unknown cabot/mortimer CCJ filed at old address - old welcome returned car finance - now warrant/AEO

[AndyOrch]

Not sure I follow that but whatever you do if they dont get payment this month from you...they will get it next month by AoE...only a set a side application N244 will halt matters.

[thefunkymonk]

What I am saying is that if I file to set aside and lose , I lose the court fee and potentially costs from the other side. So I end up owning the £900 plus the court fee plus whatever hundreds the other sides costs come to.

 

I am waiting for the results of a subject access request from Welcome Finance which they have 40 days to provide ( I applied to them a week or so ago) and a copy of the CCJ from the business Centre

 

I am still on the hook for this £30 a month to pay the solicitors directly as a result of the suspended AOE order i got last week.

 

I can either ignore it, pay it or under the terms i have 16 days to object to it.

 

That timescale means i am not likely to have info from Welcome and Business Centre etc before ther 16 days is up.

 

So .........

 

if i do pay month 1 - that buys me another 30 days to receive all the info. If having received it, I remain confident I have a good chance of winning then i can pay the court fee of £255 and ask the CCJ to be overturned. I stop paying the £30 a month and take the risk the suspended order gets unsuspended but at least I have a reasonable reason for doing so....

[AndyOrch]

So keep making the £30 payment until you have all the information and decide what to do.

[thefunkymonk]

Thanks.

 

Will do.

 

Do you have any idea what costs the other side are likely to claim if i were to ask for the CCJ to be overturned and lose the case ?

 

Is there any reason why I would object to the suspended AOE I jsut received within the 16 days ? Ie is .... I am apply for it to be overturned a reason to do that ?

[AndyOrch]

Depends on whether there is a hearing and whether they instruct Counsel or use a Barrister...fees vary...but as you made the application you are responsible for their costs should you lose.

 

There is no valid or logical reason why you would object to a suspended AOE as the defendant...the claimant may ..he lost.

[thefunkymonk]

I can think of a logical reason for a lay person ....I don't owe the money ....I am ignorant of the law ....Can you Suspend the payment until ...they wont tell me what it is about and i have to get details of the CCJ from business Centre ... I cant afford it ..If i pay this am i not prejudicing the overturn case ?

 

 

But on the overturning CCJ issue ..

 

So if there is a hearing and they instruct a Barrister costs could be £1000-£1500 ?

 

Seems a bit rough on the Defendant that you have to risk these costs to try to overturn a CCJ you knew nothing about because it was served on an old address and the CCJ is for £900...

 

But ..if thats what it is .. thats what it is ..

[AndyOrch]

Thats why I suggested approaching them in post #47 to agree a set a side by Consent...costs you nothing..and thats if they would agree..there as to be something in that offer to their benefit..IE a F&FS or a decent monthly payment plan.

 

You have already suspended the AoE...whether you pay them informally is your choice...as stated only an application will stay everything...but your not ready to set a side and so we go around in circles.

[thefunkymonk]

So an application to overturn the CCJ will "Stay" (put on hold) the need for me to pay them the £30 a month that the suspended AOE requires ?

 

I can use the suspended AOE plus any other evidence etc to discuss a full and Final Settlement to the solicitors

 

If I ignore the requirement to pay £30 a month then I risk the solicitors going back to the court to ask for the AOE to be unsuspended, adding costs and most likely resulting in an AOE for the £30 a month (or more )

 

If I do apply for the CCJ to be overturned I get them to pay my costs if I win and they get me to pay their costs if they win.

[AndyOrch]

Yep...not overturned...set a side.

[thefunkymonk]

Thanks again.

[thefunkymonk]

Ok I have got a copy of CCJ and unfortunately it has been issued to my current address in 2015.

 

Do I have any realistic chance of setting this aside now ?

[AndyOrch]

Depends...was you relying on it going to a previous address as a reason to set a side ?

[thefunkymonk]

No the set aside would be because I VTd the vehicle in 2011 and I have the letter plus the condition report obtained on collection in 2011.

 

i think this relates to charges they have added or monies they will claim were outstanding or due at the time of VTing (maybe some insurance stuff, fees, possibly a payment on the car for the month I Vtd)

 

I moved to my current address in 2014.

 

I don't know how I missed this CCJ but I obviously have ...

 

I do suffer from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome it does result in some memory issues but I am able to hold down a job with it.

 

I was in a tough place back in 2009-2011 after I had had a virus that Drs believe resulted in the CFS. I ended up on statutory sick pay for a while and had as teenage child to support.

 

I had various debts from recent split with my husband and the CFS resulted in me getting behind on payments for my car.

 

Welcome used to ring me several times a week even after agreeing a payment plan and submitting means etc and whilst making the agreed payments.

 

I had a few others doing the same which meant i was getting 2-3 phone calls most night and several times a week from various creditors all of whom I had informed of my situation and submitted income and expenditure for and was making minum payments.

 

they were relentless and so much so that my current partner could se it was making me a nervous wreck and started the process of stopping these calls ( or me answering them). He said what they were doing amounted to harassment as I had kept them fully informed was making payments they had agreed after I had completed all their forms.

 

It was as part of this process he worked out I could VT the car, which is what I did.

 

I was up to date on payments to Welcome Finance by 2010 and remained so until VTing in 2011.

[dx100uk]

you Vt'd they cant add anything.

which is why they sold it on.

[thefunkymonk]

Update.

 

I am now rapidly approaching the date I am required to make the first payment under the Suspended AOE.

 

Nothing back from Welcome Finance

 

nothing Back from Cabot.

 

Have called the Solicitor acting for Cabot to ask where info is and advise I am about to make an application to set aside on grounds that I VTd agreement and have proof of such.

 

 

I am ringing to give them an opportunity to avoid more legal fees because .. i dont have to pay a fee on grounds of low income and it was VTd etc ...

 

After the run around from a couple of junior staff they are asking me to give them a couple of days to try and ascertain what the debt breakdown was etc and get back to me.

 

I was told welcome Finance had received a last payment in the month prior to my VT letter which was sent 2 days before the end of the month. The end of the month was when I made installment payments under the agreement.

 

It seems that they have very limited information and so there is a strong suspicion that they dont really have all the documentation and details.

 

I know and have evidence to show the car was collected and sent to auction 2 weeks after the date of the VT letter.

 

The amount they claim I owed is about 3 monthly installments on the car and looks to be a lot less an amount than would be due under the agreement if I had actually Voluntary Surrendered the car..(value of car at auction, length of agreement remaining, no arrears on account)

 

So I am pretty sure I never owed them this money..

 

I am waiting for them to get back to me fairly sure I have bought some time to stop them applying for the suspended AOE to be lifted.

 

I am not going to make the first payment due under the Suspended AOE either.

[dx100uk]

post 57.

 

 

dx

[thefunkymonk]

Ok the Welcome Finance SAR info has turned up.

 

No call back from Solicitors as they said they would do earlier in the week.

 

It appears that this sum originates from their claim that there was a balance of around £700 on the account after the vehicle was VTd. They appear to acknowledge it is at least a request to VT and there are also entries from a previous year where their call log says I asked them about my right to VT.

 

They do have a copy of the Credit Agreement and that includes a figure under Termination - Your Rights. I refer to this figure in my letter to them to VT and the amount I have paid them to date is significantly higher than this amount

 

I took the agreement out in October of 2008 and the last payment they got from me was February 2011. it was a 48 month agreement.

 

On the Agreement there is an amount of £1350 for insurances. Total amount of Credit is just over 7k and this includes nearly £1k for "credit for the insurances"

 

there appears to be a blance of about £4000 on the account 2 days after I sent my VT request letter (also backed up by a cal lto them recorded on their logs onm that day)

 

there is a credit adjustment on the account on the day they collected the vehicle and an interest adjustment that take the balance down to around £700

 

So the balance claimed is made up of about £50 they say is due for the car and about £650 for insurances.

 

 

 

So the claim largely relates to them wanting me to pay the insurances after VTing the vehicle

[dx100uk]

they cant as that is reclaimable

scan the agreement and the statements. to ONE multipage PDF please

[thefunkymonk]

they cant as that is reclaimable

scan the agreement and the statements. to ONE multipage PDF please

 

Will do .. i am off on hold for a week in 2 hrs ... will sort when I get back.

 

Thank you again for your help..

[thefunkymonk]

Here we go...pdf uploaded

 

Not spoken to them for a while..but will be doing in a few days to make second payment of 30 and to discuss rest of it.

docs1.pdf

[dx100uk]

oh dear shot themselves in the foot.

 

is there your sig in both boxes of page 1

 

you actually only owed 42.91

 

the rest is optional insurances they spoofed you out of

 

and their 2011 shows they didn't rebated the on going ins charges

 

imho claim is dead in the water totally/

 

as they must have gotten more than £42 at auction for the motor...

 

dx

[thefunkymonk]

Yes it is signed in both by me.

 

So I negotiate with them , then if they wont drop it I take them to court ?

[dx100uk]

no!!

 

this to me smacks of multiple agreement failing under part 18 is it?

long time ago fuzzy brain at the moment.

 

the whole agreement should have been cancelled at VT not JUST the car part.

as then the insurances would ended then too

 

and if you look

they purposefully DIDNT rebate it as they should have done.

 

gotta poke my brain on multiple agreements

there a few very long threads here about it all.

 

gotta feeling it voids the whole agreement!! perfect set aside reason!!

[dx100uk]

ah yes time for you to go read:

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?456690-Multiple-agreements-falling-within-section-18-CCA-1974-(update)

[thefunkymonk]

Ok I understand that s18.

 

Now

 

So if I apply to have the CCJ set aside/stayed and fork out the court fee/get a fee remission, the risk to the other side is that they will have to defend it/something at some stage thus incurring extra costs ? So that is my leverage on top of the s18 argument ?

 

Otherwise why would they just walk away ?

 

Also you mention above that they would have gotten a sum of £ for selling the car at auction.

 

Why is this relevant (other than it shows they got some £ on top of what I had paid them) ?

 

Thanks again.