Ford Evans Halshaw dealership refusing to cover vehicle with warranty **WON 100% covered**

[Mod Kieren]

Thank you very much, I will read up on the details later this evening whilst awaiting any potential response from Evans Halshaw.

 

I will update this thread with any more information as it comes up, or if I have any questions I cannot find answers to.

[Mod Kieren]

I have received an acknowledgement email from the customer care team at Evans Halshaw, to state: "We have escalated this to the appropriate level for investigation, we do adhere to a three working day policy and somebody will contact you within this time scale. " The details have been raised with the Bedford dealership too.

[dx100uk]

i don't think there is any harm in involving the finance company too here

 

 

its their car, they are responsible too

and

might well bring pressure to bear as well.

 

 

I'm a bit sceptical about an ancillary belt harming a cambelt.

I wonder if this was the other way around

the cam went

that took out the ans belt

 

 

dx

[Mod Kieren]

Yes, I am quite skeptical too.

 

 

Hopefully by the end of the day I will have a full list of what damage has been caused and perhaps a better judgement on that front can be made.

 

At what stage would you involve the financial company?

 

 

I don't personally see any harm in contacting them now to at least inform them of the situation should I want them to help out later.

[BankFodder]

I have received an acknowledgement email from the customer care team at Evans Halshaw, to state: "We have escalated this to the appropriate level for investigation, we do adhere to a three working day policy and somebody will contact you within this time scale. " The details have been raised with the Bedford dealership too.

 

Good, but don't let them stall you. I expect they will come back to you and try to have a discussion or say that they are getting extra information blah blah. You are effectively giving them three working weeks, assuming that you issue the LBA. This is more than enough where there is a bit of goodwill to sorted out. Frankly they could sorted out within a couple of days. They should be well aware of your consumer rights.

 

Don't allow this to get into a protracted discussion. You have said that you want to reply by Monday. If you don't get the reply that you want then issue the claim – as long as you are confident about that. Once they have an LBA, it will concentrate their minds even more. If they then try to delay things, issue the claim. Once you issue the claim papers you will find an extraordinary change in attitude.

[BankFodder]

Yes, if DX thinks it's worth contacting the finance company, then do it straightaway. It will help to copy the garage into any correspondence with the finance company so that the garage knows that it's getting out of hand. So that they are perceived by paper and they realise that this is becoming a multi-party matter which hopefully, they will want to take steps to stop.

[Mod Kieren]

Thanks for all the assistance. It is much appreciated.

 

I will contact the finance company this evening to let them know what's happening, and will CC them in on any email conversations occurring (the garage dealing with the repairs also).

[Surfer01]

A warranty does not involve the consumer at all and to a consumer it is a meaningless piece of paper.

 

 

A warranty is a contract between the manufacturer and the supplier stating that the manufacturer will pay for parts and repairs for anything under warranty.

 

 

The consumer uses the Consumer Rights Act 2015 to get a dealership to rectify an issue.

 

Although the following is from Sale of Goods Act it has been incorporated into the new CRA;

 

1 Wherever goods are bought they must "conform to contract". This means they must be as described, fit for purpose and of satisfactory quality (i.e. not inherently faulty at the time of sale).

 

2 Goods are of satisfactory quality if they reach the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking into account the price and any description. Aspects of quality include fitness for purpose, freedom from minor defects, appearance and finish, durability and safety.

 

3 It is the seller, not the manufacturer, who is responsible if goods do not conform to contract.

 

4 If goods do not conform to contract at the time of sale, purchasers can request their money back "within a reasonable time". (This is not defined and will depend on circumstances)

 

5 For up to six years after purchase (five years from discovery in Scotland) purchasers can demand damages (which a court would equate to the cost of a repair or replacement).

[dx100uk]

don't forget

if you get any phone calls you record them all

 

 

and I wouldn't be leaving phoning Barclay finance till this evening

I doubt they'll man phone lines much passed 4pm

[Mod Kieren]

don't forget

if you get any phone calls you record them all

 

 

and I wouldn't be leaving phoning Barclay finance till this evening

I doubt they'll man phone lines much passed 4pm

 

I have already checked and their phone lines are open til 6pm, giving me time after work to be able to make the call.

[BankFodder]

@evanshalshawuk

[Hammy1962]

Whoa there, no need for CRA, Court, SOGA LBA's, Vigilante depositions, Letters to the Finance Co. or anything like that, massive over-reaction.

 

Surfer1, sorry but that is absolute cobblers.....................................

 

The warranty on a new vehicle is transferable, it matters not whether you are the first owner or owner number 56. As long as the mileage is less than 60K and the vehicle less than three years old the warranty is fine.

 

If the belt in question is not due for change until 100K then it, and any consequential damage, is covered by the Ford manufacturers warranty. Both Dealers should know this.

 

To be fully sure (I am already!) I would need you to PM me your full 17 digit VIN Vehicle Identification Number. Other folks on here might have a baby at this suggestion as they think its possible for me to steal your identity and thus whole life with it, but in reality all I want are the vehicle details, engine code etc.

 

I can then tell you which belt failed, its service interval, the other belt it damaged when it failed and what to do next.

 

It's up to you.

 

But the over-riding point is it will be covered you just have to know what to say, you don't need all that palaver above.

 

H

[dx100uk]

hey great work hammy

 

 

MK you wont be able to send another user a PM yet

but if you PM me or GF or any member of the siteteam

we will fwd the info to hammy

 

 

dx

[GrumpyToSayTheLeast]

I think there may be a problem here.

An auxiliary belt is a wear and tear item that the user should check regularly to see if there is any deterioration.

 

A TIMING BELT OR CHAIN is not a wear and tear item and will be guaranteed for 100,000 miles or x amount if years.

 

You say it was the auxiliary belt that failed.

I cant see a claim.

It like the brake pads wearing to nothing and you crashing the car because you had no brakes.

It was your responsibility to check the brakes for wear.

You wouldn't be able to claim for crash damages or anything if the sort..

 

If its a timing belt failure, you will be fine and they will be liable.

IF, and this is a big IF...full dealer servicing has been maintained and the belt was change at the required mileage.

A quick look online and it shows fiesta cam belt change should be 40k miles and a cam CHAIN at 100,000 miles.

 

Can you confirm if it was the auxiliary belt or the timing/cam belt that failed and if it is the cam, what is the exact replacement schedule for your make and model of car.

And do you have full dealer history stamped in the book for servicing?

[Hammy1962]

Which is why I or we need the VIN

 

H

[dx100uk]

yep my thoughts gentleman re post 28.

 

I think the chain went and that's what broke the ans belt

had that happen to my neighbour.

 

almost exactly the same scenario

Green Flag Recovered it and ofcourse obv showed at roadside Ans belt was snapped

but the cause was the chain going.

 

fords admitted a failure and replaced the engine .

it had only done 37k from new one owner

always serviced at the dealership he got it from new some 2.5yrs earlier.

[BankFodder]

Hammy1962 that would be useful. However, I don't think that people are getting over exerted about nothing. Although the OP has made an error by not contacting the seller directly, we are already finding an attitude of denial. I think that we are taking very prudent measures here and it is by far the best to be prepared. Particularly, the OP now doesn't have a vehicle. It has been out of commission for over two weeks and the Ford dealership that is looking at it now is already refusing any kind of liability based on the warranty – as are Ford.

 

Now the OP has contacted the seller and already we're getting a delaying tactic – "get back to you in three days". There is no reason for this at all. Before we know it, the OP would have been delayed until Christmas and then that will take us into the New Year. Will be looking at getting on for two months of denial and no vehicle.

 

As it happens, the tweet which was generated by this thread was picked up and retweeted by another Twitter account https://twitter.com/BadEvansHalshaw @BadEvansHalshaw

 

Although I realise that things can get out of proportion on social media, I'm concerned to see that it may be that the retailer here has some form for the kind of attitude that the OP is already experiencing. They have over 600 followers and there seems generally to be quite a lot of complaints – mostly about customer service.

 

Nothing is to be lost by taking proper precautions and being fully prepared for the worst. Everything is to be lost if one doesn't.

 

In response to GrumpyToSayTheLeast I have to say that he/she has not understood the meaning of a wear and tear item. A wear and tear item does not mean that the item doesn't need to conform to certain standards of quality and live up to certain reasonable consumer expectations in terms of performance and longevity. As you will see from the wear and tear pop-up, this has become a term which is thrown around by retailers to try and escape liability for certain items which might certainly be less durable than other parts of, say, a vehicle – but despite this, they are still subject to the quality requirements of the Consumer Rights Act.

More importantly, when you buy a car – whether it is new or used, you don't buy as a bag of bits. You don't buy as an assembly item. You buy as a single item – a going concern. You pay a single price for it all and the car is protected by consumer law as a whole item. If you pay over £5000 for a motorcar then there is a reasonable expectation that the entire vehicle will keep on going for at least a certain number of years as long as it is looked after in a responsible way. 10,000 miles is less than one years average use. Furthermore, I understand that the car was subject to a full service before it was sold. Grumpy seems to say that it is the responsibility of an owner to take care of the vehicle. That's right. However, it is also the duty of a retailer to make sure that the vehicle that he sells is of satisfactory quality. If the belt wasn't changed – whichever belt it was – then that must have been because the retailer was satisfied that it would last for a certain number of years or miles.

 

I don't imagine that any responsible retailer, acting responsibly, would sell a car with a belt which he knew wouldn't even last a year.

I don't imagine that any dealer would manage to sell a vehicle on the basis that £5000 would buy a car which will last for 10,000 miles and will then need another £1000 or more to repair it. Nobody would buy it.

 

I fully expect a County Court judge to agree with me on both points.

 

The OP has now contacted the retailer. It is up to the OP as to the attitude they want to take, bearing in mind the general reputation of the used car trade, bearing in mind the attitude of the other authorised dealer so far and the attitude of Ford, bearing in mind the apparent problems that others appear to have had the same retailer, I think that the precautions that we are suggesting here are reasonable. I hope the OP won't have to take any direct action – it's all such a nuisance, but if he does then with our help he will be fully prepared and will stand the best chance of success – which I estimate as being better than 90%

[Mod Kieren]

I feel a lot more confident that I am taking the approach originally suggested by BankFodder and dx100uk. To have that as a backup at least is reassuring, of course - I don't want to have to go down that road, and I damn well want my vehicle back ASAP (Hence if repairs are completed, I will paying and looking for reimbursement from Evans Halshaw).

 

Now of course, if somehow I can have the garage claim on the warranty successfully, all of this headache goes away - so I'll listen to any suggestion you think may be convincing on this front. As long as this does not weaken the credibility in the claim that Evans Halshaw are responsible.

 

I will get back with my VIN and pm it over shortly.

[BankFodder]

Trying to negotiate and to persuade them to speak to Ford about implementing the warranty, will not hurt your case at all. However, it might become a way that everybody can start delaying a solution for you. You need to guard against this. Decide on your targets for action and then stick to them unwaveringly. I have suggested a timescale for you. Till the end of the week and then next Monday 14 days LBA.

 

It's up to you if you want to adopt this or not, but effectively if they can't make a decision and sort it all out by the end of the 14 days then you can basically resign yourself to the fact that they're not going to do anything. There is no point in waiting until that moment to send them a further LBA 14 days. You are best off having everything primed and ready to go on about 28 December.

 

These people only take things seriously if the customers they are dealing with demonstrate that they are being very serious.

[Mod Kieren]

Worst news right now:

 

Damage is to the extent of the engine needing replacing. Total cost for repairs and work done so far, £4,900. Which means we now have a figure we can work with.

I requested details on how they identified that the aux belt was the cause of the damage, and they stated they found bits of it chewed up in the cam shaft. I stated that this part should last 100,000 miles, and they said yes, you're right but unfortunately Ford do not cover that under the warranty outside the first year. That avenue looks firmly closed with the current repair garage.

 

I informed them that I had opened up with Evans Halshaw in writing, and the person I was speaking to said he was about to recommend going there himself. I told him I'd advised Evans Halshaw to get in contact with Marshall Ford, so to perhaps expect contact and a discussion there and that perhaps Evans Halshaw would want to collect the vehicle and make repairs themselves.

 

I have requested in writing via email, the extent of the damage caused - and the total costings from Marshall so that I can detail this out to Evans Halshaw either before or when they get back to me. He said he would get that sent over some time today.

 

The call was recorded.

 

I have my VIN and I will pm you that now dx just in case this leads anywhere.

 

I will be sticking to the schedule outlined.

[BankFodder]

Good. Sounds as if you are taking control of it. The way the costs arising at the moment, it seems to me that you may be faced with a decision as to whether you want to proceed with the repairs or to have a replacement vehicle.

 

One thing I should say is that if they are essentially proposing an engine replacement, you may not be entitled to the full value of this. Don't forget, that you bought a car with 40,000 miles on the clock and you put another 10,000 miles on it. This means that you have had the benefit of 50,000 miles – either because you have driven it all because you have had a reduction from the price of a brand-new car.

 

You may need to estimate 50,000 miles as a percentage of the expected life of the vehicle and then deduct that percentage from the final settlement.

 

This means that if, for instance, the engine was expected to last 150,000 miles, then you have used up 1/3 of that and so you would have to deduct one third – or in other words contribute one third – to the cost of the replacement.

 

I think that this is something you should generally keep under your hat because you should try to negotiate for as complete a settlement as possible. However, this calculation is a reasonable fallback position and should represent the least settlement that you would offer without court action.

[Mod Kieren]

Yes, that makes sense as a minimum.

 

I'm almost certainly looking at going without my car for potentially awhile now, unless Evans Halshaw choose to act and take the repairs into their hands now.

I cannot afford to pay the £4900 myself to have the work done, and then look for a reimbursement.

 

I should also note, myself and my colleagues have 10s of thousands of twitter followers, and have the potential to cause a stink towards Evans Halshaw if that would be helpful. I have 13.5k myself, and others in my team have well over 20 and 30 thousand.

[Mod Kieren]

I should also note, myself and my colleagues have 10s of thousands of twitter followers, and have the potential to cause a stink towards Evans Halshaw if that would be helpful. I have 13.5k myself, and others in my team have well over 20 and 30 thousand.

 

I cannot acutally do anything with that, since my company would enforce policy that I cannot defame any organisation under a twitter account representing the company.

[Mod Kieren]

I have now got in writing from the repair garage, Marshall Ford, a detailing of work done so far and costings included.

 

"On inspection of vehicle [car reg] found auxillary belt broken up and entered cambelt cover.

Stripped out cambelt cover to remove debris and check timing, engine timing out, retimed engine with new cambelt and turned engine over by hand.

Engine turned over very easily. Carried out engine compression test, no compression on cylinders 1,2,3, & 4.

Removed cylinderhead found valves had contacted with pistons causing cylinderhead damage,damage to all 4 pistons and cylinder No3 bore scored.

Requires complete engine replacement to rectify concern

Cost of labour for inspection. retime engine fit cambelt, carry out compression test, remove cylinder head & replace engine 16.4 hours labour = £1623.60 +vat

Parts =£2417.58+vat

Total cost of repair =£4849.42 inc vat

Some sundries items may be requierd these would be extra "

[BankFodder]

I suggest that you scan a copy of this quotation into PDF format and send it to the seller immediately. Point out to them that you want an immediate response to this and that you consider that their delay is merely prevarication.

 

Am I right that you are a mathematician?