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    • Mother and father worked here and then went to SA in about 1978 returning to UK in about 1996 and worked here until 2016 when her husband died at age 66.  He was still working at the time.  She then went to live with daughter in SA.  Mother only claims for her pension. 
    • Thanks, I owe the money, no issue with that, I will SAR the company.  If I need to just pay it and have the CCJ for a few years so be it.  Just thought I'd explore all options
    • By the way you wrote that post, i can see that you are as confused by the situation as someone reading it. Important advice must be not to pay for any flights etc, until they understand the situation fully. Those that have British passports could be entitled to receive UK benefits. However, nothing is that straightforward. The passport does guarantee anything. The daughter could be entitled to Universal Credit ( which includes housing) as a British passport holder, but this can only be confirmed when she has gone through the Habitual Residency test (HRT). So you will need to read about HRT for British passport holders returning to the UK. There will be requirements to provide information about why they are returning to the UK and what work searches have they done to find work on their return to the UK. In regard to the mother who has a British passport, you will be correct in presuming that no council is going to be helpful in paying for the care home fees immediately on arrival in the UK. When did the mother last live in the UK ? When did the mother last work in the UK ? British embassy in South Africa may be able to provide information and assist with applications ? Just getting on a plane, landing in the UK and expecting help to resolve their situation, would be a silly thing to do. I can see the mother ending up in an NHS hospital for a period, while people wondered how they were going to deal with the situation. Probably not the first to do this, but if the mother also has a South African passport, they could put her on a plane back to SA and then the Daughter would be a difficult situation. Embassy in South Africa must be first place of advice.
    • There are online forums for people moving from South Africa to the UK. This is one of them.   https://moveup.co.za/2019/03/08/how-to-move-to-the-uk-a-step-by-step-guide/   If you want to speak to a social worker you could try the local council.   HB
    • This is not our issue, but an issue with a friend.  Our friend is living in South Africa and now suffers from dementia and is in a home.  The daughter has been paying for the home however the daughter was made redundant and has a child to support.  Daughter's husband keeps kicking her out of the house with the 3 year old boy and daughter had nowhere to go. The mother and daughter both have British passports.  Mother and father(now deceased) are British born, but daughter was born in South Africa.   The 3 year old was born in in South Africa.  Daughter is now broke and cannot keep the mother in a home any longer.  Daughter wants to return to the UK where she did live for several years previously so had NI number etc. however not sure what she can do with her mother.  The other issue is that the father is trying to get custody of the child so another issue. We, on behalf of the daughter who phoned us this morning, want to discuss with a social worker the options if any that may be open as on arrival here the mother will need to go straight into a home.  We can offer the daughter and child temporary accommodation with us.  Who should we contact? A very complicated scenario that normally we would not involved ourselves with as we are in our late sixties, retired and not that much money in the bank. 
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Originally had a Council Tax debt of £167.00.

A fee was added of £75.00.

I agreed to pay £20.00 per month and did so on 15th of each month.

 

 

At the end of August 2017 I owed £62.00.

Stupidly I forgot to pay on the 15th September and

 

 

on Wednesday I got home from work to a hand delivered letter which turned out to be an Enforcement Order with a further £235.00 of charges.

I contacted the Bailiff by text and offer 50% of the £62.00 now and the balance next month but he was not interested.

He wanted me to pay the total £297.00 the next morning.

I asked what the next stage was and he menacingly answered "You will have to wait and see."

 

I was hoping to be debt free by the end of the year, but these mean it will be another year.

 

Can anyone please give some advice ?

 

This means that my charges exceed the value of the original debt and he is expecting me to pay more than I can afford.

Can I challenge the Enforcement Charge?

Can I pay the charge by setting up a payment plan?

 

Thanks in advance.

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It is so unfortunate that you defaulted on your payment plan. Regrettably, enforcement companies are not under any obligation to send a reminder letter. Instead, your case will be referred to an enforcement agent for a personal visit and with it, an enforcement fee of £235.

 

Given that the enforcement fee has been charged, then unless the enforcement agent has actually 'taken control ' of any goods (which he hasn't) then he cannot charge any further fees and accordingly, although he will be unhappy not to receive full payment, there is little that he can do about it.

 

It will be very difficult indeed to challenge the enforcement charge.

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If there is only "On Street parking the bailiff may chance their hand with any car parked outside. A danger if it is an areawhere commuters park whil;st occupiers are at work.


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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Great advice here about moving the car. I moved mine a good 10 minute walk away when I was under threat from council tax bailiffs !

 

Couple of observations. If the OP has genuinely only owes £62 to the council and just missed one instalment, i can't even work out how many hundreds of percent interest the fees equate to. Bear in mind that local councils are already getting a lot of bad media attention about being way too heavy handed with the bailiffs, I would suggest emailing / phoning

 

1. your local elected councillor

2. Your elected head of council

 

'Don't be nasty in your tone. Explain that all you want to do is pay this off, and you understand there being a penalty for late payment but this amount is very disproportionate to the debt. In fact it is causing you a lot of hardship, and plunging you into debt for at least another year'.

 

These are the people elected to help you, I would guess you have a better than 50% chance of the bailiffs being called off. Bear in mind the head of the council has absolute power to do this.

 

The only other circumstances you can get the bailiff fees removed is if you fall under the council's vulnerable person classification. Chronic illness? Mental illness? Disability? However a GP's note is needed for this.

 

Also are there any CTAX discounts you are entitled to that you haven't claimed over the years, e.g single persons discount or student rate. There was a great slot on 5 live yesterday morning about this, and how people don't even know they could possibly be entitled to back dated refunds!


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If I offer to pay the Council the balance of £62.00 in 1 or 2 installments can they refuse to accept my payment is the matter is now in the hands of the Bailiffs? This way the Council will have been paid in full. The next step is either to sit it out over the £235.00 enforcement fee, or maybe offer them £10.00 a month.

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If I offer to pay the Council the balance of £62.00 in 1 or 2 installments can they refuse to accept my payment is the matter is now in the hands of the Bailiffs? This way the Council will have been paid in full. The next step is either to sit it out over the £235.00 enforcement fee, or maybe offer them £10.00 a month.

 

Unfortunately there is no reason why they should. If there is a sum owing when the debt as passed to the bailiff, they will be entitled to the compliance fee,£75) from that moment forward.

 

Anything paid to either the bailiff or the authority will have £75 removed from it and given to the bailiffs. Any payments after this will be split on a pro rata basis between them.

If you contact the authority they may see sense and recover the warrant, although I suspect they may insist you pay the bailiffs compliance fee, I should talk to them and state you are prepared to pay this immediately. It can do no harm and may save you £235 if it has gone to enforcement.


DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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I think the post should now be locked until the OP asks for it to be unlocked.

Grammar critiques, point scoring and off topic

 

 

posts moved to an existing discussion thread to clear the op's thread of our usual w/end arguments

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?453200-Removal-for-sale-fee-when-can-it-be-charged&p=5066315#post5066315

DX site team

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If I offer to pay the Council the balance of £62.00 in 1 or 2 installments can they refuse to accept my payment is the matter is now in the hands of the Bailiffs? This way the Council will have been paid in full. The next step is either to sit it out over the £235.00 enforcement fee, or maybe offer them £10.00 a month.

 

Do you have a vehicle?

 

If the answer is yes, is the vehicle subject to any form of finance?

 

Would the vehicle be visible when the enforcement agent re-visits?

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Yes I have a vehicle but it is not parked near my property.

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Thanks for the reply. I don't believe I should have to pay more than I can afford nor take out another loan to pay off the debt. Just to clarify and earlier reply I am not disputing the £75.00 Compliance Fee and that is being paid back as part of the current monthly repayments.

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Thanks for the reply. I don't believe I should have to pay more than I can afford nor take out another loan to pay off the debt. Just to clarify and earlier reply I am not disputing the £75.00 Compliance Fee and that is being paid back as part of the current monthly repayments.

 

The problem that you face is that unfortunately, you defaulted on your payment arrangement and in so doing, the enforcement company are legally entitled to pass the account to one of their agents for a personal visit to be made. That visit has incurred the legal fee of £235. I fully appreciate your comment about the compliance fee being paid back as part of your 'current monthly payments'. As I have stated, your previous payment arrangement has now been cancelled.

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The reference 'sitting it out' has been well documented on this forum. It is a suggestion favoured by Alreadyexists. One of his other options is to advise debtors not to pay an enforcement agent but instead, to 'put the money into an ISA account' and await the debt being returned back to the local authority.

 

For the sake of accuracy, if and when a account gets returned, all 'remaining' bailiff fees will be removed. I stress the word 'remaining'. In the vast majority of cases, an account would be returned back to the local authority after some payments had already been made (and the account then defaulting on numerous occasions). In such cases, a proportion of the bailiff fees would have already been deducted by the enforcement agent in accordance with the 'pro rata' distribution of payments. It would only be the uncollected bailiff fees that would be removed (if the account is returned to the local authority).

 

Another suggestion for 'sitting it out' regards the fact that a warrant (or in the case of a Liability Order, an enactment) is only valid for '12 months'. This particular subject (when the 12 month period begins....and ends) is one that was discussed last week by the countries expert on bailiff law; Mr John Kruse. It is fair to say that what he had to say on this subject was 'music to the ears' of all enforcement companies and local authorities present.........

 

Mr Kruse reminded them that the '12 month' period restarts whenever a payment is made (either under an existing payment arrangement or otherwise).

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The council tax debt was originally £167,

the compliance fee was added in February making a balance due of £242.

 

Deducting payments I have made so far £180.00 the balance at the end of August 2017 was £62.00.

 

I offered full payment of the £62.00 on Wednesday but the Bailiff refused to accept it.

 

He ordered me to pay £297.00 by debit card the next day.

I am unable to find this amount in one hit.

 

My daughter lives at home with me and she is currently on Maternity leave.

 

I do not want the Bailiiff turning up at my property again while I am at work and harassing her as to my whereabouts.

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Bizarre twist - having received a text message demanding payment in full by phone to the office, I received a letter from another firm of Bailiffs for the original amount the sum of £62.00 ( the balance I agree that I owe ).

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They can't use two different bailiff to enforce the same debt


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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Bizarre twist - having received a text message demanding payment in full by phone to the office, I received a letter from another firm of Bailiffs for the original amount the sum of £62.00 ( the balance I agree that I owe ).

 

My first thought on reading your post was that the enforcement company may have returned your account back to their local authority client and that they in turn, had passed your account to another enforcement company under contract to them (when awarding contracts, most local authorities select anything between 2 and 5 enforcement companies).

 

Why I am being cautious is because it was only last Wednesday (27th September), that the enforcement agent left a hand delivered notice at your property.

 

I am assuming that the letter that you have received (requesting £62) is called a Notice of Enforcement? If so, does it state a date by when payment must be made?

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The account was obviously not returned because the demand made is £62. If the account had been returned, another £75 compliance fee would have been added.

 

You should not assume that the letter received is a notice of enforcement, given that no compliance fee has been added.

 

It is important not to "assume" anything at this stage and wait until Peter replies, furnishing us with further information.

 

As I see it, the only possible way another NoE MIGHT have been issued is if the council either use in house bailiffs or the second NoE has been sent from Equita, who seem to be spreading currently faster than ants breed.

 

No not necessarily .

 

You say we should not assume then you go onto assume ?


DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

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Update:

I approached the Council and offered to pay them direct as the Bailiff had not turned up to collect the money on 2 separate occasions.

 

The guy at the council took the balance due to them.

He confirmed that the balance for 2012/13 was now zero.

That was on the 17th October.

He did advise that the enforcement officer may pursue his £235.00 charge.

 

I received a letter recently from the council who said there was still a balance as they had now transferred the amount that I had paid to the enforcement company and in turn they had apportioned the money partly against the Council Tax debt and partly against the bailiffs fees.

 

I was not made aware that they were going to do this and would like advice as to whether this is acceptable protocol and contradicts what the Council said when they took the payment.

 

I have a receipt from the council to show receipt of funds for the money that was outstanding to them.

 

Hopefully someone can help as to the legalities of this.

 

Thanks

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sadly that is correct.

 

dx


please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

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I approached the Council and offered to pay them direct as the Bailiff had not turned up to collect the money on 2 separate occasions.

 

The guy at the council took the balance due to them.

 

That was on the 17th October. He did advise that the enforcement officer may pursue his £235.00 charge.

 

I received a letter recently from the council who said there was still a balance as they had now transferred the amount that I had paid to the enforcement company and in turn they had apportioned the money partly against the Council Tax debt and partly against the bailiffs fees.

 

Thanks

 

In your post number 14 (on 2nd October) you mentioned that you had received a letter requesting £62. Given that you didn't pay until 17th October, I am assuming that a visit had been made which would add an enforcement fee of £235 to your account.

 

You mention that the reason why you had paid the council direct (minus bailiff fees) was because the bailiff failed to attend your home address on two occasions to collect payment. Could you not have visited the enforcement companies website and made payment? Alternatively, you could have telephoned their office to make payment ?

 

How the local authority have apportioned your payment is perfectly correct and mirrors the advice that you had been given by the poster Dodgeball in his post number 6:

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?481761-Disproportionate-Bailiff-Fees-Ctax-LO-missed-payment&p=5066287&viewfull=1#post5066287

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