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    • I'm afraid that I think that as you've assembled the chair and you are unable to return it into its saleable condition, then you probably have a problem. I don't think you could take advantage of the distance selling rules in those circumstances and that means that the seller would be entitled to apply conditions to the return of the item. If that's the case then you only fall back is that the item was defective if you find that there is something wrong with it which is preventing its disassembly. On the other hand, this itself raises an interesting issue. Does a chair become of unsatisfactory quality because you can't take it apart and put it in a box? From the sounds of it, the sellers terms and conditions that there is a restocking fee for the return of an online sale even if it is within the 14 day period, seems to me to be quite unenforceable but on the basis of what you say, that issue doesn't arise here because you are unable to put the chair back into its saleable condition and it's not clear that the chair is defective - 
    • Hi everyone, I'm in need of some urgent advice please. Apologies for the long post - I felt it was better to provide all the information clearly at the outset.   I purchased an office stool (that cost £104.39) online, which was delivered on 18th May. After assembling the stool, I found it wasn't suitable for me, so contacted the seller on 27th May to initiate a return.    The seller told me that there would be a "£24.95 handling charge" for returning the item. He quoted the terms and conditions from their website to back this up (please see below), although this is confusing because 35% of £104.39 does not equal £24.95: "Please note that furniture items are subject to a 35% restocking fee. Furniture returns will only be accepted if the item is unused and still in the original packaging. All furniture returns must be made within 14 days of delivery."   I told the seller that, under the Consumer Contract Regulations, the trader cannot charge any fees in the event of cancellation. The response was: "If you not happy to pay for the collection charge for us to arrange this with a courier to uplift then you can send this back to our office directly arranging your own courier, please note we would not cover the cost if this is the case."    I agreed to this, because from my reading of the CCR I thought that the customer was responsible for return delivery:  (5) The consumer must bear the direct cost of returning goods under paragraph (2), unless— (a)the trader has agreed to bear those costs, or (b)the trader failed to provide the consumer with the information about the consumer bearing those costs, required by paragraph (m) of Schedule 2, in accordance with Part 2. Also, from getting quotations online I thought I could arrange delivery, for what was at the time a smallish box, for a much cheaper price (£7-8).   However, when I tried to disassemble the stool for return, it would not come apart. I contacted the manufacturer for further guidance, but the only how-to video they had available was not applicable to the model, and the manufacturer representative was unable to provide further instructions.   I have now been sent a 'built box' to return the stool without the need to disassembly. The issue is that the size of the box means that shipping charges are now £30 minimum i.e. more than the 'handling charge' the seller quoted.    Am I obliged to pay this return fee, or should this actually be something the seller should pay for? 🤔 I feel like I may have two potential arguments against it: Return delivery would not be nearly so expensive if the stool had come apart as the manufacturer said it should.  The Consumer Contract Regs state that a consumer is not responsible for return shipping if the trader has not provided information about the right to cancel and about return shipping on a durable medium.    What even counts as a durable medium? The dispatch note that came with the stool had no such information, while the order confirmation email simply had a link to their terms and conditions (which includes the statement about the restocking fee quoted above).   Does this clause mean the seller is still obliged to pay return shipping? Any advice would be greatly appreciated! I'm starting to stress a little about this because the 28-day cancellation-and-return period will be in two working days (although I realise that may be extended if it can be considered that the seller did not provide the required cancellation information).    Thank you in advance!  
    • so what you mean is that "each" parcel contained a single dinner plate. Thank you that clarifies things. As you been advised by my site team colleague, please make sure that you read around a substantial number of the Hermes stories on the sub- forum. You will get to understand the principles and also the similarities and approach from Hermes. Of course Hermes is being abusive of the system because they exploit a taxpayer funded under resourced justice system simply to put their customers into a kind of triage where only the most persistent finally get through to the end which is almost always – mediation – and then will manage to get their money or most of their money. Hermes are abusive of this system and of course they are actually going to spend more money than the value of your damaged items trying to smash you down. Because their attempts to crush you are effectively subsidised by the taxpayer, they don't really care. Make sure you understand what they will say about the prohibited items list because your plates are made of china or porcelain and will be prohibited items, according to Hermes. On the other hand, they were correctly declared and they were accepted for delivery. The values were correctly declared – and once again after you have completed your reading, you will understand the significance of this. Hermes will also try to say that you didn't have a contract with them and you should sue packlink – who conveniently – are based in Spain outside the jurisdiction. They were say that you are attacking the wrong people. Once again, when you have completed your reading you will understand the standard reply to this. Once again you will discover that this is Hermes being abusive of the system and misleading their customers as to what their rights are. Make a formal complaint to Hermes. Tell them that they are responsible. Don't give them a deadline, but wait a reasonable time – 10 to 14 days – after which you will send them a letter of claim if they haven't put their hands up by then or if you have had no response. By that time, you will have done enough reading to understand the way it goes but we will advise you and support you all the way.   Come back here when you have been knocked back by Hermes and we will take you through the next step  
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Arc Europe chasing virgin active debt - Threatening Court Action


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Jeepers !! They're not making this any easier !!

 

Email back asking them to give you a detailed breakdown of the demand for £318 as you're unable to reconcile their demands, based on the gyms' monthly fees.

 

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Ok, Just sent that off.

 

How is the £318 relevant anymore as they have already reduced it and have admitted to adding on admin fees. Can I not get this scratched off entirely now?

 

Kind Regards

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Hi Lolo,

 

I get what you're saying but I want to see how the £318 was made up, and how they justify it.

 

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Hello,

 

So they replied stating that they have never held an account for me for a balance of £318 and proceeded to say I have 14 days to provide evidence so they can investigate.

 

I have attached the initial letter I linked at the start of this thread and sent it to them. So we'll see what they say. I am pretty baffled at the way they are handling this, They are either playing dumb or are not on top of things at all...

 

Regards

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Great - keep us posted.

 

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Hi all,

 

So they replied and I am completely baffled at what my position is right now or what to do as what they are saying makes 0 sense to me.

 

I will attach the letter as well but they are basically saying their first letter was in relation to David Lloyds Membership whereas this is in relation to Virgin Active... I was under the impression it was within the same bracket...

 

Let me know what you guys think

 

http://imgur.com/a/cjh7D

 

Kind Regards

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Hi Lolo,

 

They refer to "proof you have supplied" being about a David Lloyd gym m/ship. Have you checked the ref. no. they use in each of the demands to see if they've confused your a/c with someone else's DL m/ship.

 

Maybe this explains the different amounts they've been demanding.

 

Or have you been a member of both gyms ?

 

Did you send them some form of "proof" ?

 

:-)

Edited by slick132

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Morning,

 

Well I've linked all the letters and from the very first which stated £318 had a different reference number to these recent ones demanding £114 but they was the ones who changed this themselves in addition to the amount they was asking for whilst they was replying to my initial letter regarding the £318... So to me it seems as if they messed up by demanding this amount and are trying to weasel out of it...

 

And yes the proof I sent them was the initial letter from ARC Europe themselves demanding £318 that I linked at the start of the thread

 

Kind Regards

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Hi Lolo,

 

Can you email back saying :-

 

I refer to your email of xxdate.

 

The copy letter I sent you dated xxxxxxxx was sent by you to me. It is YOU that are making demands for different amounts regarding different gyms.

 

My membership was with Virgin active and I require that you tell me what amount you are demanding, what gym it's about and how exactly the amount is made up.

 

If you fail to resolve this matter quickly, I will make formal complaints about your collection activity.

 

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Hi Lolo,

 

I don't think they're up to anything, apart from getting themselves confused between 2 accounts.

 

Once they confirm the amount they say you owe and how it's made up, we can decide exactly what you need to do, or not do.

 

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Hi,

 

Sthey replied saying that the proof I provided was in the name of Lois xxx and they can't discuss it with anyone else unless she has given authorization.

 

I am her brother and I'm handling this for her just on her CAG account and sorting this out via email for her as well with ARC.

 

I replied telling them this and asking how she can authorize me to continue to handle the matter.

 

To me it sounds like they are looking for any excuse to prolong this so we can just pay them and be done with it as they have never asked for authorization thus far whilst discussing all of these financial matters with me and It has all been from my email since the start...

 

What do you think ?

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If you don't provide ARC with her authority for you to act on her behalf, ARC will simply continue to evade answers and issue demands.

 

Either :-

 

1. Get YS to sign a letter of authority addressed to ARC allowing you to act on her behalf in connections and then get them to answer your latest email.

 

OR

 

2. Ignore them from now on.

 

Of the 2 options, #1 is the better and send by post with free Certificate of Posting. Once you've got them to confirm they're charging admin fees, you have better grounds to ignore and/or argue.

 

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Hey all,

 

Me again. So my sister rang them and gave me authorization to continue to handle the case for her.

 

I stated who I was once again and referred them to the original email I had sent demanding how the amounts they were requesting was made up and if I did not receive clarification that I would then make formal complaints. I will let you know what their reply is.

 

Hope you are all well nonetheless.

 

Regards

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Hi all,

the update is they are now proceeding to charge her not only for her Virgin Active Membership but also David Lloyds as she had a membership with them too which she also cancelled via DD and not the appropriate way.

 

 

They are requesting £452 for Virgin Active & £117 for David Lloyds.

 

 

Even I'm in a state of panic at the moment as I am unsure what to do at this point for her as they are continously threatening for court proceedings.

 

 

They once again didnt really answer the question of how the Virgin Active balance was made up only how the David Lloyd balance was and once again the price has changed from £114 to £117.

 

I will link all the letters they proceeded to email me once they realised my sister had granted me permission to handle the case for her. Any help at all would be much appreciated.

 

Letters -

 

Virgin Active: http://imgur.com/a/ax2MV

 

David Lloyd: Edited as personal data left showing

 

Thanks again

 

Kind Regards

Edited by slick132
slick :-)
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ignore they are powerless

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi Lolo,

 

If there is an earlier issue with a David Lloyd m/ship, you need to start a separate thread to deal with it separately. Otherwise the 2 issues will become confused.

 

Use this thread solely for the Virgin case.

 

Reply to Virgin saying unless, they tell you exactly how they've arrived at the total they're demanding for the Virgin account, you cannot pay them anything.

 

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Hi Lolo and thread re-opened.

 

Someone probably closed thread thinking you'd open the new one for the DL case and not need this one for the Virgin case.

 

Continue to post here for the Virgin case.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hey all

 

Just came back to say they gave the debt account back to David Lloyd and I messaged the same last message regarding reporting them to the FCA if they do not break down the virgin debt either

 

 

I haven't had a reply in weeks so I take it they backed off from that side too.

 

Thanks to everyone for the help, You do not understand how appreciative I am

 

All the best

 

Regards

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that's good news.

 

 

.dx

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Please help.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi Lolo,

 

Sorry to rain on your parade but I'd be surprised if that's the last you here of these isues.

 

The FCA really has nothing to do with gym m/ships so I doubt anyone would back off due to the risk of their involvement.

 

ARC may have backed off but the gym(s) may continue to harass.

 

As said before, if anything further needs to be discussed re the DL gym m/ship, start a new thread so it's not confused with this Virgin gym thread.

 

:-)

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