PCN Out of Time

[Pizzas]

I have just received through the post a Notice of Enforcement (from Merton Enforcement Agents).

 

It relates to an (unspecified) traffic offence in July 2016

which although I cannot recall committing I probably did as I was in that area on the day in question,

probably caught on camera for something

(it would not have been a parking offence as I was only passing through).

 

I have no previous communication relating to this matter from the Borough of Merton: no tickets, no reminders, no recorded post.

 

The amount owed from the original offence (which I presume would have been around £80?) has now escalated to £278!

 

The Notice of Enforcement contains no details of how I can appeal, only the Enforcement Agents contact details.

 

I plan to call them to explain the circumstances.

 

Is this the right thing to do?

And if, as I suspect, I'm told

"sorry mate matters have gone too far you'll have to pay the full whack.

Where do I go from there?

 

Any advice very much appreciated. Thank you.

[dx100uk]

you should have received numerous previous letters

why did you not get them

and its taken a bailiff to find your correct address?

 

 

is your car registered at an old address?

[dx100uk]

can I just check this is def merton not marstons bailiffs?

 

 

if its mertons - the offence was in the Sutton area, as they are the councils in house bailiffs

[Pizzas]

Yes, I would have expected to have received numerous letters but I received none and I have no explanation for this. My car has always been registered at the same address.

[dx100uk]

I bet this is a box junction offence

[very well known on this forum]

 

 

contacted the Council first thing tomorrow,

tell them you've had no paperwork until the bailiff

ask them the date of the contravention and the address they have for you.

 

They should then advise you to contact the TEC to fill out a TE9 and TE7 statements

 

the Council should also contacte the bailiffs and put them on hold for a period of time

[Pizzas]

Thank you, dx100K. I have done just as you have proposed.

 

And you were right, it was a box junction offence!

[dx100uk]

i just remember them from before

 

 

https://cse.google.co.uk/cse?cx=partner-pub-0964707606882478:652l7hswbgv&ie=UTF-8&q=merton+box+junction&sa=Search+CAG#gsc.tab=0&gsc.q=merton%20box%20junction&gsc.page=1

 

 

so all is sorted them?

 

 

T7& & 9 are sorting the issue

and bailiffs are on hold?

[Pizzas]

Thanks for links dx100uk.

 

Yes, sorted at least in the short-term. Took the forms off to the County Court today. Encountered an army of Jobsworths but finally found someone who would sign them (they are now forms PE2 & PE3 by the way). Scanned them and emailed them back to the TEC.

 

Intrigued as to what will happen next...

[dx100uk]

not my best subject sadly

but I see several of the knowledgeable ones have seen the thread

and made no bad comments so must have got it right...

[Jamberson]

What will happen next is that the council will consider whether it is appropriate to allow your challenge, given that it is out of time. What explanation did you give?

 

 

What address were the council writing to?

[Pizzas]

The explanation I gave was that Merton had left off my apartment number from my address

(and by implication that someone else in my building may have picked the PCN up by accident).

 

 

To be honest I think this unlikely as I am on good terms with all other occupants of my residence.

 

 

So really I just don't know why I never received the PCN or any follow-up correspondence apart from the final Notice of Enforcement.

[Pizzas]

Oh dear!

 

 

I received a letter back from Northampton TEC saying my 'out of time' application (or whatever it's called) had been refused on account that I had not completed a P3 and only a P2 (or vice versa).

I was quite sure that I had.

 

 

To cut a long story short,

to be helpful and efficient I had scanned both P2 and P3 forms into a single document.

 

 

Whoever dealt with issue at the TEC either only spotted a single file attached to my email or opened the pdf attachment but couldn't be asked to scroll past the first page in order to view the second form.

 

 

They don't even have the facility to go back to my file and take another look

so I had to rescan the P2 and P3 into separate files and rescan them.

 

Moral of the story:

if sending forms back via email to a court:

mails each document as a separate file (forum members, you probably know this already...).

[Pizzas]

Last November I was succesful in my "Out of Time" application to Northampton TEC for a local authority PCN that I did not originally receive (only got the bailiff's letter!).

 

I recall that I was told over the 'phone by the TEC helpline that the local authority had 21 days to reissue the PCN.

 

I have just received the reissued PCN, obviously well outside this time limit.

 

Was I misinformed about the time limit? Or if not, Is the reissued PCN I have just received invalid?

[honeybee13]

Is this connected with your other thread, Pizzas?

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?474330-Returning-PCN-unopened-to-Local-Authority

 

HB

[Pizzas]

HB, it is "related" to the thread you cite but I thought my query above was suffciently distinct that it merited a separate thread.

 

Apologies, if I have breached forum etiquette.

 

P

[ericsbrother]

you wanted the clock resetting so they have started again. They can do this within 6 months of the original event so you will need to see if there is anything in law regarding other limits as this is determined by an appeal court decision rather than statute.

Appeal it to Sutton on these grounds and see what they say. They may well let it go to PATAS as they have nothing to lose.

[Pizzas]

The contravention date was 22/7/2016 the date of the reissued PCN was 23/1/2017.

 

By my reckoning that's 1 day in excess of 6 months!

 

However, I decided to pay the PCN. Do I now have grounds to recover my payment and if so how might I go about this?

 

Thanks.

[Michael Browne]

No, once you pay, it's game over.

[Pizzas]

Just to clarify...

 

So, not even possible to attempt any form of civil recovery (small claim?) of the (presumed) incorrectly levied charge?

 

What if, hypothetically, one accidentally paid a PCN in error, (say you didn't check the photo graphic evidence before paying but later you realise it wasn't your car) then it's tough luck?

[Michael Browne]

Just to clarify...

 

So, not even possible to attempt any form of civil recovery (small claim?) of the (presumed) incorrectly levied charge? No

 

What if, hypothetically, one accidentally paid a PCN in error, (say you didn't check the photo graphic evidence before paying but later you realise it wasn't your car) then it's tough luck?

Yes