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    • Sorry DX my over excitement or annoyance. On this bank of Scotland credit... Taken out 2003 defaulted and sold to Cabot around 2006. Been paying them £5 a month upto July 2016. Then on advice...thanks DX...CCA to them. Normal response no information available,will be in touch again in 40 days. Out of the blue Jan 2021 reiterated balance outstanding. I explained about my CCA request back in 2016 and they could not find anything. They then advised they would investigate and to give them 16 weeks. Out of curiosity today rang them..about 15 weeks. Advised they had a an agreement for the card. As yet nothing in the post. Hope that makes more sense🙂
    • Thanks BankFodder for your help. I will just wait for mediation process to begin and then take it from there, using the advice and guidance on how to go about mediation from previous cases in this forum.
    • Hi dx I was working agency work at that time and very unreliable.   papayoo
    • And presumably it has been thoroughly checked out mechanically. You're confident that you have identified all the defects. Your situation is this: You can certainly bring a County Court claim against the dealer and on the basis of what you say, you will probably win. Under ordinary contract law, it might be considered that the breach of contract is not overly serious and you have not been deprived of substantially the whole benefit of the contract. On that basis you would more likely to be awarded a sum of damages to reflect the reduced value of the vehicle had it been correctly advertised. Under ordinary contract law, the breach would have had to be so serious that it could be said that you had been deprived of substantially the whole benefit of the contract. This is what is called in law – a fundamental breach – and this would allow you to treat the contract as terminated. This is where you find a difference between ordinary contract law – the common law of contract – and the statutory rights provided under the Consumer Rights Act. Under the Consumer Rights Act, because you have identified a defect and asserted your right to reject within 30 days, then you are entitled to reject the entire contract simply on the basis that the vehicle is not of satisfactory quality – even though you have not been deprived of the whole benefit of the contract because you are still driving the thing around. In other words, the car is not up to the standard that you would expect considering all the circumstances – and particularly in view of the price – about £26,000, even though it is generally speaking a working vehicle. This is why you are better off suing under the Consumer Rights Act because I understand that you want to reject the vehicle and you would not be prepared to accept a reduction in price – although you could negotiate this if you wanted. The complicating factor here is the value of the vehicle. If the dealer Hills Prestige of Lymington,  want to stick their heels in, then you will be obliged to bring a County Court claim against them. Where a claim is for a figure less than £10,000, the action is allocated to the small claims track. Small claims track rules concerning costs are that even if you lose your case, you won't have to bear the costs of the winner. In other words each party bears their own costs. This is done to discourage expensive litigation. It doesn't always work because large corporations don't give a fig and they will spend huge amounts of money trying to crush their customers rather than settle claims which are worth a tiny fraction of the litigation costs; all too often they are bullies. Where the claim is more than £10,000 then it gets allocated to the fast track. This means that if you lose the case then you will have to bear a substantial portion of the costs of the winning party. This can act as a real disincentive to litigate. The problem is that some companies use this as an opportunity to intimidate their customer – who is generally speaking a litigant in person – with the prospect of substantial costs in the event that the customer loses the action. This can put a lot of people off very understandably. Your chances of success here are extremely good that you need to be aware that your risk factor if you lost, you might be faced with a fairly high level of costs – which could be more than £5000. If Hills Prestige of Lymington, decide that as part of the litigation strategy they want to intimidate you, then they could litigate in a way which causes obstacles and delays and which incurs greater costs for them and they would do this simply to raise in your mind the spectre that if you were to lose, then you would be liable for a large proportion of those costs incurred. It's a nasty – who-blinks-first – style of litigation. It doesn't always happen but it can do. Conversely, if you brought this action and you wln then they would have to pay your costs. Perversely though, because (I imagine) you would be bringing the action yourselves, you would only be able to recover your costs at a litigant in person rate which is currently about £18 per hour. I say it's perverse because if you decided that you wanted to employ lawyers to represent you, they would be able to recover their costs at the professional rate. It's also perverse because even though you might decide to try and save money and incur only litigant in person costs, if you lost the action you would have to pay the dealer's costs at the professional way of their legal representatives – assuming that they used professional legal assistance. If you wanted to bring a legal action then we can help you all the way although of course it would be you who would be going to court. We would simply be advising you and helping you to draft your documents and advising you on strategy.  
    • Yes no indication that it was a private sale until we asked for our money back under right to reject. With regards to repairs, the only outstanding defects seem to be slight misalignment of ns wing, overspray on components inside engine compartment, but we were able to find out some of the parts replaced from Toyota, such as ns wing, bonnet, front bumper, front grill, A/C radiator, inner flitch plate which is poorly finished and front bumper support. That doesn’t count as Immaculate to me.
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    • Hi @BankFodder
      Sorry for only updating you now, but after your guidance with submitting the claim it was pretty straight forward and I didn't want to unnecessarily waste your time. Especially with this guide you wrote here, so many thanks for that
      So I issued the claim on day 15 and they requested more time to respond.
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GP Receptonist - Refused to escalate call to Practice Manager/Trying to cover her tracks


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I rang the GP surgery due to having problems with the online booking system, this particular bad mannered receptionist talked down to me in a demeaming manner, telling me to use the online booking system at 7.45am in the morning. I tell her the online booking system is showing the next 3 weeks as not available to book an appointment and question her why? Her response to use it 7.45am in the morning or ring for an appointment at 8am. I tell her I can't because I'm travelling to work that time, she responds thats the only option and she gets more and more agressive during the call, like she's on a power trip. I tell her I'm making a complaint.

 

I ring back after a few days, its the same receptionist, she takes my details (d.o.b), I ask to speak to the Practice Manager, she tells me 'We don't escalate calls to the practice manager. you have to put it into writing'. She keeps on repeating this over and over. I feel I'm getting no where and she's looking for a verbal confrotation after realising its me who and she asks "is it about the complaint against me?" I say no, but she asks "so whats the complaint about about you want to tell the practice manager or is it about not getting your appopintment within the 3 day time limit (I was given it 3 weeks later!!!)

 

She asks "is it about the complaint against me? or about your appointment in 3 weeks time" I tell her its neither, but she keeps interrogating me over and over. Her tone of voice is aggressive, she talking loudly and I can hear her colleagues in the background. She tells me "I can't give you the practice manangers details, put the complaint in writing" and she's questioning me time and time about what issue is about (she's trying to find out why I want to speak to the practice manager, so she can pre-empt and try to cover her tracks before the practice manager receives the complaint.

 

I can hear her colleagues in the background and tell her, she's breaking confidentiality/privacy by talking loud about my matter in from of her colleagues (she's buzzing of the power trip in front of her colleagues".

 

She tells me I'm breaking confidentiality by talking to her in the presence of my family because she can hear them in the background!!!

 

She tells me the call is recorded and we are not getting anywhere and she will end the call. I say her attitude towards me is bad, she's not professional and she's now talking over me, interrupting me constantly, then she slams the phone down.

 

My health is not good at the moment and this effected my health....what can I do now to put her strong complaint in and get this receptionist dismissed because of above and she's openly discussed my issue with her colleagues and she went through my notes when she took the call, trying to find out if she could find out why I wanted to speak to the practice manager.

 

Please help.

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I would rather not say at this moment in time for fear of being struck off and treated badly. If your able to help me I would appreciate it. The receptionists behaviour way out of order and I have a recording of the conversation as proof in case the surgery claim they don't have a copy. Nevertheless the practive manager needs to know what is happening and I would not be surprised if others have been treated in a similiar way. I am going to take this all the way...if the more experienced members of the forum can help me

 

Which practice is this please?
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Most GP Practice expect you to put your complaint in writing. Can you not do this? Alternatively, go round to the practice and ask to speak to the PM - You might then get a different receptionist.

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You've been treated rudely and dismissively,. The receptionist is at fault, she's publicly aired the discussion she's had with you in front of her colleagues/patients but the way she's acted and her agressive behaviour towards you is outright disgraceful. I guess her refusing to deny you to speak to the practice manager, is her attempt to hide her tracks and be sneaky. I would suggest you ask the more experienced members on here on how to draft up a letter of complaint.

 

 

If she acted like this working for say a bank, she would be out of the door...its not acceptable, no excuses

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There’s a good few points to address here so I’ll try to do it in order but if I get sidetracked bear with me. I’ve read your message a few times over the weekend so hopefully I can have a relatively good understanding of what’s happened / happening.

 

I’ll start with what seemed to be the original issue – online booking / availability. Online booking systems take a few different forms but they’re actually all quite similar. It would seem that you’d had difficulty finding an available appointment and the receptionist had asked that you either call or try online from a certain time. That will almost certainly be because their appointments system does not release their book on the day appointments until that morning. This process protects these book on the day appointments from being booked beforehand and actually the 07:45 release of online appointments means that patients can’t sneak online at 00:01 and book everything up eight hours before the phone lines open. So, the almost simultaneous release of online and telephone appointments makes the system as fair as possible for everyone. The three week wait for a pre-bookable appointment is about right as these tend to be reserved for those with chronic conditions who need ongoing review.

 

So, then we come to the conflict with the receptionist. Your post explains that neither the online booking nor call at 8am met your preferences as you were driving to work. Can I ask then what exactly you had hoped that the receptionist would do? The booking policy at the practice seems relatively straightforward and therefore fair to everyone, call at 08:00 or online at 07:45. What sort of an exception to this would have been acceptable? Nevertheless, it seems that in sticking to the policy the receptionist was unreasonable in your view and on a ‘power trip’ because they didn’t bend the rules to suit your commute.

 

After a few days you call back, where the receptionist tries to explain the practice policy on complaints handling, repeatedly; presumably meaning that you were also unhappy with them sticking to policy and tried multiple times to be put through as you say you were getting nowhere. They ask what it’s regarding, presumably in an attempt to resolve it for you, exactly as I expect my reception team to do.

 

Reception / office areas in a GP practice are generally shielded from noise finding its way into the public waiting area, be that by virtue of a glass screen, doors, or perhaps a radio playing to mask conversation. The reception team are however all bound by the same confidentiality agreement in their contracts and therefore there is no breach in hearing a one sided conversation held by a colleague. If that were the case all GP receptionists across the UK would have to be sat in individual little booths.

 

Interestingly too, the call is recorded, as a PM the first thing I’d do is pull those recordings and listen to them, as I’m also bound by the confidentiality agreement and have good reason to do so. So, confidentiality isn’t broken in the confines of the practice. I also ask that our team access the computerised notes of a patient when speaking to them. On there are any pieces of information that will be relevant to the person taking the call, such as advice notes if someone needs longer appointments, contact details should a caller fall ill during the call and other information such as next / previous appointments.

 

But we come on to what seems to be the final conversation, where the receptionist agrees with you that you’re not getting anywhere and rather than continue a confrontational call they terminate it whilst you’re telling them that they have a bad attitude.

 

I’m astonished that you would seek to have someone dismissed from their job because they followed the GP / PM’s instructions on how to deal with a complaint, how to book on the day appointments and how to deal with a patient on the telephone who will not accept what’s being said and resorts to saying that they are unprofessional and have a bad attitude.

 

So from a PM’s perspective; and I’m sorry you probably won’t like this.

 

It’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the booking policy to suit your commute to work, it’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the practice complaints procedure, regardless of how many times someone asks, it is within the gift of my receptionists here to terminate a call that is no longer getting anywhere if it starts to degrade into name calling. It is my decision, along with the partners of the practice about how I deal with my staff when they do not meet my expectations and any action I do take will be in line with ACAS guidance.

 

Please do put a complaint into writing, you could even just copy and paste your first post and send that, but do expect that the recordings of your calls will be played, do expect that the receptionist will not be disciplined for doing exactly as they’ve been asked to do and understand that ensuring that appointments are accessible to as many of the thousands of people registered at your practice as possible means that the policy might not suit your exact needs.

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My views are my own and are not representative of any organisation. if you've found my post helpful please click on the star below.

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So from a PM’s perspective; and I’m sorry you probably won’t like this.

 

It’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the booking policy to suit your commute to work, it’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the practice complaints procedure, regardless of how many times someone asks, it is within the gift of my receptionists here to terminate a call that is no longer getting anywhere if it starts to degrade into name calling. It is my decision, along with the partners of the practice about how I deal with my staff when they do not meet my expectations and any action I do take will be in line with ACAS guidance.

 

Please do put a complaint into writing, you could even just copy and paste your first post and send that, but do expect that the recordings of your calls will be played, do expect that the receptionist will not be disciplined for doing exactly as they’ve been asked to do and understand that ensuring that appointments are accessible to as many of the thousands of people registered at your practice as possible means that the policy might not suit your exact needs.

 

Agreed 100% ; PROVIDED the receptionist was just following policy, and wasn't rude .... and the call recordings will confirm or refute this.......

 

So, if the OP still feels the receptionist was out of line, they SHOULD complain, and the practice manager can assess that complaint.

 

Rudeness, or not following policy should result in disciplinary action and/or retraining. Assertiveness while following policy should result in a commendation for handling a difficult situation appropriately, and can be used as a training example for others!.

Either way, it can only be assessed if you make the complaint, and the recording is reviewed.

 

OP: if the 'booking window' is during your commute : go in to work earlier or later that day, or get someone to book the appointment on your behalf.

Alternatively, if the practice has an app for online booking, and you have a compatible smartphone, find somewhere safe and legal where you can use your smartphone (pausing your commute if driving) , and use the app to book the appointment.

Once booked in you can speak with the GP about seeing the practice manager, and/or get an idea of the 'booking policy' : if you have specific reasons why you can't use 'their system' to get an appointment ask for them to make an exception for you taking into account your specific needs.

(They'll do this for someone with specific needs, or work out a way for you to be able to use the system ; just don't expect them to jump through hoops if it is 'can't be bothered to find a way to use the system, like everyone else has to (absent specific needs)' rather than 'has specific needs which the practice will make changes to accommodate').

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Totally agree, Bazza. There's a line between firmly sticking to the policies and processes in place and being rude. However, not getting what you want doesn't automatically mean that the receptionist is rude or unprofessional. If my colleagues have in to every request for slightly different treatment then the whole system would disintegrate. We do allow patients with specific needs to use our system to the best of their abilities but I'm afraid that I would have never have considered a slightly inconvenient commute timing as a specific need. I'd just expect the patient to do what I and tens of thousands of others do and make allowances for it by setting of earlier or agreeing a slightly later start in order to do what I need to do. After all I wouldn't expect another organisation to alter their behaviour just to suit me.

 

If the recordings of the calls show that my colleagues were indeed rude then that'd be disappointing but it doesn't change the core message, only that they need some direction on how to deliver it rather than be summarily dismissed.

My views are my own and are not representative of any organisation. if you've found my post helpful please click on the star below.

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Every receptionist I've spoken to has told me they won't let me see the PM, because she doesn't see patients...now you see what kind of receptionists I'm having to deal with,

Most GP Practice expect you to put your complaint in writing. Can you not do this? Alternatively, go round to the practice and ask to speak to the PM - You might then get a different receptionist.
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Let me start by saying the I did not try to book use online booking system to book an appointment for the same day (because you can never get an appoitment the same day...only a handful of 'available' slots are show) so thats a waste of time. What I wanted was an appointment later in the week...After all the GP practice state you can 'book 3 days in advance...' this is wha I tried and it does not work in practice because I was given an appointment in 3 weeks time. How can you explain that the appointment slots were some how magically all taken up for a solid 3 weeks on the day I called?

 

Secondly the receptionist explanation on complaint handling was wrong...the website says you can see the PM and she was telling me its against privacy issues?!? - She's confused and does not know what she is talking about.

 

Thirdly...she was rude in how she was talking to me, very aggressive and kept on interuppting me for no reason...is this the type of receptionist you would be happy to employ?

There’s a good few points to address here so I’ll try to do it in order but if I get sidetracked bear with me. I’ve read your message a few times over the weekend so hopefully I can have a relatively good understanding of what’s happened / happening.

 

I’ll start with what seemed to be the original issue – online booking / availability. Online booking systems take a few different forms but they’re actually all quite similar. It would seem that you’d had difficulty finding an available appointment and the receptionist had asked that you either call or try online from a certain time. That will almost certainly be because their appointments system does not release their book on the day appointments until that morning. This process protects these book on the day appointments from being booked beforehand and actually the 07:45 release of online appointments means that patients can’t sneak online at 00:01 and book everything up eight hours before the phone lines open. So, the almost simultaneous release of online and telephone appointments makes the system as fair as possible for everyone. The three week wait for a pre-bookable appointment is about right as these tend to be reserved for those with chronic conditions who need ongoing review.

 

So, then we come to the conflict with the receptionist. Your post explains that neither the online booking nor call at 8am met your preferences as you were driving to work. Can I ask then what exactly you had hoped that the receptionist would do? The booking policy at the practice seems relatively straightforward and therefore fair to everyone, call at 08:00 or online at 07:45. What sort of an exception to this would have been acceptable? Nevertheless, it seems that in sticking to the policy the receptionist was unreasonable in your view and on a ‘power trip’ because they didn’t bend the rules to suit your commute.

 

After a few days you call back, where the receptionist tries to explain the practice policy on complaints handling, repeatedly; presumably meaning that you were also unhappy with them sticking to policy and tried multiple times to be put through as you say you were getting nowhere. They ask what it’s regarding, presumably in an attempt to resolve it for you, exactly as I expect my reception team to do.

 

Reception / office areas in a GP practice are generally shielded from noise finding its way into the public waiting area, be that by virtue of a glass screen, doors, or perhaps a radio playing to mask conversation. The reception team are however all bound by the same confidentiality agreement in their contracts and therefore there is no breach in hearing a one sided conversation held by a colleague. If that were the case all GP receptionists across the UK would have to be sat in individual little booths.

 

Interestingly too, the call is recorded, as a PM the first thing I’d do is pull those recordings and listen to them, as I’m also bound by the confidentiality agreement and have good reason to do so. So, confidentiality isn’t broken in the confines of the practice. I also ask that our team access the computerised notes of a patient when speaking to them. On there are any pieces of information that will be relevant to the person taking the call, such as advice notes if someone needs longer appointments, contact details should a caller fall ill during the call and other information such as next / previous appointments.

 

But we come on to what seems to be the final conversation, where the receptionist agrees with you that you’re not getting anywhere and rather than continue a confrontational call they terminate it whilst you’re telling them that they have a bad attitude.

 

I’m astonished that you would seek to have someone dismissed from their job because they followed the GP / PM’s instructions on how to deal with a complaint, how to book on the day appointments and how to deal with a patient on the telephone who will not accept what’s being said and resorts to saying that they are unprofessional and have a bad attitude.

 

So from a PM’s perspective; and I’m sorry you probably won’t like this.

 

It’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the booking policy to suit your commute to work, it’s not within the gift of the receptionist to change the practice complaints procedure, regardless of how many times someone asks, it is within the gift of my receptionists here to terminate a call that is no longer getting anywhere if it starts to degrade into name calling. It is my decision, along with the partners of the practice about how I deal with my staff when they do not meet my expectations and any action I do take will be in line with ACAS guidance.

 

Please do put a complaint into writing, you could even just copy and paste your first post and send that, but do expect that the recordings of your calls will be played, do expect that the receptionist will not be disciplined for doing exactly as they’ve been asked to do and understand that ensuring that appointments are accessible to as many of the thousands of people registered at your practice as possible means that the policy might not suit your exact needs.

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Let me start by saying the I did not try to book use online booking system to book an appointment for the same day (because you can never get an appoitment the same day...only a handful of 'available' slots are show) so thats a waste of time. What I wanted was an appointment later in the week...After all the GP practice state you can 'book 3 days in advance...' this is wha I tried and it does not work in practice because I was given an appointment in 3 weeks time. How can you explain that the appointment slots were some how magically all taken up for a solid 3 weeks on the day I called?

 

Secondly the receptionist explanation on complaint handling was wrong...the website says you can see the PM and she was telling me its against privacy issues?!? - She's confused and does not know what she is talking about.

 

Thirdly...she was rude in how she was talking to me, very aggressive and kept on interuppting me for no reason...is this the type of receptionist you would be happy to employ?

 

Okay, so the appointments were booked because they're a finite resource, once those in three days are booked then there's no magic involved just simple supply and demand. We can't offer a patient an appointment that's already booked by someone else, I'm certain that British Airways allow me to book in advance too but once those seats are full the website's general statements of 'Book Now' or something similar are pretty useless. It's no secret whatsoever that GP services all over the UK are under exceptional demand and in suggesting that you call at 8am the receptionist was offering their advice on how to get the best chance of accessing a convenient appointment, after all, they're the ones that book them day in, day out.

 

Given that you claim that the receptionists have consistently explained that the PM is not available and to direct your complaint in writing, as you've so ably done here, I'm struggling to see why it's such an issue. Perhaps the PM is unavailable due to personal issues or on leave and in their absence the senior partner is handling any complaints that may arise. I don't alter my practice website to advise people of my availability because I expect that a consistent message from my reception team will be sufficient to explain to people that I'm not able to meet with them, I do not expect to have to justify that repeatedly.

 

I do employ receptionists who are assertive and I ask them to be; as Bazza explained earlier and I agreed, there is a difference between rudeness and assertiveness but I wonder what they felt the need to repeat themselves, I wonder why they felt the need to talk over you, I wonder why you were not able to accept the explanation provided to you and escalate the call to the point where the receptionist who deals with hundreds of people every day during difficult times in their lives felt that their only option was to put the telephone down on you. I don't expect my receptionists to spend time that could be spent helping people arguing over semantics about what the website says when they've tried to explain something for the umpteenth time.

 

Like I said earlier, you're not going to like what I'm saying, I accept that entirely but please do try to see this in the cold light of day. You asked for an appointment, there were none available. You were advised to call on the day at 8am but that didn't suit your drive to work, you asked to speak with the PM and were advised on how to access them but this seemingly didn't suit either and then when the receptionists didn't cave into your repeated requests then they were rude and unprofessional.

 

You want my honest advice as a PM? Write to your practice manager, as suggested, have them pull the tapes (I've had a few interesting experiences of doing this where when hearing themselves staff and patients alike realise how they were actually coming across) and listen to them with the PM and point out where you think they were being unreasonable.

 

You didn't answer my questions about what concessions you expected the receptionist to make to the policies that they've been asked to work to in relation to booking an appointment or accessing the PM.

My views are my own and are not representative of any organisation. if you've found my post helpful please click on the star below.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I thought I would add my thoughts to this discussion.

 

I have just logged into my Patient Access account and the first available appointment is the 19th of May. Not one of the available appointments for that week are with my GP. The reason. She has now gone part time (semi retired) , is very popular, treats people like people and if you do get an appointment with her, expect it to be at least an hour after the time (unless I'm the first on the list-VERY rare) as she will spend as much time as the patient needs.

 

The surgery has a triage as well and if you ring before 10am you will be called back by a nurse who will assess you over the phone and if needed arrange an appointment that day or if no immediate rush, the next day. If a home call is needed, the GP will ring direct to see what is needed and attend shortly after. My surgery also offers telephone appointments where my GP will ring me at some point in the day. These are only used when I need to talk to her but not actually see her. This works well in my area.

 

With regard to the Practice Manager, I can drop in whenever and ask to see her. If she isn't available, they will take my details and she will ring me. I have never been spoken down to by anyone for the simple reason, I know just how busy they are and I must be expected to wait according to my need.

 

I treat everyone I meet with the same respect I expect from them.

 

While I understand that each practice is different, I have to fit around them, not them working around me.

 

To the OP. Is it that hard to arrange your work life around the need to ring at 8am? Start work an hour later. Have half a day off. Not that hard, is it?

If you are asked to deal with any matter via private message, PLEASE report it.

Everything I say is opinion only. If you are unsure on any comment made, you should see a qualified solicitor

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