Jump to content

 

BankFodder BankFodder


hayho1

ES/Gladstones Claimform - PCN Kent Street Lpool - ***Claim Discontinued***

style="text-align:center;"> Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 620 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

If you are trying to post information which is relevant to the story in this thread then please flag it up to the site team and they will allow you to post.

Thank you

Recommended Posts

Hi,

 

Please could someone offer some advice please regarding a PNC I have received.

 

Amount due: £100.00.

 

Incident Date: 19/07/2017

 

Reason for issue: Not parking correctly within the markings of the bay or space.

 

 

Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Strange,

the first letter from parking companies is usually for around £50 to £60 then followed up with £100 if no contact is made by the motorist.

 

Don't bother answering any of their silly letters

 

but to give yourself the best possible chance to avoid paying anything

 

please could you answer the following to give us the full picture and so give you the best advice

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?462118-Have-you-received-a-Parking-Ticket

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep. we need much more info to be able to give advice.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for your reply. Please find the information below:

 

 

For PNC's received through the post [ANPR camera capture]

 

please answer the following questions.

 

1 Date of the infringement: 19/07/17 (11:57)

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]: 03/08/17

 

3 Date received: 07/08/17

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] NO

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? YES

 

6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up you appeal] NO

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up

 

7 Who is the parking company? ES Parking Enforcement Ltd.

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town]: Kent Street, Liverpool

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under: BPA

 

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

 

If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it here

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They are dead in the water. NTK sent way after the date it should have been received.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can i ask.. did you get a ticket on windscreen or was it ANPR?

I ask because sometimes some PPC's tell their monkeys to take a picture when issuing a ticket too.

 

If there was a ticket on windscreen, then a different timeframe comes into play regarding NTK.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No ticket was left on the windscreen. The only notification is that which has been received today (ANPR).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hayho1 in your first post you said that the charge was £100.

Did it also offer a reduced payment of around £60 if paid within 14 days of the notice?

 

If it didn't then Renegade Imp makes a good point that there was a ticket issued on the day which would have been around the £60 mark.

That would have been a Notice to Driver.

 

That ticket is some times removed by the company deliberately so that by the time the NTK arrives after the POFA protection has gone.

 

In this instance they apparently didn't use POFA anyway and even if they had, they sent the NTK too early.

 

So still nothing to worry about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

lookinforinfo - Yes the letter states:

 

"payment is now required in the sum of £100.00 within 28 days of the issue date i.e. no later than 31/08/2017. However, if payment is received within 14 days of the issue date, i.e. no later than 17/08/2017, then a reduced amount of £60.00 will be accepted in full and final settlement".

 

Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Since it was ANPR, theres a strict timeline they have to adhere to when sending the NTK. If they didnt meet that timeline, then they cant do anything.


Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many thanks for your feedback.

What would you advise that I do next?

Should I make contact with the Parking enforcement?

 

I have taken some pictures today which illustrate some interesting points:

 

- the parking / bay lines are very faded and not clear to see

 

- the terms and conditions which make reference to parking wholly within the bay are only documented on the small posters distributed around the inside of the building (extremely small font)

 

- the main board when you enter the premises, and which is clear to the eye, documents the terms and conditions, but does not state you must park wholly inside a bay. Instead a different terminology is used i.e. you must park legally and not cause an obstruction

 

- the board outside the building also documents the terms and conditions (including making reference to parking wholly within the bay); however these again are in extremely small font size. Moreover, this states that a reduced fee of £50.00 will be accepted within 14 days, yet my letter states £60.00.

 

- the pay machine also does not document the terms and conditions

images.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

as aready stated, no need for any of that. If it was ANPR capture, then its dead in the water anyway as theyre out of time.

  • Confused 1

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RenegadeImp is quite right -just do nothing.

 

I don't think I have ever seen such a joke of car park instructions.

The IPC should be a laughing stock having them as a member.

And it makes a mockery of the DVLA claim that they have tough safeguards in place to protect motorists [though mostly themselves I fear].

 

Clamping has been outlawed on private land since 2012.

 

a] Vehicles must be parked legally and not causing an obstruction

b] your car must be parked in a designated bay

c] your car must be parked wholly within the confines of a marked parking bay

 

On notices it says all tickets expire at midnight on their ticket machine it says that all tickets expire at 23.59 .

So do next days tickets start at midnight or 00.1?

 

At the entrance it states £5 per visit;

on the tariff notice it says £5 all day

and £1 per hour

so it's not £5 per visit.

 

But does it mean that if you pay for an all day ticket then leave after a few hours,

you have to pay again even though you have an all day ticket in your possession.?

 

Confusion over whether the reduced payment is £50 as per the Notice or £60 as per the letter.

 

They also state on their Notice that failure to pay the charge within a set time will have the debt increased by £40 with further unspecified charges added after that if "debt" still unpaid.

 

To be fair to them on that one the IPC code of Conduct does allow for their members to add costs for unpaid charges in blatant disregard for POFA 2012 so one could postulate that IPC are aiding and abetting their members to break the Law.

 

DVLA when will you ever get a grip.

It's all going on under your nose which is probably a difficult trick when they have their heads in the sand.

 

HAho1 if ES has any sense they will quietly pack their bags and retire quietly from the scene.

We already know from their notices that they have no sense

so further letters will probably keep coming your way.

You know know that there is nothing to worry about with them.

 

A letter of complaint to Trading Standards for threatening to clamp and ditto to DVLA.

Wasting your time with IPC - too incompetent.

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many thanks for your advice; it is greatly appreciated

 

lookinforinfo - Thank you for the feedback. I will take no further action, and now feel at ease not to do so.

 

It is truly remarkable just how many inconsistencies have been captured by the images, some of which I was still unaware of until you highlighted these.

 

Most notably, the £5 per visit OR £5 per day tariff.

 

I often pay for the full day, and sometimes may be required to leave and return as part of my job role.

 

Given two different messages are being received, it is surprising I haven't received a notice for that.

 

Thank you also for the advice re: Trading standards, DVLA. I will act upon this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hayho1

I am pleased that you can now rest easy regardless of how much they add on to the bill plus threaten you with being hung drawn and quartered.

 

Whilst all the time you are having a laugh at their expense.

 

The only thing to watch out for is if you receive a Letter Before Action.

I cannot believe they could be that stupid.

Usually though when people don't respond these companies give up as they realise that their letters and threats do not appear to be scaring you into replying and they move on to those people who they can scare into paying without going to Court.

 

Please keep us updated with Trading Standards and DVLA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we see the photographic evidence they have sent regarding the supposed breach?

If it is via a hand held camera then the parking co will have a lot of explaining to do as to why they are using para 9 of the POFA.

 

If there is no proper photographic evidence then they dont have a claim, simple as that as no valid NTK has been issued.

 

ANPR wont show the alleged infringement, just the comings and goings.

 

Their permission from the ICO wont be allowing them to film the car park itself

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The terms dont appear on the sign so there can never be a breach. I also like the threat that your vehicle may be clamped. That istelf invalidates any contract.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

Sincere apologies for the delay in my reply.

 

Please find attached the photographic evidence

- I think this may have been obtained using CCTV but I cannot be certain.

 

Thanks

Hayley

Inked20170823_190728_LI.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

not CCTV but some twonk with a mobile phone

they could have mitigated this by slapping a ticket on your vehicle and then follow the protocols to create a keeper liability if the driver didnt cough up.

 

Instead they have tried to get round that and rely on papr 9 for remote ticketing ( allowable if you follow the rules) and then cocked up the service of the NTK.

 

This menas no keeper liability and they will ahve broken the law in obtaining your details without a reasonable cause to do so.

 

It would be worth enquiring with the DVLA about who and when your data was given to and the reason claimed to get it.

A formal complaint should be then made to the DVLA.

Eventually enough complaints about these bandits and the govt will have to act.

 

In the meanwhile you can either ignore their silly taradiddles or you can fire off a strongly worded denail.

I would be inclined to let them waste their money until it gets to them using John and Will, the IPC/Gladstones comedy duo to write a scary letter then let them know what you think of it all.

 

This will be evidence that you werent burying your head in the sand but just holding them in the contempt they deserve.

 

we will compose something suitable at the time but suggest that you dont edit its rather forthright content just to be polite

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi EB,

 

thanks for the advice.

We have had a belly full of it in our household.

 

My dad who is also a member of the forum (ste2562) has just had his court case reinstated!

 

I wish to pursue in making a formal complaint to the DVLA,

and enquire about giving my details to such a corrupt company!

 

How would you suggest I proceed in doing this?

 

As suggested I will go ahead and ignore the company until any further correspondence.

 

thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

firstly you need to ask the DVLA who has accessed your keeper details and why.

 

Now, as they didnt issue the NTK until 2 days after the allowed time

it would be interesting to see when they accessed the database

as if it was on that date they coould never have any reason to do so as the POFA wouldnt apply

 

then they have to know who the driver was so keeper details irrelevant=unlawful access {telling lies about circumstance, even if just tickng a box)

 

The bad news is the DVLA will do sod all about it as thay make millions a year as a result of these bandit's activities

but it will give you reason to complain to your MP and also to sue ES for breach of teh DPA

( no reaon to get details thus unlawful processing of your data

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi EB,

 

I contacted the DVLA to enquire about who accessed my details and the reason given for doing so.

 

This is the response I received:

 

Information about registered keepers of vehicles can be released by the DVLA under the provisions of the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002.

This legislation allows vehicle keeper details to be disclosed to third parties who can demonstrate that they have a reasonable cause to receive it.

 

Reasonable cause is not defined in legislation but the Government’s policy is that it should relate to the vehicle or its use,

following incidents where there may be liability on the part of the driver.

Guidance on what constitutes reasonable cause is published online.

 

So we can assist you further with your request for specific information, please send your request to:

 

DRVE

DVLA

Swansea

SA99 1AJ

 

Would you recommend that I go ahead by asking the same questions by writing to the DVLA, and not mention anything yet as to why I am enquiring?

 

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you need to write to them again and complain that they have failed to answer the request for information and to stop sending cut and paste responses when you ask for details of who and why.

 

Tell them that you are aware they send out hundreds of these pointless letters when people make specific enquiries and that you will be informing your MP of their deliberate obfuscation to your request

 

when you say something you do it

so do write to your MP with a complaint about the DVLA'S cut and paste replies that provide no information and appear to protect the guilty in the name of making £2.50 without insisting on some form of evidence from the parking co's.

 

This is something that is a topic of consideration in parliament,

the parking companies are lobbying to make the keeper liable in every case and that if allowed means that they will be able to send out completely random demands any time up to 6 years after a parking event with no evidence and it will be damned difficult to defend.

 

The consumer lobby is popinting out that event eh biggest and most honest of the parking co's are lazy, wronga dn dishonest on many occasions and shouldnt be trusted witht he powers they already have, let alone given new ones.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for your advice EB.

 

I was very disappointed by the response to say the least!

 

I am putting together a letter to my MP and also in the process of writing to the DVLA again. I will put these important points across and notify of the outcome.

 

KR

Hayley

 

I have put together a letter which I intend to forward onto my MP, the DVLA, TS and BPA. I thought i would post it should I need to adjust according to the audience.

 

Thanks

H

car park.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

waste of time.

 

I said write to your MP about the DVLA's failure to reply to a specific request and send a generic garbage letter instead.

 

All of the detail about the parking event is of no interest to anyone else because it has no bearing on the DVLA's actions.

 

Keep it simple and keep focussed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    No registered users viewing this page.


  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...