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Criminal damage, police being witness - taking him to court need help!

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Hi everyone am posting this on behalf of a family member who is in this situation and doesn't use the internet.

 

family member is a professional for the government.

I will just refer to them as X..

 

X got their car keyed as did all the government team in a hospital car park by one of their service users who has a mental illness.

Every single one of the people who got their cars keyed by this person reported it.

 

The hospital captured this on CCTV which they have stated is 1080P sharp and clear and shows this person doing it.

 

The police were called as a result and took the CCTV footage.

All staff have so far settled claims either through insurance or cheapest quote.

 

The mental patient here as well does have money as he jumped out of a window whilst in NHS care and got a substanial 8 figure sum from the NHS.

 

X reported it to the police too, who under caution interviewed this service user/mental patient.

The patient admitted keying X's car in a taped interview to the police.

He said he did not realise X was not part of the government local team he keyed.

Guilty person said he would pay full damages for repair of the car.

 

X waited for him to pay 2-3 months but he did not,

the police were chasing the service user/mental patient and the police had him mentally checked and a doctor declared he was under his own capacity of thought and has known what he did, so he is not unfit to be prosecuted.

 

Police chased him for another month and told X not to worry they will be a witness in the small claims court if needs be to recover losses.

X has this in writing in emails and alot of email evidence.

 

Guilty party/person never paid and police now turn around and say X must get 3 quotes to satisfy guilty party's solicitor.

X got 3 quotes, cheapest was £1400 inc car hire.

Guilty party refused to pay it claiming it was too much.

X was told the police cannot force him to pay it and X would need to go to small claims court.

 

X filed in small claims court and the defendant/guilty party failed to respond within 14 days.

X then filed judgement using MCOL online.

X has today has a letter saying judgement has been entered.

 

Now the Police have come back and said the guilty party will pay £1300 (excluding car hire) but will not pay court fees.

 

Police have advised X to take the above as they will not be a witness if X does not take the above deal.

 

X advised them can they put in writing (police after speaking to guilty party solicitor.)

Police stated no they will not put in writing again cannot make him pay.

 

X refused police's offer and stated the guilty party has had many opportunites to pay before court.

Police offer now has told X in a u-turn that 2 weeks later after judgement has been filed that they have managed to get a cheque for X which £1300, still minus car fees and court cost.

 

X was going to go back and say they will accept £1300 cheque as part payment but remaining balance will be settled through judgement

can they do this?

 

X feels it is unfair they are suffering and police is siding with guilty party kind of and wants to know if a judge would go against them for not taking the £1300 offer as X has suffered time off work and is not a high earner who is a single parent to 4 kids.

 

X is unsure how judgement will work next as well,

can anyone advise?

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whats the judgement sum?


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, the whole DCA industry would collapse overnight.

 

 

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not too sure will ask

 

Sorry just spoke to 'x' and x is asking for car hire costs as it will take 5 days to repair car and court fee thats it..nothing else. guilty party won't pay the car hire costs or court fees.

X said they don't think theyre asking too much?

 

The car damage quote was £1500 & car hire £200 & cOurt cost £105 X has informed me.defendant only wants to pay £1300 of that..total cost of court case is £1805 inc court fees

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Where is the vehicle Insurer in all this?

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It's a judgment and the defendant (according to the posts above) has not applied to have it set aside. So X can refuse the interim payment and apply to have the judgment transferred up to the High Court to enable a High Court Enforcement Officer to be instructed via a Writ of Control to recover the full amount.

 

X could write to the Defendant/Defendant's Solicitors and threaten to instruct the HCEO if the full amount is not paid (instructing the HCEO will mean the debt is likely to increase beyond the £1,800 he currently owes - that's the basis of the threat).

 

Alternatively, X can accept the interim payment and if/when the cheque clears, can instruct the County Court bailiff to recover the balance of £500 ish.

 

As a drastic measure, if X can obtain the Defendant's bank details (assuming he still has the 8 figure payout knocking about somewhere), X can apply for a third party debt order. There is more risk attached to this option.

 

In addition, with this being a civil matter, I'm very surprised at the level of police involvement in this, particularly if the guilty party has a solicitor...

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I'm not sure if what I'm going to post is relevant or not, but...

 

An eight figure settlement from the NHS would mean at least £10 million (unless you include pence!). Are you sure about this and how do you know?

 

You say "x" works for the government. Do you mean this or do you mean that they work for the NHS? I ask because I'm wondering if they work for the mental health trust where the incident happened. (Also not sure what you mean by the patient not knowing that x - although employed by the government - was not part of the "local" government team parked in the car park?)

 

I used to work for a MH trust and damage caused to cars by patients was quite common. This was usually sorted out by the trust, but if you are saying the patient "knew" what they were doing this might be a problem. (ie no negligence on behalf of the trust).

 

And if the patient has had an "eight figure" payout, I think I'd expect them to be severely disabled and find it difficult to key cars. (Although not impossible - people with mental health problems can be very determined).

 

Does x have any legal cover under house insurance or some such?

 

I think I would have been inclined to make an insurance claim.

The police have already identified the perpetrator and I'm sure x's insurers have more experience of suing 3rd parties than x has.

 

Also not clear why police are so involved in a civil claim?

 

Can the police simply refuse to be a witness in civil proceedings?

 

They apparently have an admission.

 

(Apologies if I'm being thick - it's 40 years since I got a law degree and I'm sure things have improved(?) since then).

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'Keying a car' is causing criminal damage.

Police may not prosecute but can be required to provide evidence of any reported/investigated incident

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In addition, with this being a civil matter, I'm very surprised at the level of police involvement in this, particularly if the guilty party has a solicitor...

 

Hi this is NOT myself so I am going on what X tells me.

 

However the police were involved as this happened to so many cars on CCTV,

 

Where is the vehicle Insurer in all this?

 

X has not notified her car insurer as she does not feel she should have to incur a premium increase and excess charge that the defendent will not cover as a result of something that is not her fault.

 

“...got a substanial 8 figure sum from the NHS.”

 

 

Yeah sorry it wasn't eight figures and X tells me its on their record apparently but they know it was a six figure sum sorry due to negligence on the NHS part.

 

I also googled the guilty party and he boasts he is a 'property developer'

although I am surprised by this as his facebook boasts models and rolexs on it which is clearly paid for by his benefits/NHS compensation money and not himself.

 

As X is a good friend I advised this to them but they said it is irrevelant

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Hi this is NOT myself so I am going on what X tells me.

 

However the police were involved as this happened to so many cars on CCTV,

 

Get them to post here, which saves you being “stuck in the middle”.

You say they “don’t use the internet”, but equally : they are a professional, so they should be able to do so if they choose to.

 

If they are so concerned about using the internet that they feel they can’t post : tell them to resolve this through:

a) their insurers, or

b) a solicitor,

As if we are going by what you understand of what they have told you : there is too much room for error.

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hi they are worried they could get into trouble for sharing the information and not up to date with the technology

 

'Keying a car' is causing criminal damage.

Police may not prosecute but can be required to provide evidence of any reported/investigated incident

 

Yeah I think thats why the police said to X they'll be a witness

 

I'm not sure if what I'm going to post is relevant or not, but...

 

An eight figure settlement from the NHS would mean at least £10 million (unless you include pence!). Are you sure about this and how do you know?

 

You say "x" works for the government. Do you mean this or do you mean that they work for the NHS? I ask because I'm wondering if they work for the mental health trust where the incident happened. (Also not sure what you mean by the patient not knowing that x - although employed by the government - was not part of the "local" government team parked in the car park?)

 

I used to work for a MH trust and damage caused to cars by patients was quite common. This was usually sorted out by the trust, but if you are saying the patient "knew" what they were doing this might be a problem. (ie no negligence on behalf of the trust).

 

And if the patient has had an "eight figure" payout, I think I'd expect them to be severely disabled and find it difficult to key cars. (Although not impossible - people with mental health problems can be very determined).

 

Does x have any legal cover under house insurance or some such?

 

I think I would have been inclined to make an insurance claim. The police have already identified the perpetrator and I'm sure x's insurers have more experience of suing 3rd parties than x has.

 

Also not clear why police are so involved in a civil claim?

 

X does not want to disclose where he/she works but has said she/he has tried all avenues you mentioned except insurance and they do not accept liability thus why police got involved and they are small claims court thius

 

It's a judgment and the defendant (according to the posts above) has not applied to have it set aside. So X can refuse the interim payment and apply to have the judgment transferred up to the High Court to enable a High Court Enforcement Officer to be instructed via a Writ of Control to recover the full amount.

 

X could write to the Defendant/Defendant's Solicitors and threaten to instruct the HCEO if the full amount is not paid (instructing the HCEO will mean the debt is likely to increase beyond the £1,800 he currently owes - that's the basis of the threat).

 

Alternatively, X can accept the interim payment and if/when the cheque clears, can instruct the County Court bailiff to recover the balance of £500 ish.

 

As a drastic measure, if X can obtain the Defendant's bank details (assuming he still has the 8 figure payout knocking about somewhere), X can apply for a third party debt order. There is more risk attached to this option.

 

Thanks this helps so X can even tell the police they will only accept part payment of the cheque and rest?

 

Now judgement has been entered what happens next?

 

Get them to post here, which saves you being “stuck in the middle”.

You say they “don’t use the internet”, but equally : they are a professional, so they should be able to do so if they choose to.

 

If they are so concerned about using the internet that they feel they can’t post : tell them to resolve this through:

a) their insurers, or

b) a solicitor,

As if we are going by what you understand of what they have told you : there is too much room for error.

 

Totally understand what X needs help with is they have now gone on MCOL..entered judgement and had a letter saying judegment has been entered they need to know how/what they do next now and timeframes etc as both me/X couldn't find any info on the net

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Thanks this helps so X can even tell the police they will only accept part payment of the cheque and rest?

 

Now judgement has been entered what happens next?

 

https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/enforce-a-judgment

 

If X has a judgment, X should take steps to enforce the judgment against the key scratcher, as I said previously. This is gov.uk's summary of enforcement options, all the ones I suggested in my previous post are listed there.

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for £60 i'd get HCEO's involved...

 

dx


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, the whole DCA industry would collapse overnight.

 

 

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hello everyone..so now judgement has been entered can X log on MCOL and do the HCEO?

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no simply contact any local HCEO firm


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

if everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's tomorrow

the biggest financial industry in the UK, the whole DCA industry would collapse overnight.

 

 

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where can u find a list of hceo firms

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