Millennium parking services/Gladstones claim form - PCN Metropole Chambers, Swansea

[ericsbrother]

signage has nothing to do with keeper liability. Confuse the 2 and you just look stupid.

[Wi3347]

keeper vs driver, im with you now.

 

"Dear Sir / Madam,

I write regarding the PCN issued to vehicle with index ”XXXXXXXXX” on 15/12/2015

I challenge this PCN as registered keeper of the vehicle.

 

Your “Notice to keeper” and the signs at the location fail to comply with the protection of freedoms act 2012 (POFA) so there is no keeper liability.

I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and photographed your signs at the location. To summarise, I am only the registered keeper of the vehicle. Due to your noncompliance with POFA 2012 you have failed to create keeper liability. I have no liability in this matter and do not wish to be contacted by you again.

 

Yours faithfully,"

thats what i will go with for now

[ericsbrother]

no, start reading what people write to help you.

 

Just the one line about them failing to adhere to the protocols of the POFA. Nothing else

 

Your fixation about wanting to talk about the signs will be your undoing

[Wi3347]

ok ok just asking. I have written a simple letter stating i am only the registered keeper and they have failed to create keeper liability due to their non poffa complient NTK and signs.

[ericsbrother]

NO , FOR GODS SAKE WHAT PART OF DO NOT MENTION THE SIGNS DONT YOU UNDERSTAND.

 

It has been written down several times but here it is again in one line and a bit so you may copy it and add nothing to it and take nothing away.

 

"AS the Notice to keeper was not compliant with the protocols of the POFA 2012 there is no keeper liability in this matter.

Any claim against the keeper will result in a counterclaim for damages for breach of the DPA as per the decision of VCS v Philip"

 

send that to the dodgy solicitors so they can charge the parking co to read it to them

 

and it is a letter, not an effing email or you will invite them to just harass you for free.

[Wi3347]

I sent them a short letter in the post simply stating that their was no keeper liability as the NTK was no POFA compliant.

 

Ive now had a letter from DRP debt collection.

 

saying the same stuff.

 

My plan is to write them a letter in the post stating the same.

 

Their client has failed to create keeper liability by not complying to the protocols of POFA.

[ericsbrother]

No, never bother sending anything to a dca,

they are only paid to send you letters to scare you into paying,

they have no authority or right to do anything else.

Ignore them.

 

 

They have been told to write to you as the parking co know they have been caught out so they hope that you get confused between a dca and a bailiff.

[Wi3347]

Have now received a letter from zenith collections as the other DCA didn't have any joy. Usual stuff, pay now or I client will take legal action etc etc. I will bin it. Will update further if I receive a claim form

[dx100uk]

doesn't say will anything...

 

 

dx

[Wi3347]

Oh this one does!

They are very confident of predicting their clients actions.

Of maybe they have a Crystal ball

[ericsbrother]

never bin them,

you can use it as evidence against them for harassment if you are minded to (after you beat their claim).

 

 

The law on passing data over to third parties is changing very soon and this should become a thing of the past.

The reality is Zenith can say what they want but they have no control or influence over anything.

 

Have now received a letter from zenith collections as the other DCA didn't have any joy. Usual stuff, pay now or I client will take legal action etc etc. I will bin it. Will update further if I receive a claim form

[DragonFly1967]

Not forgetting that Zenith Recovery Services are DRP in a party frock, same directors

[Wi3347]

letter from Gladstones now,

who appear to be the most hopeless of all the legal companies involved in parking matters.

 

Not sure if i should send them a letter saying their client has failed to create keeper liability due to non compliance with POFA.

 

If they wish to communicate further it should be through the courts and any further correspondence from them will be considered harassment.

 

might be worth a go to see if they pack it in early as they have had a right kickin in court lately and might think better of it if i appear to know what im talking about,

 

thoughts?

[ericsbrother]

I wouildnt be polite.

 

I would be telling the that they know very well they are incompetent and that has been publicly acknowledged by a judge in another of their hopeless claims and you will be looking forward to a second day out at their expense and will letting their client know this separately

 

 

they are aware that they have been used by John and Will of the IPC/Gladstones as a stooge to make them money at their clients expense as Gladdys are too lazy and greedy to prosecute things properly.

 

 

Any debt to their client is vehemently denied for reasons that have been made clear before and so any claim will be vigourously defended and a full costs recovery order sought

[Wi3347]

will be sending this to them

 

Gladstones solicitors

The terrace, High Legh park golf club

Warrington road

Cheshire

WA16 6AA

 

Your reference: xxxxx

To whom it may concern,

 

In response to your letter with the above reference dated 11 July 2017.

 

Any debt to you client is vehemently denied for reasons that have been made clear before to them and so any claim will be vigorously defended and a full costs recovery order sought

 

In short your client has failed to adhere to the protocols of the protection of freedoms act 2014 and as a result failed to create any keeper liability in relation to this matter. i.e I have NO LIABILITY in this matter.

 

I refer you to the case of PPM v Keeper. C7GF75EN. Wakefield 20/07/2017 that I’m sure you are fully aware of.

 

It is well documented and common knowledge in the courts that you as consistently loosing these cases at court due to countless failings on your behalf.

 

Do not contact me again other than via official court proceedings or it will be considered harassment.

 

pofa 2012* corrected that

[Wi3347]

Claim form received from gladstones!

Dated 9th of August.

 

I think the defence will be their failings to adhere to pofa have meant there is no keeper liability?

[dx100uk]

please complete this:

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?465231-Received-a-Court-Claim-From-A-Private-parking-Speculative-invoice-How-To-Deal-With-It-HERE***Updated-Aug-2016***

[Wi3347]

Name of the Claimant ? Millennium door and event security ltd.

claimants Solicitors: Gladstones solicitors Ltd

 

Date of issue – 09 Aug 2017 .

What is the claim for –

1. "The driver of the vehicle registration XXXXXXX (the vehicle) incurred the parking charge(s) on 15/11/2016 for breaching the terms of parking on land at Metropole Chambers Swansea SA13RT.

2.The defendant was driving the vehicle and/or is the keeper of the vehicle

3.and the claimant claims £160 for parking charges / damages and indemnity costs if applicable,

together with interest of £8.35 pursuant to s69 of the country courts act 1984 at 8% pa,

continuing to judgement at £0.04 per day."

 

What is the value of the claim? total of £243.35

 

Has the claim been issued by the Private parking Company or was the PCN assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim ? issue by private parking company

 

Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? I received a letter before claim from Gladstones, details above

[dx100uk]

pop up on the MCOL website detailed on the claimform.

.

register as an individual

note the long gateway number given

then log in

.

select respond to a claim and select the AOS box.

.

then using the details required from the claimform

.

defend all

leave jurisdiction unticked.

click thru to the end

confirm and exit MCOL.

.

get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors

.

don't sign anything

.

 

to the solicitors

[Your address]

.

[Their address [solicitors]

.

[Date]

.

Dear Sir or Madam,

.

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

.

CPR 31.14 Request

.

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

.

1. the contract between [parking company name] and the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with the public and make claims in their own name,.

.

2.proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 2007

.

3.copies of the notice to driver, notice to keeper and any other correspondence from [insert Claimant Name] & [insert Solicitors Name} to the defendant that they intend to rely upon in court.

.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience..

.

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy.

.

Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

.

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

.

If you are unable to comply with this request within 14 days and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm in your response.

.

You are reminded that as this case is yet to be allocated to a track, CPR31:14 does apply, a refusal to comply because you 'think' at this stage you dont have too will be used against you in any filed defence.

.

Yours faithfully

.

TYPE YOUR NAME DO NOT SIGN IT

[lookinforinfo]

Interesting.

 

These dummies are taking you to Court without knowing who the driver is.

That's the trouble when you are a member of IPC-they don't understand POFA themselves so they mislead their members.

 

The IPC also don't understand about what charges you can add when taking motorists to Court.

their members fall into the same trap.

 

Just goes to show how dumb the DVLA is that they also have no idea what is wrong with the IPC Code of Conduct.

That IPC don't know what is wrong with their Code of Conduct is no surprise.

One wonders what the SRA are for-certainly they don't appear to worry about Gladstones bringing their reputation into disrepute.

[Wi3347]

MCOL all done.

 

In terms of defence, I did a very basic one for a BW claim and that is going through to a hearing.

 

Im not sure if putting in a defence with more meat on the bones will deter them from continuing the claim through to court?

 

especially with the bad results Gladdys have had lately I think if I show them I know what im talking about they may think better of it.

 

Defence is going to have to be around the failings to adhere to POFA with the NTK.

Their signs are very small, the ticket was issue in darkness and there is no lighting at the location,

 

also no markings or parking spaces painted on the floor (which i have photographed) also on their signs and NTK they claim to be a member of the BPA which they arent.

[ericsbrother]

compliance with the exact letter of the law to create a keeper liability is something most judges wont know off by heart

you will need to push it very hard when it comes to a hearing and that means copies of the act as part of your evidence bundle when it comes to it.

 

Also copies of any other reported case where it was an factor so look them up on the parking pranksters blog, other motoring forums ect and print them off.

 

A screen dump is OK for evidence as long as the original source is clear so parkingbandit v motorist (Birmingham CC Oct 2015) claim ref 11x4444 is the kind ofthing needed along with the case summary.

 

Just quoting ericsbrother (2017) without supporting evidence wont be enough has it wont be compelling or convincing enough.

[Wi3347]

Everything I will put in as evidence will have case numbers and dates etc.

 

I have one which may prove pivotal.

Excell vs Ian lamoureux C3DP56Q.

 

The judge in there clearly states a paragraph of the pofa and says it is for the claimant to show they have complied with the pofa to make the RK liable and it has failed to do so by not giving the correct notice period for the RK to respond. Same in this case. They say 21 days on the NTK when it's 28. So that might be the main point to prove on the day.

 

In terms of defence? Any ideas? I do think the more I put it may deter them

 

Also in paragraph 9(2)(b) of the POfa of states the NTK must inform the keeper that the driver is required to pay charges for a period of parking.

 

Well in this case it wasn't possible to pay for parking. No metre or means to pay for parking. So does that apply? As they cannot recover a penalty under the small claims process how can they try to claim For an unpaid charge if it was not possible for the drive to pay the charge. Shouldn't that be a matter of trespass? Just thoughts here please correct if wrong

[dx100uk]

all of that will be for your WITNESS STATEMENT

if the case gets that far

 

your DEFENCE

is simply the 2 lines one.

 

never ever introduce any 'argument' into a defence that the POC does not make refs too.

[ericsbrother]

Is the charge a parking charge or a contracual obligation or a charge for a breach of contract?

 

If you are told that it costs £90 to park for 2 hours then there has to be a way of paying that fee.

 

If parking is free but under certain contractual considerations that you breach then the comany invoices you for the monies due as a result of that breach.

 

That is why you need to pick the wording of their signage apart to determine whether there was an offer of a contract,

 

that the parking co has created a condition that allows for offer and consideration,

 

whether there could be a breach of contract that allows them to make a claim or

 

whether it is a contractual condition that you pay them if you do something or fail to do something.

 

After that it is still possible that the amount demanded isnt really a contractual matter but a charge imposed in a manner that is designed to deter you from parking and thus a penalty and nothing more.

 

An example would be no parking £50 to pay if you do. There is no serious attempt to offer a contract to park in that instance so the amount would be a penalty and thus unlawful.

 

The sign would also be one of prohibition so cant be said to be a contract anyway but it is always best to argue both scenarios, you only have to be right once, they have to be right twice

 

never limit your argument to one point if you have several,

use everything you can think of,

poor lighting,

lack of planning consent for signs etc

absolutely anything that could possibly be considered

 

and support it with the relevant legislation

, previous cases

copy of POFA etc.

 

You may not need it all or even any of it but if you haven't got it you are stuck