Jump to content


William Burroughs

Ebay and European law?

style="text-align:center;"> Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 648 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

If you are trying to post information which is relevant to the story in this thread then please flag it up to the site team and they will allow you to post.

Thank you

Recommended Posts

Wonder if anyone knows whether of not Ebay has any obligation to comply with European law relating to online selling?

 

I found this on German Ebay site : http://pages.ebay.de/help/sell/business/international-business-sellers.html which seems to be pretty concise.

 

Here is the UK version of the same page: http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/sell/business/international-business-sellers.html

 

Both pages are the same other than the fact Ebay UK have deleted the information about "online dispute resolution" (ODR) which seems to be something that ALL online business sellers should be offering if they are selling online and are based in or are dealing with customers in EU member states.

 

Also in relation to online business sellers "The Electronic Commerce Regulations (2002)" requires contact details such as email and phone number to be displayed in a "clear and comprehensible" manner. I wonder is a clickable link displayed in the bottom left hand corner of business listings truly reflective of providing the contact info in a "clear and comprehensible manner"?

 

Wonder if anyone else has concerns about Ebay seeming to ignore EU law in pursuit of even larger profits?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If they operate in europe, they have to abide by the law


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes my thoughts entirely. Take a look at Ebay listings and see if you can find any mention of the ODR process?....................I have not been able to find any and they have threatened me with a ban if I mention ODR in any of my listings, even though this is encouraged on the German web page!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You'd have to look into it for yourself of course, but I don't think that there's anything stopping you using ebay.de to list your items. If there isn't, there'd certainly be nothing to stop you mentioning ODR if you wanted to. And as you'd be listing your items on ebay.de there'd be nothing that ebay uk could say about it.

 

As far as I know, items listed on the .de site would still be searchable from the .uk site.

 

Might be a way around it :thumb:


We could use your help

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING

 

 

Please note that my posts are my opinion only and should not be taken as any kind of legal advice.

 

If I've helped you at all, please feel free to click on the little star under my posts and leave feedback :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They can ban for whatever reason they like. But if they ban for you asserting your legal rights, then you have cause to take it further


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
...information about "online dispute resolution" (ODR) which seems to be something that ALL online business sellers should be offering if they are selling online and are based in or are dealing with customers in EU member states. ...

EU online dispute res

http://ec.europa.eu/consumers/odr/main/index.cfm?event=main.home2.show&lng=EN


IMO

:-):rant:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You'd have to look into it for yourself of course, but I don't think that there's anything stopping you using ebay.de to list your items. If there isn't, there'd certainly be nothing to stop you mentioning ODR if you wanted to. And as you'd be listing your items on ebay.de there'd be nothing that ebay uk could say about it.

 

As far as I know, items listed on the .de site would still be searchable from the .uk site.

 

Might be a way around it :thumb:

 

As the UK is still subject to EU law as is Ebay not sure there is any credible reason for Ebay to ignore it? A judgement made by the EU in Dec last year relates to enforcement in relation to non-compliance and as Ebay (UK) is not complying with several different EU regulations, there is a vague possibility of action being taken possibly?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have contacted the EU about this and will post the response if anyone is interested? Seems to me that large tax dodging corporations can do pretty much as they please though so the chances of any sort of punitive action being taken are rather remote to say the least.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ebay are not online sellers, they are a market place, like Amazon also claim even when they sell stuff directly.

 

this is a cop out they use to try and make their own terms apply rather than whatever local law.

 

for example, it is illegal to sell Nazi items in france but what happens if a french person buys something from ebay uk and imports it?

Is there a blanket ban that applies to countries that allow such legal sales?

 

Well ebay say that they wont be posted on ebay.fr

but the court ruling in france went futher than that

then you have a problem that no country may apply extraterritorial laws but all of europe and the US do

so you can see where the big corporations get it from

Edited by dx100uk
format

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No response from Ebay as to why their German and UK pages covering EU consumer protection legislation differ fundamentally.

EU seems to feel that a UK based advice centre plays a pivotal role in enforcement matters related to consumer protection legislation, but the advice centre has an entirely different view.

 

It would seem that if the ODR legislation was properly implemented and business slellers were obliged to display direct email contact details on all listings, that it would be very easy to buy/sell without paying Ebay fees.

This I guess is the reason Ebay chooses to ignore EU law in the same way as it chooses to ignore the idea of paying tax.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Got a response from Ebay who suggest punitive action will be taken against me should I wish to comply with EU law and the Ebay user agreement which suggests all members must comply with legislation related to online selling. They really seem to be tying themselves up in knots over this as they are not able to explain why the UK is not subject to EU law like every other member state.........................

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you are using ebay.uk then english law counts. The fact that a company MAY sell somehting to a german buyer doesnt create a contract under german law unless the seller it targeting germany for its sale or has a substantial market there.

There is no eu law, all laws passed by the european parliament are then impremented via that country's domestic legislators. the mamber country cant say no but they can and do tweak them to fit in with their existing legislation. That is why we are going through brexit, otherwise a million laws passed since we joined the common market would no longer be legal in domestic law as they were done via a treaty and directives that wouldnt exist if the Axt that got us into the EEC was simply repealed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Directives

 

"Each directive contains a deadline by which EU countries must incorporate its provisions into their national legislation and inform the Commission to that effect.

The Commission assists member countries in correctly implementing all EU laws. It provides online information, implementation plans, guidance documents and organises expert‑group meetings."

 

 

The directive related to ODR was I think made in 2013 so it seems strange it has 5 years later still not been incorporated into UK law?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the you quote the Uk version and that is not extra-territorial so rather self defeating. Where existing legislation is better than eu directie it stays such as UK hallmarking law and BS numbers for safety standards.

Alreadt pointed out that the regs are aimed at companies selling cross border so of no interest to a UK seller sellingstuff to a UK customer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Consumer Contracts Regulations 2014 is legislation that Ebay would appear to be obliged to adhere too but is actually ignoring! Being able to side step this sort of legislation makes it an awful lot easier for all manner of [problematic] and dodgy sellers to operate using the Ebay platform. I guess though as Ebay pays no UK tax they very likely feel there is no need to take any notice of consumer protection law?

Edited by William Burroughs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

they arent selling you anything, they are a market place so if your seller is dodgy then you have to take it up with them assuming they are a trader ( whether they like it or not) You cant sue the council if someone sells you duff gear from a stall on the pavement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My point is that Ebay ignoring legislation specific to any business using its services to sell online, makes it a great deal easier for the ever increasing numbers of dodgy business sellers to operate unhindered. I wonder do you feel happy that large corporations can essentially do exactly as they please?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

irrelevant. Are you justtrying to make an argument about nothing just for the sale of it or is there a problem that you want help with as you havent raied one that is specific. If you have bought somehting that you wish to invoke your consimer rights with then say so, if you just want to tell us the law in Thailand is different to that in Serbia then if it was even remotely interesting to anyone they would have worked that out for themselves

Your argument is wrong as you well know, ebay arent ignoring it and the (unidentified) seller isnt breaking the law if they dont export as already explained but you knew that already.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Consumer Contracts Regulations which became UK law in 2013 suggest 2 things. The first being that Ebay deliberately concealing business seller contact information is a direct breach of the 2013 regulations which suggest contact information much be displayed in a clear and comprehensible manner, and the second that as all UK business sellers are through no fault of their own not complying with the 2013 regulations they are also in breach of the Ebay user agreement which suggests members must comply with region specific legislation.

 

In terms of dodgy sellers openly and freely operating on Ebay and specific legislation designed to make this more difficult being ignored I would say personally that is certainly extremely pertinent to consumer rights issues, as these laws designed to protect these rights have been set aside by Ebay for purely commercial reasons!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    No registered users viewing this page.


  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...