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Payday Express Irresponsible Lending Reclaim - **Refund INT + CHAR & DEF Removal**

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Howdy,

I got myself into a real mess with payday loans, going back to divorce/unemployment in 2009. At its worst, between May 2012 and January 2015 I had nearly 140 loans with over a dozen lenders, in an endless bucket brigade of borrowing from one to repay another. I walked away from the whole toxic lot in January 2015 and am now redressing the situation.

 

From May 2012 to October 2013 I borrowed 10 times from Payday Express - deferring, refinancing, reborrowing etc.

 

10/8/17 - Sent formal complaint requiring refund of interest (£968.97) + 8% interest (£331.21) + removal of adverse data.

 

11/8/17 - Payday Express acknowledge receipt of complaint outlining response timescale (within 4 weeks, not later than 8 weeks)

 

6/9/17 - Payday Express are sorry to inform me that - after 4 weeks - their investigation is not complete

 

5/10/17 - Payday Express are sorry to inform me that - after 8 weeks - their investigation is not complete. They don't say when it might be complete (at a guess, never) but inform me of my right to refer the complaint to the FOS.

 

So, next? Prelim followed by LBA? Straight to LBA (previous formal complaint as Prelim)?


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FINAL RESPONSE FROM PAYDAY EXPRESS:

 

"Your complaint

 

Please read this part carefully as I will explain how I understand your complaint. This is important in how I have reached my decision:

 

You contacted Payday Express as you felt that you had been lent to irresponsibly. You allege that we did not assess the affordability of the loans or your financial situation. You believe that the loans trapped you into a debt spiral. You believe that we should have realised from the number of times you rolled over loans or borrowed again that your debt problems were getting worse and that it was not responsible to continue to lend to you. You believe that we failed to continuously assess your ability to service the loans, and this caused you financial hardship and also affected your health. You would like a refund of interest and charges paid plus 8% statutory interest, and the removal of negative information from your credit record.

 

My analysis of your complaint:

 

We have an obligation to lend responsibly to you every time you asked for a loan. To work this out, I have asked 3 questions for each loan:

 

1. Was the loan affordable?

I will look at what you told us about your income and expenditure, and see if what was left over was enough for you to meet your loan repayment and leave you some money for general living expenses.

 

2. Did you have any problems with other lenders?

We sometimes ask the credit bureau agencies for information about our customers when making our lending decision. Often, many of our customers have missed payments with other lenders and this is the very reason they come to us. So I have to balance whether any problems with other lenders meant that you were likely to have a problem paying us.

 

3. Did you rely on our loans to meet your everyday living expenses? Many of our customers use our loans to bridge unforeseen increases in their expenditure.

 

Sometimes, it can take 1 or 2 other loans to smooth things back out again, and we try to allow for this in our lending policies. However, we don’t think it’s a good thing when someone needs a loan every month just to get by and in these cases, we don’t think we should lend someone any money.

 

I have thought very carefully about your loan and applied these three questions to each loan.

 

There is one more thing to point out: where I think we asked enough questions when you made the loan application, I will use only the loan application information to answer the 3 questions. But if I don’t think we asked for enough information when you applied, it’s more difficult to come to a decision. I have to then work out what we would have done IF we had the information we SHOULD have asked for.

 

My Decision:

 

Between 24 May 2012 and 18 September 2013 you received a total of four loan deposits from us.

 

There were periods of lending when I think we did everything we were expected to. The loan repayments were low value and appeared to be affordable based on the information you declared. There didn’t appear to be any particular issues with other lenders that concern me and I don’t think you were reliant on borrowing from us at these times.

 

There are loans however for which I think we should have asked for more information before approving the loans. I have been unable to determine the affordability of these loans, and as such have been unable to review them.

 

The table below sets out the decisions I have reached on each of the loans I have reviewed.

 

Lending period Number of loans in lending period Overall Decision Total Redress

24 May 2012 – 31 January 2013 2 Funds lent responsibly N/A

15 May 2013 – 26 July 2013 1 Unable to Determine N/A

18 September 2013 – present 1 Funds lent responsibly N/A

 

To allow me to review the loans for which I have been unable to determine the affordability, I would request that you send me bank statements as laid out in the table below so that I can undertake a review of these loans.

 

Years Months

2013 April, May

 

How to send me the information:

 

• You can send me an original or scanned copy of your bank statements (including your name and address) or if it’s easier, a screen shot or print out is just fine provided that it shows your name, address and bank details, your proof of income (salary or benefit receipts), your outgoings (direct debit payments for your household bills) and your running balance.

• You can send your statements via email to: customer.help@dfconline.com – I’m afraid only a JPEG or PDF format can be accepted.

• By post to: The Customer Relations Team, Cardinal House, Abbeyfield Court, Abbeyfield Road, Nottingham, NG7 2SZ.

 

Next Steps:

 

I appreciate that this may not be the response you may have been hoping for but I hope you can see how and why I have come to my decision. If you are not satisfied, you may also ask for an independent review by the Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

You have the right to refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service, free of charge – but you must do so within six months of the date of this letter.

 

If you do not refer your complaint in time, the Ombudsman will not have our permission to consider your complaint and so will only be able to do so in very limited circumstances. For example, if the Ombudsman believes that the delay was as a result of exceptional circumstances."

 

In the last "lending period" - the one which resulted in a Default - there were actually 4 deposits not 1:

 

18/9/2013 - £300

24/9/2013 - £320

30/9/2013 - £80

1/10/2013 - £350

 

That's £978 (not including the £155 from Pounds to Pocket and £120 from Sunny), or just under half my monthly income at the time.

 

In a fortnight.

 

"Funds lent responsibly" my 4r5e.


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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Haven't replied to this yet but the more I read it the angrier it makes me.

 

The "logic" appears "if we didn't ask for enough information in order to lend responsibly, we lent responsibly based on the insufficient information we requested". It is a logic which suits their own cause, from their point of view, and proves mine, from my point of view.

 

The business of asking for bank statements from 2 months within an overall time-frame of 16 months totally neglects the spiralling cause and effect of taking these loans, month after month, for years. Notice they haven't asked for statements relating to the final - defaulted - loan amounts...

 

And what sort of "Final Response" asks for more information with which to review the loans further? :crazy:

 

Let me put it like this.

 

On 31/10/13 My bank balance was -£78.81

 

I received my salary, bringing my balance to £2165.58

 

On 1/11/13 - the next day - the following payments went out of my account:

 

£181.29 Pounds to Pocket

£182.00 Mr Lender

£194.25 Wagedayadvance

£997.42 Payday Express

 

£1554.96 Total

 

Meanwhile I had also spent:

 

£142.94 Car insurance

£12.18 TV License

£28.10 United Utilities

£44.19 Food shopping

£6.50 Bank Account Fee

 

£233.91 Total

 

£1788.87 - or 80% of my wage has gone out of my account in 24 hours. :faint:

 

It's 4 weeks to payday.

 

I have £376.71 left. :puke:

 

I have almost enough food for a week.

 

I haven't yet paid:

 

£770.00 Rent

£572 Council Tax, (unpaid since July 2013, i.e. 4 months, at £143 per month)

 

Nor have I put any fuel in the car to get me to work and back, or paid my phone bill.

 

Are these loans affordable?


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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also, have a look at the fos decisions against express finance (bromley) t/a or formerly payday express (if one and the same as yours). quite a few examples there.


IMO

:-):rant:

 

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also, have a look at the fos decisions against express finance (bromley) t/a or formerly payday express (if one and the same as yours). quite a few examples there.

 

Hi Ford, thanks for that. I'll definitely have a look - hadn't even occurred to me.


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

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Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

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I've replied to them [with apologies for repeating some of the above]:

 

"Dear Mr Craig,

Thankyou for your email dated 10th October 2017.

 

You state that "where I think we asked enough questions when you made the loan application, I will use only the loan application information to answer the 3 questions." The logic - if it can be termed such - in this statement is problematic. Whilst clearly partisan to your own agenda it does not substantiate or quantify why you think your checks were appropriate or proportionate. I can see from innumerable Financial Ombudsman decisions that they tend not to agree with you...

 

Furthermore, your summary of my borrowing is disingenous at best. You state that I received 4 loan deposits from you. There may have been 4 loan agreements but there were 7 deposits and 2 deferments. You consider that most of the loans were responsibly lent and "affordable". On 1st November 2013 a loan repayment was debited from my bank account in the amount of £997.42. That is almost half my monthly income.

 

On 31/10/13 My bank balance was -£78.81

 

I then received my salary, bringing my balance to £2165.58

 

On 1/11/13 - the next day - the following payments went out of my account:

 

£181.29 Pounds to Pocket

£182.00 Mr Lender

£194.25 Wagedayadvance

£997.42 Payday Express

 

£1554.96 Total

 

Meanwhile I had also spent:

 

£142.94 car insurance

£12.18 TV License

£28.10 United Utilities

£44.19 Food shopping

£6.50 Bank Account Fee

 

£233.91 Total

 

£1788.87 - or 80% of my wage had gone out of my account in 24 hours.

 

There were 4 weeks remaining until payday.

 

I had £376.71 left.

 

I had almost enough food for a week.

 

I hadn't yet paid:

 

£770.00 Rent

£572.00 Council Tax, (unpaid since July 2013, i.e. 4 months, at £143 per month)

 

Nor had I put any fuel in the car to get me to work and back, or paid my phone bill. These figures weren't just sums, they were the circumstances of my daily life and made me feel physically sick.

 

Are you seriously expecting me to accept that these loans were affordable?

 

Additionally, you have requested bank statements from April-May 2013 rather than from around the time of my final withdrawals. In neglecting to investigate information from a longer timeline, you are - I feel - making the same mistake that was made when the loans were originally issued, i.e. assessing affordability and my financial circumstances on insufficient information, except this time you are doing it deliberately in order to negate my complaint. I have therefore attached bank statements from May 2012 to December 2013, which should enable you to make a more informed decision. You will see credits and debits from numerous short term lenders, as well as loans from my late mother (shown on the statement as x x xxxxxxxx) for truly eye-watering amounts, and my attempts to repay her. Council tax payments (Stockport MBC) are erratic to the point of non-existence (payments to bailiffs begain in early 2014 following an extremely traumatic "visit").

 

You will also see that on 24th December 2013 my bank balance was £8.60. Merry Christmas."

 

Their standard tactic seems to be to deny everything and then disagree with the outcome when the FOS rule against them, which is often, so I'm writing my FOS complaint now rather than twiddling my thumbs waiting for PE to tell me to get stuffed. :)


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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FOS complaint submitted.


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Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

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:thumb:

did you have a look at the fos decisions database re, were there similar ones to yours


IMO

:-):rant:

 

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:thumb:

did you have a look at the fos decisions database re, were there similar ones to yours

 

Hi Ford, yes I did, and I'm I glad I did, thankyou, because there were so many cases just like mine where the FOS upheld or partially upheld a complaint previously rejected by PE. That's why I'm so confident this is just their standard tactic.


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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Email from PE:

 

"Thank you for your recent email in which you enclosed several bank statements.

 

Your case handler has only requested statements for April and May 2013 and unfortunately these do not appear to have been included. [yes they were - they were the ones named 2013 29Mar-01May and 2013 02May - 31May - do you see? Or can't you work out for yourself that "April" is between "29Mar" and "01May"?]

 

Please can you send us this period only [what's the point of selectively requesting relevant info?]and your case handler will review the loans he mentioned in his Final response Letter to you."

 

Whatever... :roll:


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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no worries. too late for them it's with fos now following their final response.

fos will ask you for any info required.


IMO

:-):rant:

 

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Email from PE:

 

"Thank you for your recent email in which you enclosed several bank statements.

 

Your case handler has only requested statements for April and May 2013 and unfortunately these do not appear to have been included. [yes they were - they were the ones named 2013 29Mar-01May and 2013 02May - 31May - do you see? Or can't you work out for yourself that "April" is between "29Mar" and "01May"?]

 

Please can you send us this period only [what's the point of selectively requesting relevant info?]and your case handler will review the loans he mentioned in his Final response Letter to you."

 

Whatever... :roll:

 

You've woken up to it and thats a good thing :)

At least you can tell the FOS you sent them everything that you felt would be useful at this time and was told that it was too much info - They will then see this and go - Well you asked for it and you were given it - This will go in your favour me thinks...

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Email from Payday Express with New Final Response Letter, i.e. Final Final Response Letter... :roll:

 

All loans responsibly lent - nothing to see here etc. Quelle surprise.

 

No word from FOS as yet.


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Does anyone have any idea how long I may have to wait just for the FOS to acknowledge my complaint?


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Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

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acknowledgement received on Friday 17th :-)


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FOS decision received today. Payday Express to refund all interest and charges (plus interest) on all my loans, and to remove all negative data. :whoo:


247 Moneybox - balance written off, default removed

Cash Genie - bogus default removed

Peachy - interest refunded, default removed

1 Month Loan - interest refunded, data removed

Peachy - balance written off, default removed

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result :)


IMO

:-):rant:

 

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