creditor looking to call in charging order

[exeterbay]

Hi all!

A long story short

( i have touched on it previously some time ago)

im happy to expand on the details if you want.

 

I have a charging order on my property,

there is no CCJ and its not from a financial institution.

 

Ex landlord who i rented a shop from and business collapsed.

He wanted £15K from me

i said no way

so he got a charging order attahced in 2008.

 

i paid a small amout of money each month but then stopped in 2009 and had last contact with him in 2010.

 

Now he has suddenly had his solicitor write to me stating if i dont pay they will push for sale of the property.

he wants £20K inc interest.

 

even though he has a charge against my property

is there a limitation on how long it can be chased? ie 6 years?

 

i have heard that the court feels 6 years is enough time to chase?

is this correct and would that tie in with why i have suddenly heard from the creditor?

i thought there is a 12 year limitation on secured but would like clarification.

 

There is no equity in the property

- perhaps £5k but after fees etc there would be none so it seems pointless he is chasing all of a sudden?

 

Is it a coincidence that its 6 years almost since last contact??

 

I have recently had a welcome charge removed from the property

could they have looked and now think there is the equity available?

 

there is no CCJ, im thinking maybe the order is interim?

 

Help!!

[martin2006]

I think the first thing you need to check is land registry to find out what if any CO exists. There must have been a ccj for there to be CO applied for, whether interim or final

[exeterbay]

thanks for the quick reply martin!

 

the LR states under section C along with mortgage there is a registered charge ,

am i looking for particular wording?

 

There was never a CCJ

- well at least it never showed on my credit file and im not aware of one!

and i never went to court for any of this!

 

like i mentioned this was an individual business and his solicitor that i was fighting

 

just thinking .. if there was never a CCJ issued but they got a charge put on my property is that secured or unsecured? is it possible to get a charge added without a CCJ being issued??

 

there has been no payment or contact for 6 years!!

[AndyOrch]

just thinking .. if there was never a CCJ issued but they got a charge put on my property is that secured or unsecured? is it possible to get a charge added without a CCJ being issued??

 

there has been no payment or contact for 6 years!!

 

Secured does not require a CCJ

[BazzaS]

A charge over property (rather than a mere restriction) is "secured" : it is secured over the property.

 

Once issued it doesn't have a limitation period : it doesn't become statute barred.

[exeterbay]

I heard that the court looks at 6 yrs bring adequate time without contact even on secured?

Why have they contacted me now?

 

Many thanks!

 

A charge over property (rather than a mere restriction) is "secured" : it is secured over the property.

 

Once issued it doesn't have a limitation period : it doesn't become statute barred.

[AndyOrch]

Six years to enforce or execute a judgment...you dont have a judgment...you have a charging order placed as security against your property...it stays until the debt is settled.

[exeterbay]

So if they are threatening to force sale now and there isn't any equity then they can't do anything? I have another property I live in with wife and kids they can't touch that or get charge on that?

 

Six years to enforce or execute a judgment...you dont have a judgment...you have a charging order placed as security against your property...it stays until the debt is settled.

[AndyOrch]

Once granted a final charging order, a creditor can apply for an order for sale.

 

 

This is a court order which forces you to sell your property and pay your creditor back what you owe them out of the proceeds of the sale.

 

 

From 6 April 2013, a creditor can't get an order for sale if the debt is less than £1,000.

There's no lower limit for applications made before 6 April.

 

There will need to be another court hearing, which it is very important you attend.

It is up to the court to decide whether to make an order for sale or not.

 

Equity is the amount of profit you would make on your home once the property is sold and the mortgage is paid off.

 

 

If there is little or no equity in the property, it may not be worth the creditor forcing you to sell your home

[exeterbay]

Yeah that's what I thought, there wouldn't be anything left!

 

they can't then decide to take a different route once they realise there's no money in the property?

 

My home I live with wife and kids can't be touched?

 

will they not know there's no money until court or will I have to provide info before hand?

 

I haven't had contact with them for 7 years,

why do you think they've suddenly written now?

[martin2006]

I will need to check but i believe it relates to the property the CO was granted on and not your other place. Andy is best placed to confirm.

 

Who knows why they have started now after 7 years, could be due to activity on your credit file, have you made any applications recently? Although i have no proof i am certain they monitor them for searches/applications from past experience, as in collection activity seems to increase if i applied for anything.

[exeterbay]

Hi Martin

yeah I recently had a welcome finance charge removed!!

Chuffed to bits that happened but opened the door to these chancers!!

 

I believe you're correct on it relating only to that property.

I wasn't with my wife when this all started and she put a considerable amount of cash into our home

 

there wouldn't be anything here for them as any equity is hers and I believe wife could refuse to have charge?

 

Also any charge would only be a restriction as its a joint mortgage so they'd never get any money that way!!

[martin2006]

Well there's your reason for them going at it now!

 

You are correct that they would only be able to put a Form K restriction on your current home if the debt it relates to is yours solely.

 

That means they are informed if the property is sold,

but not paid from the sale,

its an alert to let them know you may have some cash from the sale.

[exeterbay]

informed when it's too late..!

and they'd never get a penny cos it would be my wife's as per solicitors agreement we had done!

 

they're testing the water,

there's no money as no equity.

 

Hopefully they'll get back in their box!!

 

Is there anything else they can do? Bankruptcy?- I have no money.

 

CCJ?

- I have never had a CCJ from them even though they have a charge

- could that mean the charge is interim not full?

[martin2006]

Check whats registered at the Land Registry

[exeterbay]

It's a charge listed under same section as mortgage

- is there some particular wording I'm looking for?

Would there be a difference between interim and full charging order?

 

Check whats registered at the Land Registry

[AndyOrch]

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part73

[martin2006]

Yes there is a difference, read the cpr link posted above

[exeterbay]

Ive read it but it's not really making any sense to me?

I never went to court,

I have now got all the old paperwork out of the loft!

 

 

Sorry to be a pain - could u tell me in leymans terms?!

[martin2006]

It should say either final or interim, there wouldn't necessarily be a hearing, especially if there were no objections made at the time.

[Ganymede]

It's a charge listed under same section as mortgage

- is there some particular wording I'm looking for?

Would there be a difference between interim and full charging order?

 

 

You need to type up exactly what it says.

[exeterbay]

Hi Ganymede is this enough or do you mean the whole thing including restrctive covenants?

 

Title absolute

RESTRICTION: No disposition of the registered estate by

the proprietor of the registered estate is to be registered without a

written consent signed by the proprietor for the time being of the

Charge dated **.**.**** in favour of *******

referred to in the Charges Register.

 

Charges Register

(**.**.****) REGISTERED CHARGE dated ** month ****).

 

just read the below section on the register which i paid for and downloaded .

. i thought this was full register so could there be more indepth info on full?

 

The following extract contains information taken from the register of the above title number.

A full copy of the register accompanies this document and you should read that

 

in order to be sure that these brief details are complete.

Neither this extract nor the full copy is an 'Official Copy' of the register.

 

An official copy of the register is admissible in evidence in a court to the same extent as the original.

A person is entitled to be indemnified by the registrar if he or she suffers loss by reason of a mistake in an official copy.

 

This extract shows information current on 29 JUL 2016 at 10:19:04

and so does not take account of any application made after that time

even if pending in the Land Registry when this extract was issued.

[martin2006]

An interim charging order will be registered as a restriction as youve posted, so it may never have become a final order.

You could call the LR to be sure what is actually registered

[mercyblue]

The ICO is the restriction

you don't have to register a second time with a FCO.

 

 

If you read part 73 73.10A 3(a)

"a) make a final charging order confirming that the charge imposed by the interim charging order continues,"

 

It will most likely registered as an ICO at the LR.

This explains it quite nicely near the end of the link http://www.inbrief.co.uk/property-law/charging-orders-relating-to-property/

 

This issue actually came up on another thread recently

I quite understand how it does due to the wording people thinking that the charging order is only interim

so it's not been "finished off" (for want of a better phrase).

[exeterbay]

So it makes no difference if interim or full?