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jb000

Lowell Claimform - old Vanquis card debt***Settled Tomlin Order***

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Okay  here are few amendments....

 

Your Statement 

 

Point 6 remove " and the defendant has not entered into any contract with the Claimant."  The claimant has never stated that you had.

At point 12 remove 13/14 add the following and renumber the rest of the defence.

 

Defence

 

12. The claimant refers to the agreement at its point 3 in which it refers to as a reconstituted version of the agreement.It is denied that this is a true reconstituted version of the original agreement as any agreement entered into would have been by way of an on line application.It is averred that this reconstituted version cannot possibly be an on line application as it is devoid of any tick box facility and authentic log and pre contractual information pursuant to section 7 of the Electronic Communications Act 2000. Which recognises the validity of such an electronic signature by providing that an electronic signature is admissible as evidence of authenticity.Applicant are then requested to click or tick I accept  which is in a defined field on the agreement/screen.A reconstituted version of an online application could not possibly show a printed name with time date and a later dated executed time and signature.It is obvious to anyone that this has been pasted on to a set of terms and conditions.

 

 

Therefore it is averred that reconstituted version disclosed as evidence and on which the claimants claim relies is not legally valid pursuant to section 78 and 61 of the CCA1974.

Section 61 of the Act requires the agreement to be signed "in the prescribed form". The Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 2010 (SI 2010 No 1014). Regulation 4 governs signing. The only relevant prescription is in regulation 4(3)(a) which provides that the signature must be in a space indicated in the document for that purpose and dated. Regulation 4(5) recognises that a regulated agreement may be concluded electronically and that the document may contain "information about the process or means of providing, communicating or verifying the signature to be made by the debtor."

 

It is also lacking the address of the applicant at the time of inception at point 1.1 and refers to the applicants address being stated on the " Replay Card " of the application point 1.2.Further it is devoid of any agreement number and therefore cannot possibly be construed as a authentic copy of the application/agreement.

 

AT your point 17.....change......"  It is therefore requested that the Claimants Claim is discontinued " to Claimants Claim is dismissed.

 

 

 


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That's brilliant.  Thank you so much.  I have made the amendments and will drop it off at the Court tomorrow.  I work near to the Court and my friend is going to be with me for moral support.

 

As it is slightly out of the deadline, do I need to provide a reason to the Court or do I just hand it in as normal.  Also, I will obviously need to send a copy sent by recorded delivery to Lowell Solicitors.

 

Once again, many many thanks.

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Also add about the ROP and enclose proof of the refund to the claimant.....£160 less if you lose.

 

Your only a day late dont worry


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And I am still deliberating over NA8 which is quite concerning using your CRA screenshot as evidence of residency without consent.You may wish to raise that with the Court and if its a DPA breach


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16 hours ago, Andyorch said:

And I am still deliberating over NA8 which is quite concerning using your CRA screenshot as evidence of residency without consent.You may wish to raise that with the Court and if its a DPA breach

 

After the case - I would suggest that the OP raise it to the ICO - Im pretty sure that the action outweighs the legitimate interest to collect this account under DPA and would be viewed as excessive in this case. 

 

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Just to update everyone.

 

Witness statement, ROP letter and alleged credit agreement filed at court this morning.  I have also sent them the same which they will receive tomorrow morning.

 

There is nothing on my credit files, nor any searches.  The default dropped off my file a few months ago after 6 long years.  My file is completely clean now, and I'm hoping it stays that way.

 

 

 

 

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I can only assume that they got it when they acquired the alleged debt back in 2017.  I understand that searches only remain on the file for a limited period of time, so any search that they did then will not show up now.

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I am currently writing a few notes for the hearing a week tomorrow. 

 

My main defence is the reconstituted credit agreement they have produced. 

I understand that it does not need a signature (Under the HSBC ruling) but it does require certain other criteria to make it enforceable. However, as it was an internet application, it would have been a tick or a mark. 

 

In my defence, (kindly helped by Andyorch) in a true reconstituted agreement, it would have been an online credit agreement and therefore a digital signature would have been present.

 

Firstly, and this is probably my strongest argument, is the CCA1974 states that my name and address must be present on the agreement at the time of inception. My address is not present on any page of the alleged agreement and my name was only included 2 years after the event when it was pasted on to this document.

 

There was no credit limit shown and no APR.  In the document, it gives 6 levels of APR (A to F).  It does not show the true APR and/or interest rate which applied to the alleged account.

 

As this alleged agreement omits these prescribed terms, the reconstituted credit agreement provided by the claimant is completely unenforceable.

 

Am I going down the right road with this.  Any comments would be gratefully received.

 

I usually find it best to write things down to remember and that helps me get my point across. 

Nerves are starting to kick in a bit, but I will have my friend for moral support so hopefully I won't be as anxious.

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Yes your on the right tracks :thumb:

 

And dont forget to question the use of your Credit file as evidence and the DPA implications.


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I am trying to get my head around this at the moment.  Please forgive me if I'm being a bit dim as this is all new to me.  So the documents that say Digital Signature Application Details are actually screen shots of my credit record and nothing at all to do with the original application process?

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No connection at all .....the screen shot was taken from your experian or whatever CRA as  proof you resided at the address at the time of the agreement...which also shows details of your utility account.They have produced your data without your consent.


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JB

andy is taking about the credit file screen shots that appear on their WS point 26

 

you are looking at exhibit NA8 which ARE the typical documents returned from vanquis that shows your details upon application to vanquish for the card.


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Ahh,  the penny has finally dropped.  How dare they go snooping around any other accounts I hold.  That is not a simple search but a full check.  I certainly did not give them any sort of permission to do this!!!

 

Can they argue as they now own the alleged debt.  It gives them carte blanche to do this sort of thing as it was in point 17.2 of the original terms and conditions.  I would love to take them to task on this, as I feel that it is a gross invasion of my privacy, but they will probably hide behind those terms and conditions.

 

 

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Im sure they can use whatever they wish as evidence...but only in relation to the debt they are connected to....using only the documents in their possession connected to the agreement...which the agreement allows them to use your data.

 

I doubt a credit agreement with Vanquis in its terms and conditions allows for your data with other external agencies to be reproduced and used in litigation against you. 


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Many thanks.  I will be typing my arguments tomorrow ready for court next Friday.

 

I will be raising this to the Judge.  I will go along the lines of - Although Lowell Portfolio I, can access my credit file under the terms and conditions set by the original creditor, however, it does not give them the right to display and process information in relation to accounts I hold with other companies.  With this in mind, I will be making a formal complaint to the Information Commissioner for misuse of my data under the Data Protection Act.

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I have finished what I will be saying in Court on Friday.  I find it better to write it down as I don't want to get tongue tied or forget parts of it.  Once again, please feel free to comment or make any suggestions.

Court Notes.pdf

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Today I have been putting all of the paperwork together and filing it in a ring binder folder ready for Court later in the week. I want to make sure that I am fully prepared, so I have been reading the forums on the Court process and what is expected of me. 

 

It wouldn't surprise me that they read this forum and the posts that concern them. I am still dumbfounded that they are going to Court to present a so called credit agreement with no address and no key information to a District Judge. 

 

I suppose there are still a few days left for them to pull out, so who knows.

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There have been significant developments today, and unfortunately, they are not good.

 

Firstly, myself and other people that have looked at and contributed to this thread would have assumed that Lowell would have discontinued, after taking it right to the wire, however, this appears not to be the case.  It looks like they are going for it big style.

 

Secondly, I was reading the threads last night, a credit agreement exactly the same as mine was taken to Court and a Judge said it was enforceable and the defendant lost the case.  That knocked the stuffing out of me quite a lot.

 

Thirdly, and most seriously, I was having a word with my line manager at work (who is also a good friend) this afternoon.  He told me (off the record) that I was putting my job at risk if I lose the case.  Apparently, anyone who gains a CCJ is duty bound to declare it and disciplinary proceedings will follow.  I do not work in the financial sector where I know this is commonplace, but I work with confidential and sensitive information and was told that my employer will think that I am vulnerable to bribery and corruption.  Apparently they will take defaults into account, (I did have a couple of defaults when I first started), but a CCJ is a big no no.  I did not know this as I would not have let things get anywhere near this far.  I was told to get this sorted ASAP.  My stress and anxiety levels are now through the roof.

 

How I wished now I had just arranged that damn Tomlin Order with them a couple of weeks ago.  If I knew then, what I know now, it would have been a "no brainer".  I do not want to gamble with my job. Where I live, jobs are very hard to find.  I could end up jobless and homeless for just one "appointment" with the Judge.  I simply cannot take the risk.

 

So where do I go from here?  Is it too late to go for the Tomlin Order as the hearing is on Friday.  It would solve all of my problems at the moment and help me keep my job and my home. 

 

I have no savings, no property and my reasonable expenditure is just about my income, so they could not get much out me.  Perhaps £10 a month is the maximum I could afford.  I feel now I have burnt my boats and I am at their mercy.  I absolutely hate them with a passion.  But I also hate myself, as I should have researched fully the consequences of my job.

 

Is there any way I can sort this mess out before it's too late?  Any ideas would be most welcome.

 

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Calm down... A judge can still offer a Tomlin if needed... And you can avoid a judgement providing payments are upheld... 

I believe we have seen it here before but the team will beable to advise more.

 

If you are honest with the Judge (IF and I mean a massive IF - Lowell Win) and explain your situation then the judge might suggest that as the best option... But ONLY if you lose...

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a case 

and we've seen wins the otherway.

 

if you point the case please 

I bet it was judge lottery.


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

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FAO dx100uk

 

This is the one

 

 

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