and you are entitled to your replacement – but it has to be broadly equivalent.

 

No, your daughter wouldn't be expected to go into the court – but on the other hand a small claim court is really just a large room and everybody remained seated and it isn't like a normal court layout. I can imagine that if you bought your daughter in then the judge would probably have her sitting on his/her lap and it will be a lot of fun. Also, PC World wouldn't know where to look with shame and embarrassment.

 

However, for the amount that you would be claiming I'm quite sure it won't come to that. The chances of them wanting to take you into hearing are really remote.

 

I'm afraid I'm not able to tell you what the likely court fees are. You will have to look on the court services website to find out. The claim fee will vary according to the value of your claim. The hearing fee will be fixed, I think. I think that the chances of PC World continuing to be obstructive once they receive the court papers are pretty remote. It is just too low level for them to bother about and once they receive the court papers then they will realise that the game is up and they should simply pay out. However, you never know – you might find that you are dealing with some paralegal jobs worth who decide to take it personally wants to take you into court. In that case you would have to pay a hearing fee – but once again once you would call their bluff on that and paid it then I'm sure they wouldn't want to go to the trouble of sending somebody to court.

 

Where are you in the country? They would have to attend your local court.

 

I think that they should rebrand their Knowhow cover to Knowway cover


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"No, your daughter would be expected to go into the court"

 

 

Did you mean NO she wouldn't be expected to go to court ;-)

 

 

I know they would pay for a new tablet, I was just saying what they still going for. Plus the value of a second hand won't buy me a new tablet your right, which I think would prob be £150 for a mint one, but i'll let you know what the auction ones on ebay finish one. I want to them to repair or replace my tablet, & if it too old & they can't repair I want a equivalent one with same or slightly better spec as it's so old.

 

 

I will await their response & then will need your guys help in putting the claim in as I don't want them to get away with it, the amount I've paid over the years for the policy I could have bought a new one now.

 

 

I'm in Birmingham

 

 

thanks

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"No, your daughter would be expected to go into the court"

 

 

Did you mean NO she wouldn't be expected to go to court ;-)

 

 

I know they would pay for a new tablet, I was just saying what they still going for. Plus the value of a second hand won't buy me a new tablet your right, which I think would prob be £150 for a mint one, but i'll let you know what the auction ones on ebay finish one. I want to them to repair or replace my tablet, & if it too old & they can't repair I want a equivalent one with same or slightly better spec as it's so old.

 

 

I will await their response & then will need your guys help in putting the claim in as I don't want them to get away with it, the amount I've paid over the years for the policy I could have bought a new one now.

 

 

I'm in Birmingham

 

 

thanks

 

sorry. A typo by my dictation software! I need to speak more assertively!

 

If you get the evidence of several sales that it cost £150 for a tablet in the same condition as your one – then so be it. That's what you claim. Was your tablet in mint condition?

 

They certainly won't repair your tablet. I'm afraid asking for an equivalent one with a better spec is pretty unlikely. Frankly, your best bet, if you can afford it, would be to get a number of examples of the going price of equivalent tablets in equivalent condition and then to buy one and to sue them for the price. I would send them a letter telling them that as they have been uncooperative so far and because you want to mitigate your loss, that you will be buying your own tablet on eBay and you will be recovering the price from them. Tell them that because of the nature of eBay you will not be able to give them advance notice of the price you pay but you are giving them advance notice of what you intend to do so they have an opportunity to respond if they want


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No it wasnt mint so probably £100 then?

 

If they wont repair it i want a eqvivelent model replacement as their policy states.

 

I dont want to buy the same tablet again.

 

Id rather buy something a bit more up to date but need them to eithier give me replacement or voucher so i can put a bit more money in and buy a better model.

Edited by dx100uk
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I don't think there's anything wrong with you identifying the cost of a replacement model and then topping it up yourself for a better model. In fact if you made it clear that this is what you had done – with good documentary support of the cost of replacement – then if it went to court I think the judge would appreciate your honesty in the matter and that you weren't trying simply to improve your situation.

 

Just be very careful and methodical about what you do and keep all records. In fact you should give PC World advance notice of what you intend to do so that they can't later on say that you are an authorised.

 

Frankly by denying you your rights I think they have forfeited any authority to dictate to closely as to how you deal with it.


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you need to write to them telling them that their explanation as to why they arent paying up is rubbish (use the points raised here) and then ask for an equivalent or the cash to the value of (work out value and add their useless insurance charge to that bill).

 

Give them a reasonable amout of time to respond (14-28 days) ad warn them that you will take civil action to recover your losses that resulted from this breach of contract and that wil include all additional costs.

 

The court filing fee will be £50 or £60 for that amount but this is automatically added to the bill the court send out in the summons so if you win you are not at a disadvantage for taking the action. they will be forced to send someone to your local court fo they wish to defend the claim so another cost.

 

In practice they send someone round from their local store if they can to talk about the paperwork written by HO as it isnt worth their time to involve a solicitor or send a head honcho. Chances are incompetence and bureaucracy will dely a response to the letter but they will then settle after receiving the claim form unless they really think you are trying to defraud them and the paper trail will show that isnt so

Edited by dx100uk
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1 tablet i was watching on ebay ended at £70. That will be the market value now for a good nic used tablet of that age. Just await their response now so i can raise a claim

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I have just noticed that at the bottom of the first page, they say that where a replacement is needed, they will pay the cost of vouchers to the value of an equivalent replacement product.

 

Let's just go over this once again. What was the price that you paid for it when you you bought it new?

 

What is the price of a replacement product now?

 

It seems to me that we are probably being rather generous with them.

 

If you can get a good quality replacement from eBay then I would suggest that when you begin the claim from them you offer to settle for that but warned them that if you are obliged to take them to court then you will be seeing them for the replacement value of an equivalent product in their own stores – as per the know-how agreement.

 

I'm pretty certain that they won't respond to this reasonable offer, in which case I would suggest that you sue for the cost of a new replacement.

KHTA1.pdf


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New i paid £225

 

Replacement product now i dont know what that would be?

Mine is nexus 7 2nd edition 32gb.

 

So i should sue them for the value of the replacement product? Or value of my original product?

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When you get your reply it will likely talk about "neglect". It will likely say taking any electrical item into the bathroom is a bad idea. Your daughter is only six, so they will hold you, as her parent, responsible for her actions.

 

So, re-send your email to the CEO. The current CEO has now left to run Boots, but they will still be monitoring his e-mails. Send it now, don't wait for their standard argumentive response.

 

The address you want is sebastian dot james at dixonscarphone dot com

 

Good luck, 4 years @ £4.50 a month is £216. You might get about half of that I reckon. Ask them for goodwill as well, and tell them how "disappointed" you've been with your payment plan.

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What shall i say just what I wrote in the letter I had to send? Shall i tell them i will be taking them to small claims court aswell if they dont accept?

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Dear Sir/Mdm

 

I refer to my claim under your Know How policy reference number XXXX and dated XXX date.

 

As you know, a tablet computer – model XXX – incurred a "mishap" when my six-year-old daughter allowed it to fall into a bath which was full of water.

You have declined the claim on the basis that the damage was caused by "neglect". I disagree with you and I do not accept your refusal to honour your obligations under the Know How policy.

 

It is clear that when a six-year-old child – or anyone else for that matter, accidentally allows an item to fall into a bath full of water, that this is a mishap. This is precisely the kind of event is envisaged by your Know How policy and respect of which I have been paying £4.50 per month for the last four years.

 

I am writing to let you know that I'm prepared to accept £100 in order to source a replacement of a broadly equivalent item of approximately the same age which I am likely to purchase through eBay. This is despite the fact that it is clear from your policy that you should provide me at least with a refurbished replacement and if not a new unit of equivalent specification.

 

If I do not receive a positive response within 14 days then I shall begin a claim in the County Court to enforce your obligations under the know how policy and to obtain a judgement for the full replacement value of a new item which I estimate to be about £250. This will be in addition to the costs of the claim and the hearing fee.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Make sure that you really are prepared to issue the counterclaim. There is no point in bluffing. I can guarantee that they won't respond. They will put a million times more energy in trying to withhold the money you want then they would expend if they merely did the right thing and settle the claim.

 

Once you see the claim then you are committed. If you have any doubts then don't send the letter because otherwise you will only lose face – although frankly if you give in then you will have done that anyway.

 

Here is some fun reading for you: –

 

https://twitter.com/search?l=&q=pcworld%20%22knowhow%22&src=typd&lang=en

 

https://twitter.com/search?l=&q=currys%20%22knowhow%22&src=typd&lang=en


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Just emailed the ceo

Also joined twitter

What can i put on their feed short and sweet

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Well you can certainly start off by tweeting this message

 

whatever happens knowhow cover http://cag.tw/26rj

 

The short URL there leads to this thread. Other than that you can include their Twitter handle in any messages or tweets you send out – but don't expect it to make any difference. They really don't care very much about their reputation


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Thanks i wont bother if it wont make any difference. Just wait for their response now. Most likely next week with the easter break.

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