Article 50 Discussion

[tobyjugg2]

I would be very surprised if Brexit happens, unless the EU falls apart.

 

As both the powerful in the Tory party and the current dictator of the Labourr party all want us out, it will take more than a simple realisation of the realities to stop article 50 being triggered - and a hard Brexit

 

Despite being a remainer, I dont believe a soft Brexit has any chance whatsoever of delivering what a LOT of the people actually voted for and is probably the worse option medium to long term of hard or soft Brexit..

We would gain nothing (compared to our prior EU position) and lose a lot of what we already had. At least a hard Brexit will force some major much needed changes.

 

So for me its either fresh referendum - quickly followed by hard Brexit if the people again vote leave

or withdraw our exit if significant numbers vote to remain.

If its close again - either way - then God knows.

Referendums should require CLEAR majorities for major social change. Say +60% and a minimum voter turnout.

 

Al this because of the Brexit crew being allowed (and many actually rewarded) for 'misleading' the Britsh public - thats the real disgrace,

 

Neither party (Labour or Conservative) deserve to be in power. They both drove their own minority agendas,

[king12345]

Blah, blah blah...

[WarrenBuffet]

Give Donny Trumpton-Tower a few months and we will all be dead anyways!

[tobyjugg2]

Blah, blah blah...

 

Excellent Boris Johnson quote on his understanding of the technicalities there.

[Guest]

Give Donny Trumpton-Tower a few months and we will all be dead anyways!

via the clowns laughing 'shroom...

http://hd.wallpaperswide.com/thumbs/atomic_mushroom_cloud-t2.jpg

[fletch70]

This is one of the very good reasons for having some form of P.R.

 

As it stands, 37% voted of the electorate voted to leave and 35% voted to remain with 28% not voting

 

To me it is shocking that 28% did not vote on what is likely to be the single most significant vote of their lifetimes

 

IMHO referendum should not be in use in this country but if they are , and the result involves a change in statute , there should be a majority of eligible voters in favour.

 

I appreciate that PR and my vision for referenda have downsides , for example, IMO allowing people like Farage to have seats in Parliament but that is the price we must pay for democracy

 

Based on pure PR the last election would have given something like

Tory=240

Labour +198

UKIP= 82

Lib Dem= 51

SNP= 31

Green= 24

 

Of course with PR it would eliminate tactical voting so who knows what the difference would be

[buckthorn]

How much longer is indecision and foot–dragging going to be the way forward with Brexit?

 

Has the word ‘democracy’ been reinterpreted? Why is it that so many in power have difficulty

with this concept? A wise and learned person would never ask a question that they did not

already know the answer to or at least have a fall-back position if the answer wasn’t what

they’d expected or wanted.

 

Those elected decided for whatever reason to go to the people of this nation and ask should

we stay in or leave Europe? The people voted and it is irrelevant whether you voted in or out,

the majority decided that Europe was no longer a viable option.

 

Despite predictions of the consequences of a ‘no’ vote, the world hasn’t come to an end, our

houses are not now worth 50% less, the pound has not been devalued. Organisations that

spread fear and misinformation have proved to be wanting, on both sides of the argument.

 

We have heard ludicrous arguments that one side or the other didn’t know what they voted for,

or the old voted the wrong way because they didn’t understand the question, or they’re all racists;

the one I found to be most offensive was that the young should get two votes while the old only

get one; comments like that prove that even with the best education some are too stupid to learn

the meaning of democracy or one person one vote.

 

What we should all draw from this is that whatever we voted for we have been let down. The principal

is a simple one, the Government is elected by the people for the people, we have all to some extent

become conditioned to the lies, and corruption in high office but woe betide any politician who feels

they can decide above the will and rights of the people because if any government is foolish enough

to-rewrite the answer or make a decision contrary to the will of the people, the ‘in’ and the ‘outs’ will

be looking for others represent them at the next election and many who have enjoyed the free lunch

and gravy train will soon come to realise that being an ex-politician qualifies you for very little in today’s

job market.

[Guest]

the pound has not been devalued

? are you sure about that

[buckthorn]

The value of the pound against other currency’s

has dropped. IT HAS NOT BEEN DEVALUED.

Only the Bank of England can devalue our currency.

[Guest]

same thing as far as i'm concerned.

the cost of shopping (prices) etc has gone up as a result

plus, am pretty sure it has been devalued, according to its general definition.

[WarrenBuffet]

The value of the pound against other currency’s

has dropped. IT HAS NOT BEEN DEVALUED.

Only the Bank of England can devalue our currency.

 

That is simply not true,.

[WarrenBuffet]

Inflation? Deflation? & GDP? are three factors that influence currency valuation.

[buckthorn]

Prove it????

[Guest]

Prove it????

you asserted it, you prove what you stated

[WarrenBuffet]

Basic economics, supply & demand.

[buckthorn]

You said this I did not. which as far as I am concerned is an assertion

so prove it.

 

same thing as far as i'm concerned.

the cost of shopping (prices) etc has gone up as a result

plus, am pretty sure it has been devalued, according to its general definition.

 

 

Why do you think Greece is in such a mess,

it has not been able to devalue its currency

because of the EU and the euro,

the UK exchange rate with other countries

has changed, but the pound has not been devalued

only the Bank of England can do that.

[buckthorn]

Basic economics, supply & demand.

 

You are correct but that has got nothing to do with devaluation??

That's the exchange rate with other currencies.

Edited November 26, 2016 by buckthorn

[Guest]

You said this I did not. which as far as I am concerned is an assertion

so prove it.

nope, you initially asserted it hasnt been devalued. its the old; he who asserts must prove.

[WarrenBuffet]

You are correct but that has got nothing to do with devaluation??

That's the exchange rate with other currencies.

 

 

But it has, currency is the same as any commodity the bigger the demand the higher the value. Printing more money does devalue waterdown a currency in a macro scale but it is only one of many factors. It is not exclusive.

[honeybee13]

Rather than argue the technicalities of devaluation, guys, are we able to agree that shop prices in the UK have gone up?

 

HB

[snowdragon]

I agree 100% HB

[honeybee13]

Thank you, SD.

[WarrenBuffet]

Price of brussel sprouts is shocking this year, I agree too HB.

[honeybee13]

Are you taking the mickey, young Warren?

 

HB

[WarrenBuffet]

Id never mess with our Queen Bee.