Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • I'm afraid that standing on principles almost always involves a bit of risk. I hadn't noticed the case that you have referred to – and our site team member @Andyorch has already commented on it that there is a lottery in so far as judges are concerned. I haven't seen the claim form and I don't know precisely how it was argued in court. I feel very strongly that the decision is wrong because it effectively allows contractual terms to overcome statutory rights – and this has to be in error. Whatever the case, it is most likely that Hermes will simply put their hands up and pay you out and if you had claimed 5 pounds more they would have done the same. Even if they had gone to court, your chances of winning on a claim for the £25 would be better than 95% and the worst you might have expected would have been for the court to refuse to award you the extra 4 pounds and simply to give you the £25. I think that Hermes and the other courier companies rely on the fact that their customers don't have sufficient confidence to refuse to pay for the extra insurance. Clearly this is something which needs to be tested at a reasonably within the court structure but of course this is most unlikely to happen given the value of claims. I was sorry to see that your original reason for not claiming the full value was that   I asked you to post up your claim form. I think it will be helpful if you did that.
    • I've inserted their poc re:your.. 1 ..they did send 2 paploc's  3. neither the agreement nor default is mentioned in their 2.        
    • Hi Guys, i read a fair few threads and saw a lot of similar templates being used. i liked this one below and although i could elaborate on certain things (they ignored my CCA and sent 2 PAPs etc etc) , am i right in that at this stage keep it short? If thats the case i cant see what i need to add/change about this one   1)   the defendant entered into a consumer credit act 1974 regulated agreements vanquis under account reference xxxxxxx 2)   The defendant failed to maintain the required payment, arrears began to accrue 3)   The agreement was later assigned to the claimant on 29 September 2017 and notice given to the defendant 4)   Despite repeated requests for payment, the sum of 2247.91 remains due outstanding And the claimant claims a)The said sum of £2247.91 b)The interest pursuant to S 69 county courts act 1984 at the rate of 8% per annum from the date of issue, accruing at a daily rate of £xxxx, but limited to one year,  being £xxxx c)Costs   Defence:   The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim vague and are generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.   1. The Claimant has not complied with paragraph 3 of the PAPDC ( Pre Action Protocol) Failed to serve a letter of claim pre claim pursuant to PAPDC changes of the 1st October 2017.It is respectfully requested that the court take this into consideration pursuant to 7.1 PAPDC.   2. The Claimant claims £2247.91 is owed under a regulated consumer credit account under reference xxxxxxx. I do not recall the precise details or agreement and have sought verification from the claimant and the claimants solicitor by way of a CPR 31.14 and section 78 request who are yet to fully comply.   3. Paragraph 2 is denied. I am unable to recall the precise details of the alleged agreement or any default notice served in breach of any defaulted payments. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied.The Defendant contends that no notice of assignment pursuant to s.136 of the Law of Property Act & s.82 A of the CCA1974 has ever been served by the Claimant as alleged or at all.   5. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant, the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of assignment/balance/breach requested by CPR 31. 14, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to:   (a) show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement; and (b) show and evidence any cause of action and service of a Default Notice or termination notice; and © show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and (d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim;   6. After receiving this claim I requested by way of a CPR 31.14 request and a section 78 request for copies of any documents referred to within the Claimants' particulars to establish what the claim is for. To date they have failed to comply to my CPR 31.14 request and also my section 78 request and remain in default with regards to this request.   7. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.   8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974.   9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.  
    • i understand. Just be aware I am prepared to take some risks 😉
    • Thanks Tnook,   Bear with us while we discuss this behind the scenes - we want you to win just as much as you do but we want to find the right balance between maximising your claim without risking too much in court fees, and in possible court costs awarded to the defendant bank.
  • Our picks

xxxxhelpxxxx

1st Credit claiming - old HSBC OD

style="text-align:center;"> Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 444 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

If you are trying to post information which is relevant to the story in this thread then please flag it up to the site team and they will allow you to post.

Thank you

Recommended Posts

And the balance on that card is still outstanding?

Sorry for all the q's

It just that we often see HSBC do things like dump outstanding card debt into an OF balance or make you take out a managed loan to pay things off and then dump that in the OD...

 

Can you look at the statements and see if any large sums. Were dumped in it?

It anything unusual?


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The balance of the credit care is still outstanding too.

It is being pursued too but they have given up on that currently.

It hasn't been dumped onto the OD balance

 

CR 31.14 printed and sent by recorded delivery on Thursday

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He has had acknowledgement from Moon Beever of his request.

 

They say "Thank you for your letter of 26 April 2018. We have requested the docments listed from our client and will forward them to you once received. Signed Moon Beever"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do not miss your defence filing date no matter what


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Loads here already


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1."The Claimant is the assignee of Hsbc Bank Plc.Debt in the sun of £2664 assigned on 23/3/2016. Statuatory notices of assignment were sent to the Defendant.

2.On 01/03/2018 the Claimant changed its name from 1st credit (Finance) Ltd to Intrum Finance Ltd.

3.The debt is for arrears on an overdraft facility and the account was opened by the original creditor on or about 28/06/1985 under reference xyz. The Defendant used the credit facilities.

4.On 19/05/2015 the account defaulted with an outstanding amount of £2,302.

5.The Claimant and its predecessors in title demanded repayment of the sum due.

6.In breach of the contract the Defendant failed to repay the sums due

 

7.AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

1. The sum of £2,302

2. Statutory INTEREST pursuant t S.69 County Courts Act 1984 at 8% per annum from 05/04/2016 until Judgement or sooner payment"

 

Defence

 

The Defendant contends that the particulars of the claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.

 

1. It is admitted that the Defendant once had banking facilities with the original creditor HSBC Bank plc. It is denied that I am indebted for the alleged balance claimed.

 

2. Paragraph 2 is denied. I am not aware or ever receiving any Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law of Property Act 1925. It is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974. The Claimant has yet to provide a copy of the Notice of Assignment its claim relies upon.

 

3. Paragraph 3 is denied. To my knowledge HSBC has never served me a notice pursuant to 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974

 

Any alleged amount claimed could only consist substantially of default penalties/charges levied on the account for alleged late, rejected or over limit payments.

The court will be aware that these charge types and the recoverability thereof have been judicially declared to be susceptible to assessments of fairness under the Unfair terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 The Office of Fair Trading v Abbey National PLC and others (2009). I will contend at trial that such charges are unfair in their entirety.

 

4. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.

The claimant is also put to strict proof to:-.

 

(a) Provide a copy agreement/overdraft facility arrangement along with the Terms and conditions at inception that this claim is based on.

(b) Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.

© Provide a breakdown of all excessive charging/fees and show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed.

(d) Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim.

(e) Show how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.

 

5. On receipt of this claim I requested documentation by way of a CPR 31.14 request dated 26 April 2018 namely the Overdraft Agreement, Terms and Conditions relevant at the time of inception for the agreed overdraft and Termination Demand Notice inferred by the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.

 

The Claimant has failed to respond or comply with this request.

 

By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.

Edited by dx100uk
edited

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ?

 

Not to my knowledge

 

Insert the following as your point 1...and renumber

 

1. The Claimant has not complied with paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) Failed to serve a letter of claim pre claim pursuant to PAPDC changes of the 1st October 2017.It is respectfully requested that the court take this into consideration pursuant to 7.1 PAPDC.

 

The rest is fine.

 

 

Andy


We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Final stupid question before I submit - which do I tick

 

I am the Defendant - I believe that the facts stated in this form are true or

I am duly authorised by the defendant to sign this statement - the defendant believes that the facts stated in this form are true

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He's had acknowledgement from the Court giving the claimant 28 days otherwise the claim will be stayed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A large file of paperwork has been set to his old address from Intrum.

 

No idea what's in it as his old address is 1.5 hours away from the current one.

 

Rather annoyed to say the least as it is his parents house and they are now very concerned about it (the packet had split partly open on arrival).

 

Surely the solicitor should have requested to be sent to the new address (which they have written to themselves)?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bit naughty that, as they have the correct address.


We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So in the package he has received :

 

Notice of Assignment

Introductory Letter (from 1st Credit)

Change of Legal Representative (from Moon Beever to Intrum)

280 pages of statements

HSBC Advance Bank Account Terms and Conditions (they state that as this is a current account, there is no signed agreement available)

A facility letter

 

The date on the footer of the printed documents is 11/17/2016

 

He has also received a letter from Northampton CCBC that the case has been transferred to the County Court local to us as the CCBC Solicitor is No Longer Acting

 

They have also sent copies of the Demand and Final Demand from them for payment and again reiterated that "as this is a current account and was opened prior to 1st February 2011, there are no original Terms and Conditions"

 

Then he received a letter "Without Prejudice Save As To Costs" informing him that they intend to proceed with this matter and setting out what each party will receive in the way of the questionnaire, notice of allocation and direction, etc. They state "To date we have disclosed all available documentation to which which includes the statements of account/payment history; notice of assignment; the terms and conditions on default; the pre-Final Demand letter and the Final Demand. We intent to proceed to trial and obtain judgement and will seek costs; and interest against you, which to date is as follows £xxxxx (they break down the costs). Notwithstanding the above we remain of the view that this claim is capable of being settled and we are prepared to make a settlement offer. For the avoidance of doubt any previous offers are revoked."

 

They will accept £2,100 in full and final settlement, including interest, costs

or £2,800 by instalments.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So if its been transferred from Northampton to your local CC then the claimant has informed them they wish to proceed.The above is the claimants offer of settlement and your opportunity to agree a settlement before its allocated.

 

The claimants will have to pay a further hearing fee hence the above offer.

 

Do you feel that what they have provided is sufficient to attain judgment in court ?

 

Would you possibly consider accepting their offer to avoid further costs and judgment ?

 

The figures they propose are a some what confusing.......

 

From their particulars......

 

Debt in the sun of £2664 assigned on 23/3/2016

On 19/05/2015 the account defaulted with an outstanding amount of £2,302.

 

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

1. The sum of £2,302

 

Total amount of claim £2,850

 

They will accept £2,100 in full and final settlement, including interest, costs

or £2,800 by installments.

 

 

Andy


We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The amount on the original claim form was £2302.93 + interest of £361.50 from 5/4/2016 + £150 court fee + £50 legal representative fee = £2849.43

The amount they are claiming now is £2302.93 + interest of £400 + £105 Issue fee + £80 solicitor fee = £2887.93

 

I have no idea if this is defendable or not! Obviously my partner is stressing so much about this. I have no idea how we would raise that sort of money

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Weve no lost an OD case yet


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well they would only get interest if the court award judgment..so a starting negotiable figure would be £2302.93 + £150 court fee + £50 legal representative fee.= £2502.29

 

Section 69 interest is at the discretion of the court....as is 8%..it may be half....so lets disregard the £361.50.

 

Whether to try to negotiate a settlement is subject to how important it is you dont lose or attain a CCJ ?

 

If its irrelevant and your CRAs are already shot...you continue and take your chance in court and see what the court states.If you lose you can always make application to vary it to monthly affordable payment albeit with a CCJ on your file for 6 years.

 

If its vital you dodge the CCJ then settlement is the only option but I would be starting at a figure of £2502.29 paid monthly....each party to bear their own costs.

 

I see no justification as to why a FFS should be lower than a monthly payment option...but you do have to start with the correct initial figure which as stated is £2502.29.


We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He hasn't got the best credit history but has no CCJ's and most of the defaults drop off in 3/4 years.

 

If he negotiates a FFS and they agree, will this pave the way for them pursuing the CC debt with them? The CC debt chasing seems to have dropped since we asked them to rpvide documentation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please dont capitulate!

All you do is fund their fleecing of 10,000 just like you.


PLEASE DONT HIT QUOTE IF THE LAST POST IS THE ONE YOU ARE REPLYING TOO.

MAKES A THREAD TWICE AS LONG TO SCROLL THROUGH!

please do not post jpg images directly to a topic..USE PDF ....READ UPLOAD.

 

WE CAN'T GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU SEND ME A LINK TO YOUR THREAD - I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER HELP THERE

Single Premium PPI Q&A Read Here

Reclaim mis-sold PPI Read Here

Reclaim Bank Account, Loan & Credit Card Charges Read Here

The CAG Interest Tutorial Read Here

spreadsheets 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    No registered users viewing this page.


  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...