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What we specifically need is the extension granted to enable a FAST general election and referendum.

 

If the election gives johnson a majority to push through no deal - then so be it.

 

A referendum cannot be left to the mercies of Johnson in power - he has already allocated 10 of millions of public money to 'promote' brexit with no detail or explanation (seen the content-less advert)

Edited by tobyjugg2

I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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The Beeb's Phillip Sim tweeted this earlier about the case in Scotland.

 

'Back at the Court of Session for the latest Article 50 wranglings; petitioners want the court to use its “nobile officium” power to effectively sign the letter to EU asking for an extension if Boris Johnson refuses to. Expecting today to be brief, main arguments probably Thursday'


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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What's with all this 'Benn bill' rubbish, you mean the 'Surrender bill'. :)


Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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Johnson will ultimately be toppled by his own party, he's too much of a liability.  He's only been in power 2 months and scandals are coming thick and fast.  Gove and Javid must be sharpening their knives right now.


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Looks like Johnson may be proposing a sort of no-mans land with customs posts/areas a few miles from the border, with a sort of neutral zone for those living on the border.

 

The neutral zone perhaps ending up like Dovers practice lorry parks.

 

 

Johnson perhaps thinks that all the folk along the border will make loads a money from installing parking meters on their farmland?

 

 

Can't see how those either side of the border would see that as acceptable ... except the DUP that is.

 

Edited by tobyjugg2

I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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He's lying, and knows what he is offering doesn't go anywhere near a deal.

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This is hilarious.  He's basically just called it something other than border patrols, told them it won't actually be on the imaginary line between the two countries, and is clearly hoping no one notices that these structures exist not on the border but somewhere else.  Is he planning on hiding them behind a hill.

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Yup, it's actually insulting people's intelligence.  Never mind though as long as he can blame everyone else for it being rejected.


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Will he be digging up roads and dumping massive concrete blocks across others  to channel the traffic to the customs posts then?

 


I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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Not personally I don't suppose. How long does he think it will take to organise all this? Far less time than he has - when is reality going to strike?


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Makes you wonder what his plans are for everyone in the no mans land.

 

Will they have to go through customs whichever way they go?

The Country of middle Ireland. Neither in the EU, or out of it, neither in the UK or out of it

 

The twilight zone.

 

Or will Johnson just evict everyone and buy the remnants of the Berlin wall and reassemble it?

Practice for the rebuilding of Hadrians wall perhaps?

 

 

Wish the yanks would just request his extradition for his US tax evasion and throw him in alcatraz

- nice little island for him to be messed up in.

 

It brings a smile to my face imagining some 350lb mass murderer saying, now wheres that new little blond with the irritating voice ....


I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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21 minutes ago, honeybee13 said:

Not personally I don't suppose. How long does he think it will take to organise all this? Far less time than he has - when is reality going to strike?

I know he says out on oct 31st

but I don't doubt he wants out with the transition where he can mess around for 2 years like the pompous Piers Morgan he is

 

EU would be mad to allow that - he will work hard to mess them up, and will lie and cheat and renege on all the agreements.

 

 


I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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6 hours ago, tobyjugg2 said:

 

 

I'm not fully ofay with the details surrounding the Benn act,

 

but heres what i believe is one of johnson plans

 

Send an official notification requesting an extension, which the EU are certain would result in a general election and/or new referendum - so would grant (for many reasons - but mostly NOT interfering in national democratic process despite what the extreme right wing might claim)

 

Then send some sort of official notice that we don't want it/reject it - which the EU will be bound by - unlike some 'note saying 'we don't want it' - which is unlikely to be actioned by the EU.

 

Would Johnson send the note then just say we are leaving anyway and that he refuses the extension ... absolutely

but does the Benn bill allow that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The ex Supreme Court Justice Jonathon Sumption (he who represented the banks in the Supreme Court bank charges case and won) was asked about that scenario and he said that if Johnson did anything contrary to genuinely seeking and obtaining an extension after the letter is sent it would have the effect of invalidating the extension request letter and he would thus be in breach of the Benn Act.

 

The act doesn't just require him to seek an extension, he has to accept it if the EU agrees to it.

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This is the letter the Benn Act requires him to send.

 

Quote

Dear Mr President,

The UK Parliament has passed the European Union (Withdrawal) (No. 2) Act 2019. Its provisions now require Her Majesty’s Government to seek an extension of the period provided under Article 50(3) of the Treaty on European Union, including as applied by Article 106a of the Euratom Treaty, currently due to expire at 11.00pm GMT on 31 October 2019, until 11.00pm GMT on 31 January 2020.

I am writing therefore to inform the European Council that the United Kingdom is seeking a further extension to the period provided under Article 50(3) of the Treaty on European Union, including as applied by Article 106a of the Euratom Treaty. The United Kingdom proposes that this period should end at 11.00pm GMT on 31 January 2020. If the parties are able to ratify before this date, the Government proposes that the period should be terminated early.

Yours sincerely,

Prime Minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

 

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About 18months ago I posted on CAG information in relation to a European Army

(a lot of it relevant to what is now proposed by Brussels) which was then ridiculed, by the same people

who post on this forum now as a load of rubbish, however it has now been stated by the EU, that

this is something that they wish achieve, so not so much rubbish after all.

 

 

I spent 28years in the military and I can tell I would under no circumstances wish to have served under

the command of Brussels, I would also suggest that serving members would also take that attitude today.

 

 

I am posting a link which I find extremally worrying, you should also be worried if this comes to pass.

https://www.ukcolumn.org/article/hero-brexit-lord-james-blackheath-threatened-over-eu-defence-union

 

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I'm more interested in why anyone is fearful of an EU army?  Surely European countries already contribute as part of NATO.  What's wrong with being involved militaristically with other nations, rather than outside.

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10 minutes ago, Jase1982 said:

I'm more interested in why anyone is fearful of an EU army?  Surely European countries already contribute as part of NATO.  What's wrong with being involved militaristically with other nations, rather than outside.

 

There is nothing wrong with collaboration between nations, but that's not good enough for the EU, they want full control and the HQ to be in Brussels.

We will have to pay them £millions each year and have no say in what our armed forces can and can't do.

Germany refuses to help in the Gulf, so they would without doubt not let our Navy help in safety patrols there either, they will be in charge.

 


Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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6 minutes ago, Maharg1 said:

 

There is nothing wrong with collaboration between nations, but that's not good enough for the EU, they want full control and the HQ to be in Brussels.

We will have to pay them £millions each year and have no say in what our armed forces can and can't do.

Germany refuses to help in the Gulf, so they would without doubt not let our Navy help in safety patrols there either, they will be in charge.

 

 

Well clearly that's not true.  We're one of the most influential nations in the EU and we're in a collaborative union, so I dont know where this notion comes from that we're being told, or forced to do something.  The giveaway is in the title European UNION.... union has nothing to do with the fascist ideals you're talking about... it was set up to halt fascism.

 

Also, if Germany can apparently refuse to do something, why do you believe we are unable to do the same?

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"Government have entered into private agreements with the European Community that they will, on completion of remain or whatever it is to be, transfer to the European Union in Brussels the entire control of our entire fighting forces, including all their equipment"

 


Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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8 minutes ago, Jase1982 said:

 

Also, if Germany can apparently refuse to do something, why do you believe we are unable to do the same?

 

You haven't learnt anything have you.  Germany runs the EU, Germany IS the EU, what Germany says goes


Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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Could you link us to the quote in your post #2785 please, Maharg?

 

 


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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I don't see a post #2785

Edited by Maharg1

Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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43 minutes ago, Maharg1 said:

"Government have entered into private agreements with the European Community that they will, on completion of remain or whatever it is to be, transfer to the European Union in Brussels the entire control of our entire fighting forces, including all their equipment"

 

 

Absolute garbage

 

You'll be telling us that apophis the goald built the pyramids next

Edited by tobyjugg2

I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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Just now, tobyjugg2 said:

 

Absolute garbage

 

 

 

Prove it ???


Life is so much better and happier as an Optimist than a boring depressed Pessimist

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The burden of proof lies with the claimant


I express my honestly held opinions - they are nothing more or less than that.

... Its just doing some due diligence that makes them seem unusual ...

 

Please don't assume what you see here is what I wrote - At least some of my posts HAVE been edited without my knowledge or agreement - or anything showing people they have been amended

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