Outstanding Irish Mortgage debt issues

[JoJo1976]

Hi,

 

My wife and I got a mortgage on a property in Ireland back in 2006 just before the property market collapsed over there.

To make things worse the property ended up being in a dreadful area where we were regularly the victim of anti-social behaviour and crime.

 

 

Due to massive negative equity caused by the financial crash we could not sell and so put up with this nightmare situation until 2012 where we finally decided to admit defeat and move back home to the UK. Yes, we were naughty and did not tell the bank but by that time we were desperate.

 

We heard nothing from the bank until they caught up with us about a year ago saying that they had sold the property at auction and that we owed them over €200,000.

 

 

I don't know how they got our address but the letters have continued for a year and have now ramped up a level saying that they are going to involve Cabot Ltd.

 

 

I have learned from this forum that these people are debt collectors and would really appreciate some help on how best to proceed with this as our decision to take this mortgage out over 10 years ago is still blighting our lives.

 

 

We will never be able to pay this money back.

We're both over 40, have no financial assets and realistically, will never be able to own our own place so this feels like a real kick in the teeth.

 

Any advice or help would be much appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[AndyOrch]

Hi JoJo1976 and Welcome to CAG

 

If they sold it at auction and you still owe 200.00 E ..what was it a castle ?

 

Send a DSAR to the Mortgage provider.....get all the details on the sale and transactions.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[JoJo1976]

Hi Andy,

 

Thanks for getting back to me.

You'd think it was a castle but no, it was a 4 bed bungalow conversion in SW Dublin.

House prices were crazy back then and we got a 100% mortgage. Nightmare. We were very green, I'm afraid.

 

 

They sold it for somewhere in the region of €80,000 I believe but I'm reluctant to contact them directly as this confirms that they've been sending their correspondence to the correct address and could then affect our credit rating over here and make it impossible for us to rent houses etc.

 

 

All the correspondence is still coming from Ireland so I thought that as long as it doesn't originate from a UK court or debt collector, it's best not to respond.

 

 

What do you think about getting a 3rd party to contact them to try to negotiate some kind of voluntary arrangement?

I just don't want this to blight our lives any further than it already has done.

 

Cheers,

 

Jo.

[AndyOrch]

Cabot are English...which part of Ireland is this ..NI or ROI ?

[JoJo1976]

The mortgage was with BoI in the ROI.

[AndyOrch]

Nothing as yet received from Cabot ?

[JoJo1976]

Hi,

 

We've received nothing from Cabot yet.

The bank have just sent us a letter stating that, seeing as we have not paid them the money, they have

"..instructed Cabot Financial Limited to act on our behalf to collect the amount you still owe.

Unless a satisfactory arrangement is Ade to repay the debt, Cabot may commence legal action against you to recover this debt which may result in a judgement being registered against you."

 

Thanks.

[AndyOrch]

Okay...so do nothing until something is received from Cabot.....then request a DSAR as advised from BoI.

 

You need to be prepared if Cabot do try to escalate matters.... It will be pointless trying to hide.

 

Andy

[JoJo1976]

Thank Andy, this really helps a lot.

I knew we couldn't hide indefinitely but I just want to try to get the best outcome for us in relation to this so we can finally put it behind us once and for all.

 

 

With a debt of that size, how do you think Cabot are likely to proceed with attempting to collect it?

I'm assuming they'll have paid out a percentage in order to take the collection on in the first place?

 

Cheers,

 

Jo.

[AndyOrch]

Lets wait until Cabot make there move first and we can take it from there......all depends on whether CAbot have been assigned the debt or whether they are acting as collection for BoI.

[JoJo1976]

Thanks Again, Andy. This has been really helpful.

 

Jo.

[unclebulgaria67]

Thank Andy, this really helps a lot. I knew we couldn't hide indefinitely but I just want to try to get the best outcome for us in relation to this so we can finally put it behind us once and for all. With a debt of that size, how do you think Cabot are likely to proceed with attempting to collect it? I'm assuming they'll have paid out a percentage in order to take the collection on in the first place?

 

Cheers,

 

Jo.

 

What you have to remember is that they don't know your current financial situation. If they were made aware that you have no assets and it was pointless trying to go after enforcement of the debt, then i think there is a possibility it would be written off. It is going to cost them fees to enforce in court and they might get little back.

 

Suggest you get advice from an Irish debt advice service. I think they have Citizens Advice and other such bodies in Ireland. Because you have been living outside of Ireland more than 3 years, i think moves such as bankruptcy would have to be done in Ireland by attending a court there. Not sure after 3 years, you can go bankrupt in the UK to deal with Irish debts, unless there is a specific UK/Ireland agreement. The Irish Bank could not do this either, leaving only the option to go for a UK CCJ first and given your current situation, they would get minimal payments over a long period,

 

Mortgage debts are enforceable in courts for a long time (12 years) and therefore at some point, you might decide to bite the bullett if you have to and go bankrupt. You might avoid this, if you managed to persuade the Irish Bank that any court enforcement is a waste of time and they should write off the debt. Hence why you should get advice from advice services in Ireland.

[dx100uk]

I would suggest as the letter says cabot may start legal action that its been sold to them.

 

 

don't forget this is a shortfall so its 6yrs SB not 12.

 

 

IMHO if this were auch a cut n dried case of they could get this money..why have BoI sold it on..urm...

they could have crushed you in court themselves.

[JoJo1976]

Thanks again, Andy.

 

I'll look into this.

 

Jo.

[JoJo1976]

Hi,

 

Yes, that's why I'm in such confusion as to the best way to deal with this. It's such a stupid amount of money that we could never afford to pay. We couldn't even get a mortgage from a bank at the moment because we have no savings and that's because we put all our money into that house in Ireland. It's just such a messy situation and because of the fact that the debt is owed to a foreign bank it's tricky to work out what to do without unnecessarily exposing ourselves to potential bankruptcy proceedings etc.

[unclebulgaria67]

Hi,

 

Yes, that's why I'm in such confusion as to the best way to deal with this. It's such a stupid amount of money that we could never afford to pay. We couldn't even get a mortgage from a bank at the moment because we have no savings and that's because we put all our money into that house in Ireland. It's just such a messy situation and because of the fact that the debt is owed to a foreign bank it's tricky to work out what to do without unnecessarily exposing ourselves to potential bankruptcy proceedings etc.

 

From what i have read, it is common for Irish Banks to write off these debts after about 7 years. But if you have never been in contact with them, they don't know your position. For all they know, you have assets and good income to help pay towards the debt.

 

Which is why i suggested you speak to an Irish debt organisation. You might be able to evidence your situation abd negotiate either a full write off or only paying off a small amount of the debt over a few years.

 

The Irish limitations period for court enforcement appears to be 12 years and coule be same as England. English limitations period is 12 years for capital and 6 years for the interest.

[AndyOrch]

I would suggest as the letter says cabot may start legal action that its been sold to them.

 

 

don't forget this is a shortfall so its 6yrs SB not 12.

 

 

IMHO if this were auch a cut n dried case of they could get this money..why have BoI sold it on..urm...

they could have crushed you in court themselves.

 

Mortgage shortfalls have a longer limitation period of twelve years for the money you borrowed (the ‘capital’), while the interest charged on this has a limitation period of six years

 

" The bank have just sent us a letter stating that, seeing as we have not paid them the money, they have ..instructed Cabot Financial Limited to act on our behalf to collect the amount you still owe. "

 

That to me suggests its not been assigned.

 

Andy

[dx100uk]

yes p'haps they don't know what they are talking about..

 

 

Cabot may commence legal action against you to recover this debt which may result in a judgement being registered against you

 

 

only the owner of a debt can start legal action..

 

 

one line contradicts the next