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Talos77

Debt relief orders - for real?

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Dear All,

 

Thanks for accepting me on this lovely forum.

 

Here is my story: I owe about

9k to Amex,

1k to Barclays Partner Finance and

have an overdraft with Santander of about 1.4k.

 

All the debt has been incurred in the U.K. while I was resident, but I recently moved abroad in the EU (Greece) to live with my family.

 

I was planning of clearing the debt but will soon be out of employment.

 

I have been trying to get a dro woth Stpepchange and National Debtline, both of whom have been fobbing me off.

 

I realistically have no means of paying my debts off, although I would dearly like to do so.

 

The question is what would my debtors do to chase me for the debts?

 

Thanks and regards,

 

Talos

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are you ever going to return?

 

 

dx


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Thanks for your reply dx.

 

I will probably never return to the UK, as family are here and not keen on living in the U.K. As for me, I miss it dearly and think of England every day.

 

But I digress, the answer to your question is no.

 

Regards,

 

Talos

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Once you are outside of the UK, it is very unlikely your UK debts would follow you. While it is possible for UK creditors to enforce their debts in another EU country such as Greece, they probably would never bother.

 

This is simply because they would have to spend money on legal fees etc, that they might never get back. What tends to happen, is that they simply send letters to you requesting payment, apply a default to your UK credit record and then sell the debt on. You then get letters from a debt collection agency, which never goes any further.

 

Because your debts exceed £5k which is the UK Bankruptcy threshold, you need to avoid UK court actions in your absence. If you don't bother to advise your creditors that you live in Greece, they can send court papers to your last UK address. Once they obtain UK court judgements, it is much easier for these judgements to be transfered to Greece.

 

For this reason, you must advise UK creditors of your address in Greece. By doing this, it should stop UK creditors going to a UK court. They would instead really have to go to a court in Greece where you live, but this is not very likely.

 

I don't think you can enter into a debt relief arrangement, if you are leaving the UK. If you tried to deal with the UK debts from Greece, i think you would find it difficult. If you had any assets in Greece, then these would be part of any bankruptcy.

 

You are probably best to just inform UK creditors in writing that you now live in Greece and due to your new financial circumstance, you are unable to deal with the accounts. Get them to confirm in writing to your Greek address that they acknowkledge you live in Greece.


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then get on with your life.


:mad2::-x:jaw::sad:

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Thanks very much unclebulgaria.

 

I have informed everyone of my new address here in Greece. As for obtaining a DRO, the rules say that you can apply for one having lived in England in the previous 3 years. I am in contact with a charity which claims that we can do everything via email and I must supply a uk address and contact person to receive the actual application form, as the charity cannot post abroad due to limited funding, etc.

 

So Plan A is to obtain a dro. If that fails, I simply cannot pay the debts off and must suffer the consequences.

 

I read somewhere that my creditors can apply for a change against me even if I am not resident in the U.K. And then enforce it through a European Enforcement Order, anyone know about this?

 

Again thanks to all of you for your replies, to you too Old Cogger.

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theres is bugger and all they can do to you,

 

 

that's what OC's comment means...

 

 

don't go wasting your money


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Thank you very much dx100uk.

 

I informed the creditors via Tel of my new address but have not sent anything in writing. I also sent my new address and Tel no to Barclays Partner Finance via their online contact form.

 

assuming they sell the debt on to DCAs over here, how long can they chase me for it?

 

Also, could the creditors obtain a CCJ against me? Either at my last uk address or my new address?

 

Please excuse the probably silly questions, I am totally lost and trying to explore all scenarios.

 

Again thanks very much to all of you for your precious time and infix

 

Happy new year :-)

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Thanks very much unclebulgaria.

 

I have informed everyone of my new address here in Greece. As for obtaining a DRO, the rules say that you can apply for one having lived in England in the previous 3 years. I am in contact with a charity which claims that we can do everything via email and I must supply a uk address and contact person to receive the actual application form, as the charity cannot post abroad due to limited funding, etc.

 

So Plan A is to obtain a dro. If that fails, I simply cannot pay the debts off and must suffer the consequences.

 

I read somewhere that my creditors can apply for a change against me even if I am not resident in the U.K. And then enforce it through a European Enforcement Order, anyone know about this?

 

Again thanks to all of you for your replies, to you too Old Cogger.

 

Make sure you confirm in writing that you live in Greece and get written confirmation back from them.

 

You will find very few personal debts like these are actually pursued across border. They have enough trouble enforcing debts in the UK.

 

For consumer debts like these, they can only issue court claims in the UK if you are resident here or fail to advise of your new address, so they got a default judgement. If you live in Greece, they would need to get a Greek Solicitor to issue proceedings in a Greek court. This is pretty unlikely.

 

Don't know about a DRO when you are living outside of the UK. I would be very cautious about them using a UK contact address. This might not be purely about cost of postage. It is possible the DRO will be registered to the UK address. Think you need to ask more questions about this. What happens when you could not pay the agreed amounts ? Could the creditors then issue a court claim to the UK address provided ?

 

I don't know what you mean by suffer the consequences. If you have no UK assets and cannot pay, then i doubt much would happen. After a number of years, i should imagine creditors would write off debts as uncollectable.


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Thank you unclebulgaria.

 

By 'suffer the consequences' I mean how long can my creditors or the dca that may buy the debt from them pursue me for? 10 years? Forever?

 

Also, someone advised me making an offer of a token £1 monthly payment, but even that would make no sense as I would have to pay it out of an overdraft!

 

Finally, would the statute of limitations apply in my case, assuming I make no payments and live abroad?

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Thank you unclebulgaria.

 

By 'suffer the consequences' I mean how long can my creditors or the dca that may buy the debt from them pursue me for? 10 years? Forever?

 

Also, someone advised me making an offer of a token £1 monthly payment, but even that would make no sense as I would have to pay it out of an overdraft!

 

Finally, would the statute of limitations apply in my case, assuming I make no payments and live abroad?

 

6 years statute of limitations, so if no payment, no written acknowledgement and no court judgemement within 6 years, would then mean they could not be enforced by a court, if defended.

 

No point paying token amounts, as that just means the statute of limitations is affected, as the 6 years would run from last payment.

 

In these situations, unless you can clear debts within a few years, it is not worth doing. If you are abroad struggling to make small payments, i should imagine that the debts would still be increasing due to interest being added. It would then just extend the period, you are likely to be affected by these debts.


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Thanks for the advice unclebulgaria. Charities I have spoken with all keep saying I should not worry about a relatively small amount of unsecured debt but to me it seems like a lot and I hate not being able to pay it off.

 

I will take your advice and inform them in writing of my new address.

 

Thanks again.

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then forget about them


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Make sure you confirm in writing that you live in Greece and get written confirmation back from them.

 

You will find very few personal debts like these are actually pursued across border. They have enough trouble enforcing debts in the UK.

 

For consumer debts like these, they can only issue court claims in the UK if you are resident here or fail to advise of your new address, so they got a default judgement. If you live in Greece, they would need to get a Greek Solicitor to issue proceedings in a Greek court. This is pretty unlikely.

 

Don't know about a DRO when you are living outside of the UK. I would be very cautious about them using a UK contact address. This might not be purely about cost of postage. It is possible the DRO will be registered to the UK address. Think you need to ask more questions about this. What happens when you could not pay the agreed amounts ? Could the creditors then issue a court claim to the UK address provided ?

 

I don't know what you mean by suffer the consequences. If you have no UK assets and cannot pay, then i doubt much would happen. After a number of years, i should imagine creditors would write off debts as uncollectable.

 

Can I ask why they would be unlikely to chase the debt through a European Enforcement Order? I would assume that they simply instruct local counsel to make a claim through local courts. And then slap legal fees on top of the debt?

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doesn't work like that.

 

 

its only civil debt.

 

 

they wont bother too costly.


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Can I ask why they would be unlikely to chase the debt through a European Enforcement Order? I would assume that they simply instruct local counsel to make a claim through local courts. And then slap legal fees on top of the debt?

 

It is quite surprising that creditors don't take court actions outside of jurisdiction. They set up a system within the EU, as you have mentioned, but they don't seem to use it. in France i think it more common for foreign debts to be enforced there. I think they have a more efficient local system in France to enforce debts.

 

The EEO's are for uncontested debts, where it is very straightforward. But i have a feeling that UK creditors are unwilling to spend money on foreign legal fees or won't sign up to debt collection agreements with collection companies in other countries, where they share any collected amounts. There is also the issue of UK law/consumer credit rules being considered by a foreign court, as well as local court rules. It is probably not worth the hassle, as they have enough UK resident debtors to chase.


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