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Hi,

On 18 Nov 17 I received a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) through the post stating that my vehicle was parked longer than the maximum period allowed on 07 Nov 17.

 

On the 19 Nov 17 I sent the following appeal to ECP:

 

Dear ECP

 

As the registered keeper of the vehicle, registration xxxx xxx, I have received your invoice number xxxxxxxxxxx.

 

The driver at the time tells me that they did not notice any signs telling them about the time limit and that the fact that it’s a free car park they didn’t even think of looking for such sign.

 

Whilst parked she was shopping at Tesco then headed to Costa to meet an old Friend for lunch,

and that she is therefore not liable to pay you any money as she was using the shopping facilities.

 

On conducting some research about Bishops Centre car park and shops;

unbeknown to us it is possible to speak to the staff in the shops and restaurants and request that your car is exempt from charge, which is also free of charge.

This means the 3 hour rule isn’t a rule in which must be complied with at no exception.

 

As she was parked there on a Tuesday morning, school hours; the car park was less than 40% full, therefore she was not taking up a space that someone else could have had and no losses would have been made.

 

If you reject this appeal, please issue me with a valid POPLA code.

 

At POPLA I shall be asking for a breakdown of the genuine pre estimate of loss that the charge must represent, which might I add that since it was a free cark park, and also it was far from "at full capacity" then there was no loss.

 

Yours

 

Registered Keeper.

 

Since then they rejected my appeal under the grounds of my vehicle being in breach of the terms and conditions of the car park.

 

In the rejection letter i have also noticed that it says

"This signage is quite clearly states that if your vehicle is in breach of the teams and conditions of the carpark then a PCN will be issued.

 

To me they have admitted that it doesn't CLEARLY state this, but it QUITE clearly states this meaning they are not 100%.

 

I don't know if this is worth mentioning.

 

I personally feel that this is an unfair charge as my wife was genually shopping in the facilities where she was parked.

And that it it possible to be exempt from paying if you speak to the shop managers, which isn't stated in there terms and conditions.

 

I have a unique POPLA code,

my question is,

do i have grounds to continue with my appeal or should i just pay

 

Thank you so much in advance.

 

Zoe2640

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no you never pay these speculative invoices

 

can you fill this out please

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462118-Have-you-received-a-Parking-Ticket-(2-Viewing)-nbsp

 

and scan up to PDF the NTK

read upload

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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parking companies make a lot of money because people want to settle these matters quickly so pay up even though they are unsure the supposed breach is genuine or because they think if they dont get it sorted terrible things may happen.

 

As you have appealed as the keeper you would be wise to post up the NTK you received so we can see if it asctually creates a keeper liability as many dont.

there is a prescribed wording in the law that 75% of the parking companies have failed to copy for their notices despite it being just a cut and paste job and as a result fail to create a keeper liability. As they are too thick to do this they are also too stupid to realise when they are wrong so will continue to say you owe them money regardless of what you say.

 

For this reason I wouldnt be in a hurry to appeal to POPLA,

get images of the signage,

the entrance to the car park from the public highway

and give us an indication of where their signs are and how many.

 

After that we will suggest the wording for an appeal based on this as POPLA dont allow appeals based on keeper liabiliy despite the law being clear on how this is created.

 

In fact, any challenge to the lagality of the signage or contract is met with the same response,

and that is the driver accepted ther terms regardless so pay up (wong and wrong again).

This emboldens the parking co's to then continue because they think they have a green light legally speaking when that is usually not true.

 

Are you happy to accept that this is a long process?

If so continue fighting at your pace, not to their deadlines.

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100Mb of single files merged and shrunk to 5Mb

please read upload next time.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

their letter of rejection is a standard letter and as such not compliant with the POFA

BUT no-one has ever been pulled up on this point and probably never will.

 

More importantly the signage is flawed as it says that certain things MAY result in a charge.

This is not an offer of a cotract nor a breach of contract as there is no clear offer of terms.

It also says they are operating on behlaf of Land securities Ltd so are they saying they are agents and as such have no rights anyway?

 

If you want to appeal to POPLA I would appeal on this point only and that way you will cost them money and possibly get the answer to that question ( POPLA used to sedn the appellant all of the evidence but these days they send the parking co yours but no the other way round, preferring to state they have seen the contract and all ois well when it has been proven not to be so) but as they dont actually consider the law you wont win because they will say you agreed to the terms and ignore the lack of authority.

 

This keeps your other more important evidence concealed for the moment as at that point they will be emboldend to think they have got you worried. You can hit them with other matters later at a point when they are considering whether to throw some proper money at this and a robust refutation of their claim will then make them think about the risk/reward.

Edited by honeybee13
Paras
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