Laptop returned a year ago, no refund/repair from seller Court Claim ?***Settled***

[DraxDomax]

They have responded to my online claim!

 

"

The Defendant is a service company that assists other companies

advertise and sell goods via eBay, Amazon and direct websites, as

well as other sales channels, and assists with logistics and

fulfilment.

 

The Defendant at no point has engaged in the activity of selling

laptops.

 

The Defendant did not enter a contract of sale with the claimant.

The Defendant did not receive any money from the claimant nor

provide the Claimant with the laptop for a contract to exist.

 

Any liabilility is strongly denied as the Claimant does not have a

contract of sale with the Defendant, and the Claimant is put to

strict proof over this.

"

 

They (I've raised the claim against SERVICEX LTD) claim they are not the seller.

I have the ebay sales order, which clearly states:

Seller : svx-online (31439)

Hamid Taqui, ServiceX LTD, 4a Redgate Lane, Manchester, UK, Lancashire, M12 4RY

 

What is my next move, please?

 

Also, in all my correspondence, done through ebay, they clearly act like this laptop is sold under them.

- When they told me to return it to them for repair, the gave the ServiceX address.

- When they told me to return the laptop to THEM for inspection (when I told them I am finally rejecting it), they signed with their company name (and it's thought their ebay account too)

 

I don't understand how to reply?

How to add this evidence?

[steampowered]

Nothing to do immediately. Just move forward with the court process.

 

Submission of evidence comes later - the court will tell you when to submit evidence in its directions.

 

Perhaps write to this company separately noting that they have filed a defence claiming that they were not the seller, asking them to specifically identify who they claim the true seller was. If they don't reply or refuse to identify the true seller, include that in your evidence.

[DraxDomax]

Well, I guess his idea is trying to divert the responsibility over the laptop to his other company, the defunct Skunkwurx LTD...

 

I do admit the payment has been made to Skunkwurx.

So yeah, ServiceX didn't get any money from me

but the ebay sales orders, dispatch notices and correspondence are with ServiceX and they literally are managing this laptop as their item for sale.

 

Do you reckon they have a chance to get away with this?

 

Also, there's the issue of the laptop I've sent to ServiceX address, which they received and I have a signature...

[steampowered]

Do you reckon they have a chance to get away with this?

 

If you follow the process through, you will end up in a hearing with a judge.

 

The judge knows nothing about you and he knows nothing about ServiceX or Skunkworkz. Nor is the judge going to start doing independent research. The judge will simply look at the evidence you put in front of him.

 

If you were the judge and were given the pack of evidence, and you needed to decide whether the contract was with the Defendant or whether it was with someone else, what would your decision be?

 

I hope you will see that the answer to this question completely depends on the quality of the evidence you provide to the judge!

 

It sounds like you have quite a lot of good evidence demonstrating that the contract was with ServiceX, so make sure to submit all your evidence when ordered to do so by the court, and bring it with you to the hearing.

[unclebulgaria67]

When i was responding earlier to this thread, i looked at the Ebay page for this company and they were selling many different products from Laptops to car parts. I did not seem like a company i would buy a laptop from. Then looking at the Google streetview of the registered address, it did not seem like an address this company were likely to operate from.

 

I can't see how they can claim to just be a listing company selling on behalf of others. I am not sure that Ebay terms would even allow this or if the items were not owned or stocked by the company, they would have to state this very clearly.

 

It might be worth looking through the Ebay seller conditions and whether this company met the terms. Something else to mention when you come to provide more info about your claim.

[DraxDomax]

in addition to evidence, do I get an opening to respond to their defence?

 

I am thinking something along the lines of:

"I bought the laptop through an ad published by ServiceX LTD.

When I paid for the laptop, I received a sales order signed by ServiceX LTD (see attached sales order).

 

I later received a shipping confirmation from ServiceX LTD, acknowledging the payment for the laptop (see attached shipping confirmation).

 

My discussion about warranty was done through ebay, where you, ServeiceX LTD, the operator of the account, have acknowledged selling the laptop to me and being responsible for warranty service (see attached messages from you).

 

It is not my business where you source your products from. I deal with the seller, not his suppliers."

 

BTW: thanks a lot, people. I mean, this is so infuriating to me. What an audacious bastard, really...

[dx100uk]

that will be details you'll include in your witness statement

[DraxDomax]

Got this in the mail from MCOL. I'll summarize the details that seem important. My questions in the next post.

 

1. Notice of Proposed Allocation to the Small Claims Track

..."This is now a defended claim"

..."deemed suitable for the small claims route"

..."You must by 16-Oct complete the small claims directions questionnaire Form N180 and file it with the court office"

..."and serve copies on all other parties"

 

2. Defense and counterclaim

..."I dispute the full amount"

...Defence: "The defendant is a service company that assists other companies advertise and sell goods via eBay, Amazon and direct websites, as well as other sales channels, and assists with logistics and fulfillment.

The defendant at no point has engaged in the activity of selling laptops"

...Defence (continued): "The defendant did not enter a contract of sale with the claimant.

The defendant did not receive any money from the claimant nor provide the claimant with the laptop for a contract to exist.

Any liability is strongly denied as the claimant does not have a contract of sale with the defendant and the claimant is put to strict proof over this"

 

3. Would you like to settle your case without going to a court hearing? and then some instructions to initiate a mediation service.

- I don't see any chance for mediation, as the guys seems to claim he has absolutely nothing to do with this.

 

4. N180 Directions questionnaire (I see someone penned some stuff on it for me)

... Again, a long winded recommendation to use the mediation service, which I really don't think applies.

... "at which county court center would you prefer the small claims hearing to take place and why"

 

My questions regarding the mail received from MCOL (summarized above):

1. I had some more mental trouble, so, as you see, the deadline is quite close

2. Do you think I have to give the mediation service a try? I don't think there's any chance to bridge the gap here...

3. I don't see anywhere to put my witness statement

4. Do I understand correctly? I will be physically attending a court? I thought this service can offer judgements using the online service...

5. Do I have to send this N180 in paper to the court?

6. When they say: ..."and serve copies on all other parties" - do they mean I should photo-copy my N180 and send to the defendant's business address as well?

 

Once again, many, many thanks!!!

[unclebulgaria67]

Yes to mediation, as that looks good to the courts. It is just done by phone by a mediation company who talk to each side, without any direct contact between you and other defendant. Before mediation there is a questionaire sent to see if it suitable. When you receive this send it back. Service x will have to explain why mediation is not suitable.

 

The witness statement comes later in the process.

 

Complete and send the court the N180 form as asked by the court and email copy to servicex. That is just to confirm you are happy to proceed with mediation and if necessary court chosen. Yes you might have to go foward with a court hearing at some point.

 

See what others advise, but if it were me, i would be sending a letter to the defendant to counter their defence, by sending them copies showing your contract was with Servicex ltd to supply the laptop and there was nothing stated that they were acting on behalf of another party. If this was the case, they should have stated which other party the contract was with.

[SuperVillain]

You say 'Defence and Counterclaim' - what monies are they claiming from you?

 

I'd agree with unclebulgaria, you should file at Court and send to the Defendant a Reply to Defence. You have to send that to them and the Court at the same time as your N180.

 

A reply to defence - effectively is your response to each of their defence points (my inkling is that these should be the points outlined in your post #36 above but without attaching the documents). It will give them some food for thought, and may prompt them to make a settlement offer.

 

You can then elaborate on all of your points in your witness statement and send any documents that you want the Court to see at the appropriate stage (usually 14 days before the hearing in a small claim).

[DraxDomax]

Hi, Defense and countrclaim is the title of the form. They are not making a counter claim.

 

The defendant is firmly opposing any settlement. They've even opted not to give mediation a go (I opted in but I guess both of us need to agree on that).

 

I was given a choice between Reading court and Basingstoke. All the same to me but Basingstoke is 30 minutes more south, if you are coming from Manchester

 

I've just been transferred to Basingstoke and was told to wait...

 

My only question is if I should expect him to show up to the hearing? It's 4 hours each way, effectively losing a whole day on the road, for him...

What do you reckon will be his defense?

[AndyOrch]

Have you not already been served a copy by the court ?

[DraxDomax]

yeah but that's his initial defense. I am wondering if he'd even show up to court or just send a package of documents?...

[AndyOrch]

Has he failed to serve a copy of his witness statement and evidence ?

[DraxDomax]

As far as I know, there is no witness statement and evidence. I thought these will be presented at the hearing?

I was only given a n180 to fill, which is really not more than "do you want mediation, where do you want the hearing to be?" that's all, no requests for evidence, witnesses, etc...

[AndyOrch]

Once you submit your n180 you should receive a Notice of Allocation...this contains the court directions as to when both parties must file and serve their witness statement and evidence (documents by).

 

Either party failing to comply with the directions risks their claim/defence being struck out for none compliance.

 

I assume you have filed and served yours ?

[DraxDomax]

Well, the one I have is N271 - notice of transfer of proceedings. Looks almost exactly like this:

https://bmpa.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/209884205-Notice-of-Transfer-of-Proceedings-N271-

 

So, I may have confused the terms as, I guess, I am not yet allocated, just transferred.

 

Anyway, I've only paid like 60 pounds to MCOL for now. I guess I should pay for the hearing but I have not been instructed to do so yet?

Also, I did not yet receive any instruction to file the whole claim (detailed accusation, evidence, etc)...

 

Should I call the court in Basingstoke to ask around?

[AndyOrch]

Notice of Allocation should be on its way...what date did you receive the N271?

[DraxDomax]

23-Oct.

I am also checking the status of the MCOL in the claim web page. Nothing changed.

[AndyOrch]

Can be 2/3 weeks from N271 to N157–160 (Notice of Allocation) subject to the courts workload.

 

MCOL will change to Allocated once you receive the above.

[DraxDomax]

Wow, nice to see someone who knows things in such detail!

Thanks

[AndyOrch]

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part26/pd_part26

[DraxDomax]

Hi,

I received a notice of allocation to the Small Claims Track (preliminary hearing) (N158).

 

Summary:

District Judge in Basingstoke considered the papers in the case and ordered that:

 

A preliminary hearing is required to enable the court to consider the directions which need to be made in this case because it may be possible to dispose of the claim at such a hearing, it appearing from the papers that the Defendant may have no real prospect of success at a final hearing.

 

1. I wonder what are your thoughts about the above?

 

2. It also said:

The claimant must by no later than 7 days before the preliminary hearing send to the court and to the defendant copies of all documents relied upon to evidence of a contract of sale and/or for services with the defendant.

 

- Well,

here I kinda screwed up,

the notice is dated 6-Nov and the preliminary hearing is 13-Nov.

 

I only saw the letter on the 7'th.

I think I can't bring any documents to the preliminary hearing?

I mean the dates here were very tight!

 

Letter arrived exactly 7 days before hearing and says no later than 7 days before hearing, I need to send documents!

 

(I know plenty of people have no problem with this but a person in my condition moves very slow, especially with procedural things )

 

Is there anything I can do?

I guess bringing the docs to preliminary hearing is not good?

 

I don't mind if this goes on to another hearing, where I will have a chance to show the sale docs.

[unclebulgaria67]

Sounds like you will win, if you provide evidence of the contract.

 

Suggest you phone the court to ask for more time, as not enough time was allowed. They may just issue another hearing date, so you have chance to do what they have asked.

[dx100uk]

if you have the docs

scan them to one pdf

and ask the court if you can email them.