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Involved in an Accident


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Some time ago I was involved in an accident i was a passenger a car 5 in total

 

The claim was handled by a firm of solicitors and was suspected of fraud by the other side solicitors due to no witnesses and the car driver claiming for alot of stuff , IE car recovery loss of earnings storage fees

 

My version of events were different from the driver

i remember him driving me home after the car was rear ended ,

he had said the car was so badly damaged it had to be recovered which was untrue

 

I had many awkward questions from our solicitors ,

it was said if i agreed with the others in the car case would be so much easier

 

I got took off the court directions

the driver disappeared

1 other passenger went to court

and was awarded compensation (won his case)

 

Now I’ve been sent a bill by the defendants solicitors for £29k

 

Any ideas what i can do ?

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Unfortunately, there is not enough information in your post for anyone to answer properly.

 

If a defendents Solicitor is sending you a bill for legal costs, this seems to be because as a claimant you lost in court and a Judge has directed that you are responsible for the defendants legal costs.

 

Does this sound correct ?

 

Do you have a copy of the judgement handed down by the Judge ?

 

If not, I would suggest you contact the court that dealt with the claim that you made.

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In addition to the important questions above, I see that in the face of awkward questions, it was suggested that if you agreed with the others in the car then things will be much easier.

 

Did you as a result vary your version of events at all?

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Unfortunately, there is not enough information in your post for anyone to answer properly.

 

If a defendant's Solicitor is sending you a bill for legal costs, this seems to be because as a claimant you lost in court and a Judge has directed that you are responsible for the defendants legal costs.

 

Does this sound correct ?

 

Do you have a copy of the judgement handed down by the Judge ?

 

If not, I would suggest you contact the court that dealt with the claim that you made.

 

OP it's important that you answer these questions.

 

If this is a personal injury claim it sounds like, for you to have been sent a bill for the Defendant's costs, the claim was found by the Judge to be fundamentally dishonest.

 

Were you at the trial and did you give evidence?

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That is correct i was taken off the court directions ,

 

i do not have a copy of the judgement as i gave this to my solicitor .

 

would it be too late to get a copy from the court ,

 

i believe it says i and the driver are joint liable for the fees ,

but i dont understand as i was a passenger in the car and had nothing to gain from any of it

 

No i stuck to my guns and said exactly what happened

 

No i wasnt there as i got taken off the court directions / never wanted to go anyway ,

 

gave what evidence i could to (our solicitors) so to speak

 

but got told it would be far easier if i aggregated with the others in the car

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So you weren’t at the hearing but you had solicitors acting for you?

 

Did they give you the judgement or did the court send it to you direct.

 

I also don’t understand what you mean when you say you were taken off the court directions?

 

We’re you making a claim for something after this accident?

 

And if so, was your claim discontinued?

 

I.e did your claim stop.

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Thank you for your help SV

 

As far as i know my / our solicitor came off the court directions before my particular case went to court ,

so my claim was discontinued

 

they carried on with 1 other passenger and he won his case and was awarded compensation,

 

i was never bothered about claiming anyway .

 

it was handled by a well known company in Manchester area who have awful reviews i have since found ,

 

i understand the defendants solicitors sent the £29k bill and the driver and i are responsible for paying it ,

 

i beleive the driver is in prison / transferred his assets over to his wife

so there not going after him

 

they are going after me

 

the passenger who told the truth and had nothing to gain

Edited by outnumberd
spelling mistake
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It's still unclear why they're chasing you for costs.

Did you sign something without reading?

Did they start a personal injury claim on your behalf and are now saying that you lied so they lost the case?

As a passenger not claiming personal injury (as you think you are) you were acting only as a witness and the solicitor could have kept your statement out of the equation if they thought it wasn't suitable.

I've never heard of a witness being asked for costs.

You gave your version of events and your responsibility ended there.

If they wanted you to lie and you refused, they should have kept you out of the case.

So give us more info: Did you sign anything apart from a witness statement?

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Thank you for your help SV

 

As far as i know my / our solicitor came off the court directions before my particular case went to court ,

so my claim was discontinued

 

they carried on with 1 other passenger and he won his case and was awarded compensation,

 

i was never bothered about claiming anyway .

 

it was handled by a well known company in Manchester area who have awful reviews i have since found ,

 

i understand the defendants solicitors sent the £29k bill and the driver and i are responsible for paying it ,

 

i beleive the driver is in prison / transferred his assets over to his wife

so there not going after him

 

they are going after me

 

the passenger who told the truth and had nothing to gain

 

 

Please stop trying to use the terminology and legal jargon as you're getting it wrong and making it very confusing for people.

 

Are you saying you were a passenger and started off a compensation claim with a solicitor?

 

So then why was your claim withdrawn before it got to Court? What reason did your solicitor give you?

 

Did the other side say you were lying about your injuries?

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I was a passenger and all 4 of us were advised to claim by the driver (i wasn’t really bothered but got railroaded into it)

 

The solicitor discontinued my claim because it was said i was too late submitting it and i had not complied with the court directions ,

 

they also said it would be much easier if I agreed with the others in the car ,

 

its apparent now that the others were claiming to gain ,

but it was just a small rear end shunt and in my opinion not worth bothering with ,

 

I defiantly wasn’t lying about my injuries because I didn’t have any

 

I may add our solicitors were asking questions about the crash 3 years after the accident happened and took longer that 4 years to be sent the £29k bill for the other side’s solicitor costs

 

Sorry if I’m coming across confusing I don’t mean to be

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I was a passenger and all 4 of us were advised to claim by the driver (i wasn’t really bothered but got railroaded into it)

 

The solicitor discontinued my claim because it was said i was too late submitting it and i had not complied with the court directions ,

 

they also said it would be much easier if I agreed with the others in the car ,

 

its apparent now that the others were claiming to gain ,

but it was just a small rear end shunt and in my opinion not worth bothering with ,

I defiantly wasn’t lying about my injuries because I didn’t have any

 

I may add our solicitors were asking questions about the crash 3 years after the accident happened and took longer that 4 years to be sent the £29k bill for the other side’s solicitor costs

 

Sorry if I’m coming across confusing I don’t mean to be

 

 

 

You said you made a compensation claim at the beginning of your post then said that you actually had no injuries. Sounds like a bit of dishonesty to me.

 

So you commenced your court claim outside of the 3 year time limit? Why?

 

Also, what directions didn't you comply with?

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“I was a passenger and all 4 of us were advised to claim by the driver (i wasn’t really bothered but got railroaded into it)”

This was handled by our solicitors who seem so specialise in this sort of claim ; they sent me to see their doctor who said i had light tissue injury around my neck , as ive said i wasent really botherd about claming but got railroaded into it , i actually stated to them i wasn’t bothered about claiming , this was approx 3 years ago at least

There defiantly was NO dishonesty on my part , naivety yes dishonesty not

From what i can gather it took so long to get to court because the other side insurance and their solicitor (who sent me the bill) were investigating the driver for fraud and many other accidents he had claimed for

Apparently i didn’t comply with “the court directions” this is what it says on the paperwork from my solicitors

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The test for dishonesty (at least for criminal cases) is R v Ghosh.

This has 2 limbs:

a) (objective), that the “man on the Clapham omnibus” would view it as dishonest, and, then

b) (subjective) that you knew it was dishonest, or (even if YOU didn’t think so), that you knew that OTHERS would think it dishonest or wrong.

 

You say it was naivety., but surely one would consider some others would think it wrong to be putting in a claim when you felt you had no injuries, even if others encouraged you to do so.

 

The (criminal) test for dishonesty is stricter than the test in a civil court, so if the Ghosh test for dishonesty is met it shouldn’t require a re-examination to the less stringent civil standard (laid out in Ivey v Genting), where the perpetrator’s state of mind (subjective) is less important than the “man on the Clapham omnibus” (objective) viewpoint.

 

It seems likely the (civil) Court saw your actions as dishonest, based on what you have posted.

 

Do you know what court direction you didn’t comply with?. Have you asked your solicitor?

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as i said railroaded in to it by the solicitors and the other passengers in the car "we been in a crash "

 

this post says it all even the same solicitors

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?339356-No-Win-No-Fee-Solicitors-have-sent-me-a-bill

 

The test for dishonesty (at least for criminal cases) is R v Ghosh.

This has 2 limbs:

a) (objective), that the “man on the Clapham omnibus” would view it as dishonest, and, then

b) (subjective) that you knew it was dishonest, or (even if YOU didn’t think so), that you knew that others would think it dishonest or wrong.

 

You say it was naivety., but surely one would consider some others would think it wrong to be putting in a claim when you felt you had no injuries, even if others encouraged you to do so.

 

The (criminal) test for dishonesty is stricter than the test in a civil court, so if the Ghosh test for dishonesty is met it shouldn’t require a re-examination to the less stringent civil standard (laid out in Ivey v Genting), where the perpetrator’s state of mind (subjective) is less important than the “man on the Clapham omnibus” (objective) viewpoint.

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That post mentioned “no win, no fee”.

There is no fee if no win, as there is insurance involved against losing.

That insurance is voidable if there is dishonesty ......

 

So it becomes “no win, no fee, provided you aren’t dishonest”....... and this gets highlighted (or should!) when the NWNF agreement is made.

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as i said railroaded in to it by the solicitors and the other passengers in the car "we been in a crash "

 

this post says it all even the same solicitors

 

I’m wondering (since the interests of all the claimants aren’t directly aligned) if you may be able to show that the solicitors had a “client conflict” ; should they have stopped acting for one or more claimants either

a) from the outset, or

b) when it became apparent that not all the claimant’s interests were identically aligned ......

 

It shouldn’t be for a solicitor to “railroad” a client.

They should offer advice (even if it is “I strongly advise....”), but the client decides.

 

They should act for you, not you for them!

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as i said railroaded in to it by the solicitors and the other passengers in the car "we been in a crash "

 

this post says it all even the same solicitors

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?339356-No-Win-No-Fee-Solicitors-have-sent-me-a-bill

 

What you need to do now.

 

1) Obtain a copy of the court orders issued against you, by contacting the court concerned.

 

2) See a Solicitors you trust to look into appealing against these costs.

 

Suggest you get on to this urgently, otherwise you risk bailiffs attending to collect the £29k and looking at what enforcement actions to take e.g seizing any car or goods you own to be sold. If you own a house, a charging order against the house to recover the money may be requested by the Solicitors chasing the £29k costs.

We could do with some help from you.

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That post mentioned “no win, no fee”.

There is no fee if no win, as there is insurance involved against losing.

That insurance is voidable if there is dishonesty ......

 

So it becomes “no win, no fee, provided you aren’t dishonest”....... and this gets highlighted (or should!) when the NWNF agreement is made.

 

Just for clarity:

I’m not saying that OP was dishonest, just that dishonesty may be a factor in your case.

 

(For that previous case) :NWNF Insurance cover also ceases if your insurers say “we advise the claim should be discontinued”.

If the claimant instructs the claim should be continued, they are in line of fire for the costs from that point on, if they lose.

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OK so what I gather from all of this:

 


    OP is a passenger in a car with 4 others (3 passengers + driver) - involved in a rear end shunt [date of accident?].

    Driver suggests that all parties should claim for personal injury, although OP states that he was not injured.

    Firm in Manchester is instructed [for all 5 claims?] on a no win no fee basis, including OP's claim even though he says he wasn't injured.

    OP is examined by a GP and told he has an injury, even though he says he was not injured.

    Something then happens which drags this claim out to on or past the limitation period (3 years after the accident date).

    Solicitors issue court proceedings [on all 5 claims?].

    OP's claim is either issued or served late.

    During the litigation process it appears that OP's story differs slightly from the driver's (and other passengers?) story.

    Solicitors try to convince OP to change his story to match driver's, but OP refuses.

    Solicitors then discontinue OP's claim [i'm wondering if the OP is confused here - Solicitors may just have come off the record due to the conflict as mentioned by Bazza].

    OP is then not called as a witness, and/or does not attend Court.

    Court finds in favour of the Defendant, dismisses all the claims except for 1, and awards costs against all claimants whose claims failed.

 

My thought is that this accident occurred before April 2013 and one of two things has happened. Either, the OPs solicitors have discontinued, and I believe that pre-QOCS, if a claimant discontinues, a Defendant is entitled to costs as usual under CPR 38.6 and CPR 44.9.

 

Or the OPs solicitors came off record due to the conflict, and the claim went on, OP didn't attend court and therefore claim was found against him (pre-QOCS so cost award as usual).

 

OP you need your solicitors who were dealing with your claim to send you a copy of ALL the papers they have on your claim. This needs to be done as well as what unclebulgaria suggested above. Any new solicitors you instruct will need to see everything.

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