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    • These are the photos of the signs. At the entrance there is a 7h free sign. On some bays there is a permit sign.  Also their official website is misleading as it implies all parking is free.  I can't be certain of the exact parking bay I was in that day, and there was no PCN ticket on my car and no other evidence was provided.  parking sign 2.pdf
    • Hi, In my last post I mentioned I had received an email from SS who were asking me to hand over the keys to my mother’s flat so they could pass them to the Law firm who have been appointed court of protection to access, secure and insure my mother’s property.  Feeling this, all quickly getting out of my hands I emailed ss requesting proof of this. I HAVEN’T HEARD BACK FROM SS.  Yesterday, I received an email (with attached court of protection order) from the Law Firm confirming this was correct (please see below a copy of this).  After reading the court of protection order I do have some concerns about it:   (a)   I only found out yesterday, the Law firm had been appointed by the court back in January.  Up until now, I have not received any notification regarding this.  (b)   Section 2   - States I am estranged from my mother.  This is NOT CORRECT    The only reason I stepped back from my mother was to protect myself from the guy (groomer) who had befriended her & was very aggressive towards me & because of my mother’s dementia she had become aggressive also.  I constantly tried to warned SS about this guy's manipulative behaviour towards my mother and his increasing aggressiveness towards me (as mentioned in previous posts).  Each time I was ignored.  Instead, SS encouraged his involvement with my mother – including him in her care plans and mental health assessments.   I was literally pushed out because I feared him and my mother’s increasing aggression towards me. Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
    • Unless I've got an incorrect copy of the relevant regulation: The PCN is only deemed to have arrived two days after dispatch "unless the contrary is proved" in which case date of delivery does matter (not just date of posting) and I would like clarification of the required standard of proof. It seems perhaps this hasn't been tested. Since post is now barcoded for the Post Office's own tracking purposes perhaps there is some way I can get that evidence from the Post Office...
    • I would say You should accept it - I HIGHLY doubt you will  be able to claim for letters at trial ans they’re offering you that, which is higher monetary value than interest.   Also they raise a good point, getting interest at anything above 4% is lucky these days, yes judges give it, but rarily above 4%   Also you might find depending on the judge  you don’t get some costs if you take it all the way over £7.40 when court woukdnt award letters costs and thus meaning their award would be less than evris offer which was made    Up to you though but the wait will be 3-4mo for a trial date at least
    • Hi Folks, Been 162 days! Just by way of update. Today I received a text from Opos Ltd so no doubt Capquest are renting the debt out to anybody who fancies a nibble. Safe to say I will not be responding.
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ES Parking/Gladstone court case - PCN Spinningfields Manchester


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then you had better get your claim in writing into the court pronto, with a full breakdown and send a copy to Gladdys.

 

At a push you can take a written breakdown of costs with you on the day but you will be less likely to be awarded them as that may be seen as ambushing the other side and not giving them the chance to withdraw their stupid claim.

 

However, you can still go after a costs order under CPR27.4.2g as they claim is entirely without merit and malicious.

 

Quote the claims they have lost to show the unreasonableness of their continued action and also quote any that you can find where they have discontinued so you can show that the only reason they are continuing is because you are suing them for breach of the DPA and thus their action is not to recover a debt but purely vex because of this.

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no, completely different case.

That will require a revisit to court.

 

However, they may just decide to settle for £250 out of court if you ask them after you have seen off their claim.

 

I did say you should make yourself aware of the procedures before embarking on that exercise so do so to ensure you dont do or say anything to them on the day that will subsequently damage your claim.

 

Also keep an eye on the deadlines for submission of evidence,

they are very keen on using late evidence based upon what you have given to them in time and hope to shove it through on the day.

 

Do not accept this, if they try either ask the judge to dismiss the new evidence or ask for an adjournment with them paying costs so you can consider it and respond.

 

the judge wont like to waste any more time

so most likely to tell them the new paperwork isn't accepted.

 

the usual method is to try and thrust a bundle into your hands in the waiting room.

Do not accept this and tell them that they should pass it to the judge and that you will be objecting to their tactics.

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Thanks

 

I submitted the additional evidence to both Gladstones and the County court. It's pretty damning to be honest. I won't accept £250, I'd rather take them to court. If they pay the full £750 then I may consider it.... even then I may prefer to get less and enjoy beating them in court.

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Gladdys are being dishonest to their IPC members when they set about getting them to sue motorists.

 

However, it is the parking co you are battling with so dont forget that, Gladdys are just tools.

 

Also, if they do offer £750 you will have to accept it, liking a fight or not.

That is the rules of the game.

If you dont you will not only lose the claim but you will have to pay their costs.

The courts are not kind in this respect

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No probs - I'll take that on board and accept but only if they offer me the full amount.

 

Do you think I should mention it to them on the day that I'm looking at additional legal measures and that I'll consider dropping additional cases if they pay up the full amount?

 

Thanks

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they will know what is what.

Chances are they will send a rep to court as they could get into bother if they pitch up themselves.

 

 

The owner of ES tends to turn up to local courts if there is more than one claim so check the listings when you get a notice of allocation.

 

 

You can then offer to help anyone else in your position if you have the inclination and time, Read up on lay reps and McKenzie friends

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  • 2 weeks later...

Lost the case today.

 

Judge ruled that because Mr Hargreaves said there was a grace period and that the vehicle was parked for 17 minutes that the penalty stood.

 

Not a good day at all.

 

Have dropped the DPA claim too.

 

Judge was very harsh and ruled that the penalty stands as the car was parked for 17 minutes.

 

Very unfair.

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Threads merged..please do not start new threads on the same issue.

 

Regards

 

Andy

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penalty...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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you can appeal if you believe that the judge made an error in law,

errors on matters of fact are harder to appeal against.

 

How this is viewed is a toss of a coin as to whether it is more to do with the facts than the law concerning the signage.

 

Without a transcript of the judges decision we will never know.

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contact the court within 14 days to get in an appeal.

 

there will be a form for it, there always is.

 

As for the transcript, the tape goes off into the court somewhere and you can ask for them to send it to a transcription service

(cant just get the tape yourself, that would be too easy) and then you pay about £60 for a write up of it.

This transcript can then be used as evidence

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I'd be interested to know how long their alleged grace period is,

as we were there for less than 4 minutes and they still issued us with PCN and he never mentioned a grace period when we were in court.

 

 

Lost the case today.

 

Judge ruled that because Mr Hargreaves said there was a grace period and that the vehicle was parked for 17 minutes that the penalty stood.

 

Not a good day at all.

 

Have dropped the DPA claim too.

 

Judge was very harsh and ruled that the penalty stands as the car was parked for 17 minutes.

 

Very unfair.

 

I think I'm just going to call it a day.

 

I've lost faith in the legal system after today.

 

Judge clearly contradicted himself.

 

I'm so disappointed for you.

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not if you pay it all within 28days

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Ginger,

there isnt a grace period,

 

this was a point in another claim where ES lost

Mr Hargreaves just made up a story on the spot because he knew that it might help his claim as his other tactics and lies didnt work.

 

I would like to know who the judge was and whether they were a HHJ, DJ, DDJ etc.

The lower the judge's rank the more notice they have to take of other decisions

 

if a HHJ had determined that the signage was prohibitive then your person cannot go against that (without a damned good reason) and expect to keep their job and at a push, freedom, it is covered by an act of Parliament dating back centuries.

 

the problem is that you have to go back to court and risk a higher costs order if you lose again to get this properly settled.

 

The appeal may well seta case precedent proper so that means making sure that you have everything tied up.

Edited by honeybee13
Paras.
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without knowing exactly waht was put forward as evidence by both sides on the day nor what the judge said that is impossible to answer.

 

When you raised the cases where ES had been spanked in court what did the judge say?

that will give a good indication.

 

 

Also, what class was the judge?

as said, there is a hierarchy so if a DDJ then you wll stand a very good chance of getting the decision reversed based on pervious decisions elsewhere.

 

 

Act quickly and there isnt much of a fee, it used to be free if you appealed within 14 days.

 

Tale advice from the British Motorists Protection Association,

they have experience in this and will offer impartial advice on the strengths of your case and can provise lay representation.

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It's £120 to appeal against the decision and then it goes to Manchester High Court.....

 

I think I'm going to do it. Do I have the forum's support?

 

Who do I get in contact with in terms of BMPA?

 

Also one other question:

 

Should I decide to get some representation in now that I'm looking to take it to the high court?

 

 

Any suggestions?

 

Thanks

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Well, start with either the parking prankster through his web site (not blog) or find John Wilkie's details by looking up BMPA.

 

They have experience in appeals as well as doing ordinary county court so will hopefuly advise on the liklihood of success based upon what evidence you submitted and what you think was wrong.

 

I can offer my opoinion on the truth of Mr Hargreaves evidence based on what he has said previously and that the judge made an error in law when considering that a prohibition is a contractual obligation

 

 

but as I didnt hear the judges summing up of the facts or reasons given for decision saying that may be barking up the wrong tree.

 

 

I would say you have more to win than to lose but it isnt my money

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