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Robinson Way/Natwest - CCA Request


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nowlo everyone,

 

I was hoping you'd be able to give me some advice on my current situation.

I really want to keep on top of things.

 

Natwest Loan £2,505.78

Natwest Credit Card £1,686.25

Natwest Overdraft £500.00

 

for my credit card, or shall I say Triton debt management.

At the time I was awaiting confirmation of JSA, housing benefit etc and had no income.

They accepted a monthly £1 token payment.

 

End of last month they constantly kept calling me, I answered to shut them up.

They told me the first agreement wasn't valid as I had no income and therefore it shouldn't of been made.

 

Said the person that called me was 'new' (like that's MY problem)

. I was forced into doing an income/expenditure there and then.

Somehow they figured I could afford £7.99 a month

. I couldn't, but felt really forced.

I agreed.

 

Since then I did a proper inc/exp for myself, and down to bear minimums for outgoings

I'm still -£8.99 minus a month.

 

I wrote a letter, which I sent recorded with an enclosed copy of my inc/exp saying I cannot afford the repayment agreed, and as of 5th Sept I will be making a £1 token payment, via postal order for the next 3 months (on 5th of every month), when I will review my financial situation (and could freeze interest).

 

what I'd like to know is, was this right thing to do?

What are the chances of them freezing my interest?

 

They would have received my letter a long time before that payment was applied for.

I'm worried they can keep applying for this amount.

How can I stop them?

 

What rights do I now have?

Can they take me to court?

 

I'm using my PPI for the Natwest loan. So that's covered.

 

Any help appreciated.

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My Robinson Way letters, one of which I have in front of me, says "Due to: NATIONAL WESTMINSTER BANK".

 

I previously clarified which NatWest accounts this related to, and I have a letter from Robinson Way telling me the account numbers

- which were for my (now closed) current account overdraft and credit card.

 

As for the defaulted dates etc.

 

These are all of my open defaulted accounts as listed on my credit report:

 

Nwb Current Accounts (Debt/repayment managed by Robinson Way - They are not shown on my credit report) - Balance: £ 1,903 (last updated: 15/06/2017) - Status: Default - Account type: Current Account [Overdraft]) Note: Monthly summary shows the £10 coming off every month, the repayment I have with Robinson Way.

Account type Current Account

Account start date 07/02/2007

Repayment frequency Monthly

Date of default 31/08/2014

Default balance £ 983

 

Natwest Personal Loans - Balance: £ 414 (last updated: 04/06/2017) - Status: Default - Account type: Unsecured Loan - Note: I have had no correspondence to repay this account, and have not acknowledged the debt to them.

Account type Unsecured Loan

Account start date 10/09/2007

Opening balance £ 8,352

Regular payment £ £ 139

Repayment frequency Monthly

Date of default 30/11/2011

Default balance £ 2,227

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urm what date did you enter into that DMP with stepchange?

 

the defaults should be within 3mts of tht date or even before if you'd already missed or were late on the required payments.

so you are right

NW still own the robbersway debts

me , i'd be paying NW directly, cut out the powerless middle man!!

 

as for arrows and that vanquish card...about time you sent them a CCA request.

and get an SAR running to vanquish

bet you've got lots of charges to reclaim and ROP [PPI] too.

 

so did you ever get that other NW PPI back too?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thanks for your continued replies.

 

There was no DMP via StepChange set-up,

it was discussed,

instead between them and myself we created a management plan for myself to follow.

That is what I did - I contacted each creditor and set-up repayment plans.

 

I attempted to contact Natwest directly many times for repayment.

 

They refused repeatedly to discuss my account or to accept a repayment, and said I'd have to speak to the collector the debt was allegedly passed to, which was Triton - as everyone is likely aware, Triton Debt Collections were an in-house Natwest affair and got in quite a lot of trouble for trying to make the customer believe otherwise.

 

I had a repayment plan with 'Triton' who at some point (can't remember when exactly) passed that debt over to Robinson Way.

 

I had again, when Robinson Way took over, tried to repay Natwest directly, they refused.

 

In fact, I so much issue with the whole Triton/Natwest/Robinson Way issue and both giving me conflicting inform, I was actually awarded some compensation (I think around £300) for the bother (which I used to pay some other priority debt off).

 

Ok - I'll have to look into/read up on the CCA and SAR.

I don't know anything about any of that.

 

As for the charges and PPI,

how would you suggest I go about getting the ball rolling on that one?

 

No, I did not get the last two PPI payments paid by Natwest, as 'apparently' if the loan term comes to its end (as in, 4 year loan) date they are no longer obliged to make those repayments.

 

Bearing in mind that the PPI processing department were always behind/late sending me repayments. No protection at all.

 

Along with many many people, I definitely regret taking out PPI.

 

I did not pursue a missold case, as I didn't that would be the case with me as I did receive repayments albeit late with a lot of hassle, although definitely was the product I thought I was sold.

 

I've just done some rifling through paperwork.

It would appear I reclaimed charges in Feb 2012 from Vanquis (Impact Collections/1st Credit LTD/Arrow Global/Capquest) - they offered to repay £322.06 of charges added to the account and interest that accrued (with a breakdown - included late charges and overlimit charges from 2008 - Sept 2011). I accepted that amount.

 

Where Natwest is concerned

- I asked Natwest to repay all charges for my credit card, which they did and deduced it from the total owed (£279.61).

However, it doesn't appear I requested for the charges and interest from the overdraft to repaid, so I don't know if that is something worth doing?

 

I have written a letter requesting CCA from Capquest (Vanquis).

 

Where the Natwest loan is concerned, I'm not sure what to do about that.

They have not requested repayment of the £414.63 (more than I originally thought) outstanding,

but they have sent me statements every 6 months or so showing that amount is outstanding from the CMS Recoveries Branch.

 

Would it be wise, given the default date for this being listed as 30/11/2011 on my credit file, and I haven't acknowledged this debt since this time, to go down the statute barred route, or would you suggest writing to them and asking for my credit agreement (Which would mean acknowledging the debt?)?

 

Again, thank you very much for your help, suggestions and replies.

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Do you own a house or are you renting privately ?

 

Which Bank was the overdraft with ? Have you gone though all statements to calculate all charges added ? If not SAR the Bank to get hold of all statements.

 

In regard to Natwest loan, leave that alone, given how close SB is. A CCA request is not acknowledgement, but wise not to bother at this stage.

We could do with some help from you.

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Hi thanks for replying again.

 

Privately renting. Never owned a property/had a mortgage.

 

The overdraft was with Natwest. No, I don't believe I have gone through all the statements to calculate charges at any point. I don't have my old paper statements, so I will request a SAR - Thank you for that suggestion.

 

Regarding the loan - gotcha, hearing loud and clear :thumb:

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If you are renting, what you want to avoid is a CCJ at any stage which might cause you problems renting privately. Even with a current rental agreement, there might be a credit check before renewal. So the action you have taken to date has avoided a CCJ. It is now a case of what is best way forward.

 

So SAR to Natwest to see what charges applied to overdraft debt.

 

CCA to Capquest regarding the Vanquish credit card debt.

 

Maintain the token payments for now.

 

The £1 and £10 payments mean that these debts would be around for a long time to come. Perhaps if they were made aware of your position, they might write the debts off. Yes it might mean sharing confidential info, but if it leads to a debt forgiveness/write off, then it might be worth it. But that is something to think about.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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I was advised to avoid CCJs at all costs - So pleased that you have confirmed I've likely done the right things to avoid that.

 

  • SAR request to Natwest written and ready to be sent with £10 PO tomorrow :thumb:
  • CCA requests to Capquest and Robinson Way written and ready to be sent with £1 POs tomorrow :thumb:
  • Await Natwest loan to come into the statute barred timeframe :thumb:
  • Token payment standing orders in place to come out the same time every month

 

Well, I'm hoping that if I can get the above in order I may have grounds/means to clear/wipe out my remaining debt, or at least some leverage to do so.

 

They have been informed of my situation several times, but have not offered to clear the debt. I guess there would be no harm in asking if the aforementioned doesn't work out.

 

Again, thank you and everyone for your advice.

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I'm not requesting a CCA from NatWest for the overdraft

- I'm requesting a CCA from Robinson Way for the NatWest credit card that did have a signed agreement (with NatWest originally) to see if they can produce proof of that agreement since the debt was sold to them.

 

If they can't produce that agreement I'm presuming I have grounds to question the remaining outstanding balance owed

(unless, of course, because I've acknowledged the debt that won't be possible - to negotiate a settlement).

 

I've requested a SAR from NatWest for the bank statements so I can go through them to then try and reclaim any charges associated with my old current account.

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ok sorry confused..

 

 

if anyone doesn't hold an enforceable agreement you stop paying no buts..

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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you signed it

if they don't send it and T&C's ...

that's why you need to create a thread for each CCA return..

 

not sure how many times we need to say this

then we can see what they've sent and verify its enforceable...................

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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With every due respect to you, DX, I think you're misconstruing some of my posts or what I've said.

 

I've tried be clear - but I guess I'm not coming across in the way that I'm intending.

 

My question meant

- Is a CCA classed as an enforcement agreement

- As in, if they don't provide the original CCA,

I'm well within my rights to suggest to them I won't be making further repayments and they cannot lawfully chase any alleged outstanding debt?

 

That might seem like an obvious question to you, but sorry, not for me.

 

I haven't created a thread for every CCA return as I didn't even know when I started this thread that was going be the action I would take, I hadn't even heard of requesting a CCA before.

 

As I mentioned, I've literally sat down and written the CCA requests out this evening/morning to send off in the morning because of the advice given in this thread this evening/morning

- so obviously I haven't received a responses yet.

 

I'll be sure to create threads for each CCA I receive, as you've just suggested.

 

I do realise you must repeat yourself a lot,

but also please try and appreciate that whilst yourself and the other highly active admins/mods/members might be very au fait with the ins and outs of debt and the forum

- as you very kindly advise people on here,

the average Joe is not as up to speed or as savvy as you are.

 

Nor am I quite sure how to most effectively navigate and cover every single piece of information within the forum, and in a way you'd prefer (threads to be posted/constructed a certain way and posted to where).

 

You speak with a lot of acronyms which you probably don't even think about when you use them anymore,

but takes a bit more thought on my part to decipher (reading all the pop-up descriptions).

 

I'm not trying to have a go,

I'm very appreciative of your help,

but please try and appreciate this is all rather daunting,

I'm doing my best to follow the rules,

read as much content/posts as possible and endeavouring to be clear with my posts etc.

 

If I was supposed to approach this whole thing differently on the forums, I'm sorry, I didn't realise and maybe I missed reading something that said to do otherwise.

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part of what cag is about is self help.....

 

as far a I can see ,

you've not researched anything since you've joined in 2011

 

with as it appears by your thread of that time exactly the same questions as your current thread

exactly the debts

exactly the same answers then as now

 

one would hope

self investigation would have prevailed.

 

its worthy to note

that had you heeded the advice given in 2011

the majority of your debts would no longer be an issue and be statute barred.

 

however you chose to ignore the advise going by the account of your situation in this recent thread.

 

however we all know events can upset ones turn of life.

 

lets await your cca returns

 

then movement in getting you away from the cash cow milking parlour might be forth coming.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Agree it is now just a case of following the advice and trying to get away from this slow drip feed of cash to these DCA's.

 

These DCA's are quite happy to see people paying them token payments over a very long period. It means the debt is kept from being statute barred. Even at £10 a month, they might end up making a profit on what they paid. And they have a performing debt on their books, which they can sell on as an asset. You will also find they check your credit record regularly to see if your circumstances have changed. They will also write to you for income and expenses info.

 

If you can start the process of making requests for information then when it comes back, we can see what you can do. There is no point looking back at what you could have done differently in 2011. The advice you received elsewhere was about trying to avoid a CCJ and you followed it because at the time you believed it was the right thing to do. As with most life issues, there is always different ways of dealing with things.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi everyone,

 

As suggested in another thread, I have made this new thread for the SAR I recently requested from Natwest.

 

I sent Natwest a SAR letter (recorded delivery) on the 19th July (dated 18th July). I used the template that is available on this forum to do this here: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?387306-Full-Subject-Access-Request.

 

On 25th July I had a missed call and voicemail left from someone in Natwest's SAR department - they asked that I call them back regarding my request. Well, it would appear they still have my phone number on file at least, as I didn't supply it (or any phone number) in my letter. I decided to not return the call, as I'm not prepared for what they may have asked and instead awaited written correspondence.

 

Today I received a response dated 25th July.

I have taken photos of this letter and hosted/linked to it externally (I 'think' I read somewhere on the forum to do this for liability reasons for CAG).

this is that letter (with private info concealed) here:

https://ibb.co/ggWfkQ

https://ibb.co/kHyRQQ

 

I need to figure out what to respond to them with, so any informed advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

My first query regarding their response is for what reason could they be asking,

"To help us source the personal data you are looking for, it would be greatly appreciated if you could be as specific as possible about the information you are looking for." ?

Because this is what I wrote in my original letter to them:

 

"Please supply me with copies of all the data which you hold on me in relation to any matter and in any form and for any period of time.

 

Please note that I require disclosure of any personal which you hold on me for the entire period of my dealings with you.

 

This Subject Access Request includes - but is not limited to any data you hold about me in respect of any matter and held in any form including; statements, notes, screen notes, recordings, internal correspondence and external correspondence. Please note that this Subject Access Request is not limited to the account/reference number mentioned above but that number has been provided purely as a starting reference for you.

 

For the avoidance of doubt, and as stated above, this Subject Access Request requires disclosure of ALL personal data which you hold on me for the entire period of my dealings with you"

 

For what reason would they ask me to again tell them what information I am seeking?

I thought that I was pretty clear in requesting ALL information they hold on me?

I can think of several reasons:

 

1) They want to 'catch' me out and get me to acknowledge certain accounts/debts by myself requesting information about those accounts specifically

 

2) It was just on the generic letter template the team member used for the basis of the letter and left it on there

 

3) They are trying to wriggle out of supplying EVERYTHING they hold on me (which is what I want)

 

4) All of the aforementioned

 

Does anyone have any opinions on why they would again ask for this, is this usual?

 

My second query would be relating to the "Information required to proceed with your request" portion of their letter.

 

After reading various advice, I decided to sign my original letter/SAR to them.

They say in their response letter that,

 

"We require proof of your identity as your signature does not match the one we hold on file."

 

Well, my signature is very simplistic and it's doubtful it has changed, so I'm not sure what to think about this.

 

Thirdly - I'm unsure what would be the best proof of identity to send them.

They have asked for either a copy of my driving license, passport, EU ID card, UK Armed Forces ID or a police warrant card.

All of which to my knowledge include signatures.

Legally do I have to send them one of those forms of ID or would another type be acceptable legally and they'd still have to comply with my request?

 

 

Many thanks for your time. :hippie:

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I believe they are entitled to ask for some proof of identity if you have not been in touch with them recently. Others would be able to advise what, if anything you need to provide. What if you didn't have any of the items they are asking for ?

 

 

You are correct in that your letter was specific. You want copies of ALL data they hold on you. It is not for you to specify, but for them to comply. It might be worth a complaint to the Information Commissioner, because it looks to me as though they are just being difficult.

 

 

I am unable to read your documents.

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Have you moved since you took 'whatever' out with NatWest?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thank you for replying, citizenB.

 

Would it be unwise to send proof of identity that includes a signature?

I ask because I have read it might be unwise to.

 

I think once I have confirmed what proof of identity they have to legally accept,

I'll go about writing my response with a copy of that ID whilst also reaffirming that in my original letter I asked for ALL information they hold on me.

 

 

If after that letter is received they try throwing any further spanners in the works I'll contact the Information Commissioner as you have suggested.

 

Have you moved since you took 'whatever' out with NatWest?

 

Hey DX.

Any accounts I may have taken out would have originally been at a different address,

however, I am still at the address they last corresponded with me at and it's the address they have submitted on my credit file.

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joining in, as about to historic sar them.

if they have been recently corresponding with you, then it wld seem unreasonable for them to ask for id (see the ICO website for eg).

when i do sar's i dont include that bit in the template about 'if you require further info re id let me know' as it just invites.

as for specific info, thats rubbish if a request is for all info. they just need a starting point 9name and address should suffice), it should all link up re accounts held. then associated logs, statements, etc.

it seems though that they have an issue with your sig. but, again, if they have been in contact recently...

 

ps, with one (different bank), they initially sent just a couple of bits and bobs, despite including some a/c numbers for reference. it took them about 6 months to send all, and around 500£ in comp'n for the continued non compliance and breach of the dpa.

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there is absolutely no harm in send the info they want

jusr scan it and send it

 

 

itsfor an sar to an original creditor

not a CCA request or some letter to a DCA

you are duty bound to sign an sar.

 

 

as for the information

simply state that you wish to have a copy of ALL personal information regarding any account historic or otherwise you one had with them FOR YOU OWN FINANCIAL RECORDS.

you don't need any other reason

 

 

go nail 'em.

  • Confused 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I'll go about writing my response with a copy of that ID whilst also reaffirming that in my original letter I asked for ALL information they hold on me.

:thumb:

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there is absolutely no harm in send the info they want

jusr scan it and send it

 

 

itsfor an sar to an original creditor

not a CCA request or some letter to a DCA

you are duty bound to sign an sar.

 

 

as for the information

simply state that you wish to have a copy of ALL personal information regarding any account historic or otherwise you one had with them FOR YOU OWN FINANCIAL RECORDS.

you don't need any other reason

 

 

go nail 'em.

 

I know I keep repeating this, but thank you everyone for continuing to take the time to reply to my posts, I don't take it for granted and your inputs are of great help.

 

DX, it does say in the letter that I'd need to take whatever ID on the list I choose to a Natwest branch for a staff member to verify it is an original copy and make a copy/verify it for me. Is that legally necessary or can I just send the copy myself without Natwest certification?

 

Thanks again :whoo:

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if theres one near do so.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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