Euro parking Services/Gladstones Claimform - for PCN

[dx100uk]

10 should no.1.

[Startkey&Clutch]

Thank you, how is this?

 

 

1.The claimant claims the sum of £152.73 for parking charges and indemnity costs if applicable

 

 

2. including £2.73 interest pursuant to S.69 of the county courts act 1984 rate 8% pa from dates above to 28/07/2016 same rate to judgement or sooner payment daily rate to judgement 0.03%

Total debt and interest £152.73

 

 

DEFENCE

 

1. The claimant has not complied with the pre-court protocol. The

particulars of claim contain no detail and divulge no cause of

action. The defendant has no idea what the claim is about , why

the charge arose or what the alleged contract was . There is

nothing that provides a basis for understanding why the claimant

has asked the court to order the payment. The defendant invites

the court to use its case management powers to strike out the case

as having disclosed no cause of action.

 

 

2. The terms at the car park do not for a contract,

there is no contract offered so no cause for action by the plaintiff.

The defendant refers to the Consumer Rights Act 2015 which supports a consumers position in that the signage failed to make any obligation and/or risk of penalty prominent.

 

3. A clear sign stating the terms and conditions at the entrance to the car park is a specific requirement that the claimant is

required to follow. This was absent therefore there was no contract to consider or breach so there is no cause for action by the plaintiff

 

4. The claimant is put to proof that it has sufficient interest in the land or that there are specific terms in its contract to bring

an action on its own behalf.

 

 

As a third party agent, the claimant may not pursue any charge.

It follows therefore that if a debt exists it is owed to the landowner not the claimant.

 

5. I have reasonable belief that the claimants intention was not to offer a genuine contract to park and that the main purpose was

to deter to enforce a penalty.

 

6. The defendant neither admits or denies that he was the driver,

the claimant has failed to meet the conditions of The Protection

of Freedoms Act to pursue her as the registered keeper of the

vehicle.

 

7. Even if a contract had been formed it would be void due to the

claimant not acting in good faith.

 

8. The defendant disputes that the claimant has incurred £50

solicitors costs to prepare the claim. The defendant has

reasonable belief that Gladstone solicitor did not prepare the

claim and did not therefore charge the stated amount.

 

9. The defendant has the reasonable belief that the claimant is

abusing the court process by using the threat of action to alarm

the defendant into making a payment that is not owed.

 

10. The claimant has at no time provided an explanation how the sum

has been calculated , the conduct that gave rise to it or how the

amount has climbed from £100 to £150.

 

11. The claimant has not complied with the pre-court protocol. The

particulars of claim contain no detail and divulge no cause of

action. The defendant has no idea what the claim is about , why

the charge arose or what the alleged contract was . There is

nothing that provides a basis for understanding why the claimant

has asked the court to order the payment. The defendant invites

the court to use its case management powers to strike out the case

as having disclosed no cause of action.

 

12. If the claimant is intending to pursue this claim against the

defendant on the basis that the defendant is the registered keeper

then the claimant has failed to show that the conditions for

recovering the charge under Schedule 4 of the Protection of

Freedoms Act 2012 have been met.

 

13. No evidence has been provided to show a valid Notice to Driver

was given to the driver in accordance with paragraph 7 Schedule 4

of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. Where a notice to driver

was given no evidence has been provided to show that a valid

notice to keeper was served in accordance with paragraph 8.

 

14. There is no evidence of any contravention at all.

 

I deny any liability for any sum being due at all to this claimant

and confirm that where stated facts are given within this defence,

I hereby confirm that they are tru

[dx100uk]

you need to stripout where you repeat the same thing that is wrong with the claim.

ie the contract etc

only mention things ONCE

then give the reasons why there is no such contract to back up your denial of one.

 

and mention your 31:14 and its date

 

 

KISS

keep it simple stupid.

is the key here

don't mention things you have no need to

nor relate to from their vague & brief POC

[ericsbrother]

in your point 4

you are wrong to assert that a 3rd party cant claim,

they can and will and do if the assignment of the rights by the landlord is properly worded

so avoid things like that as it isnt true.

 

point 11 is the same as point 1 so drop it,

point 12 is a repeat of point 6,

point 13 should be part of point 6 if used.

point 14 is superfluous as it just muddies point 2

 

At this stage though you could just tidy it up to no keeper liability as PoFA protocols not followed

and no contract offered so no contracual obligation or breach of contract to give cause for a claim.

 

Everything else may never be needed as many of these claims will be dumped as soon as the bills for the allocation fees start rolling in.

 

 

The simple defence will let them imagine anything they want

 

 

but in the meanwhile you can go about collecting more evidence,

such as lack of planning permission for sigange

(which would be covered by the no contract offered statement but not in your proposed defence).

 

 

If you go for this at a later stage they may well ask for the new evidence to be struck out

and that will just cause you anxiety and delay as they would have to go through the whole thing again

(probably wouldnt though) so best avoid the risk.

[Startkey&Clutch]

Thank you both very much.

I will look into planning permission today, but I don't know what a 31:14 is so don't know what to put in the defence??

In the meantime, is this any better??

 

 

DEFENCE

 

1. The claimant has not complied with the pre-court protocol. The

particulars of claim contain no detail and divulge no cause of

action. The defendant has no idea what the claim is about, why

the charge arose or what the alleged contract was . There is

nothing that provides a basis for understanding why the claimant

has asked the court to order the payment. The defendant invites

the court to use its case management powers to strike out the case

as having disclosed no cause of action.

 

 

2. The sign at the car park does not offer a contract, the only sign at the entrance is one which is an ‘offer to treat’, there is no contract offered so no cause for action by the plaintiff. The defendant refers to the Consumer Rights Act 2015 which supports a consumers position in that the signage failed to make any obligation and/or risk of penalty prominent.

A clear sign stating the terms and conditions at the entrance to the car park is a specific requirement that the claimant is required to follow, this was absent therefore there was no contract to consider or breach so there is no cause for action by the plaintiff

 

3. Even if a contract had been formed it would be void due to the

claimant not acting in good faith.

4. The defendant neither admits or denies that he was the driver,

the claimant has failed to meet the conditions of The Protection

of Freedoms Act to pursue her as the registered keeper of the

vehicle.

 

5. The claimant is put to proof that it has sufficient interest in the land or that there are specific terms in its contract to bring

an action on its own behalf.

 

6. I have reasonable belief that the claimants intention was not to offer a genuine contract to park and that the main purpose was

to deter to enforce a penalty.

 

 

7. The defendant disputes that the claimant has incurred £50

solicitors costs to prepare the claim. The defendant has

reasonable belief that Gladstone solicitor did not prepare the

claim and did not therefore charge the stated amount.

 

8. The defendant has the reasonable belief that the claimant is

abusing the court process by using the threat of action to alarm

the defendant into making a payment that is not owed.

 

9. The claimant has at no time provided an explanation how the sum

has been calculated , the conduct that gave rise to it or how the

amount has climbed from £100 to £150

I deny any liability for any sum being due at all to this claimant

and confirm that where stated facts are given within this defence,

I hereby confirm that they are true.

[ericsbrother]

a cpr 31.14 is a request for discovery or sight of the documents they will rely on to prove their claim,

so to have a cause for action they must have planning permission for their signage

and a contract with ther LANDOWNER that assigns the rights to enter into contracts

and make claims

and take legal action in their own name.

This should be sent to their solicitors and give them 14 days to respond.

 

 

If they dont provide this then you can say so when you have to submit your paperwork

and point out they have failed to show a cause for action,

dont use this as you do in point 5

 

You would be surprised how often the parking co didnt get their initial contract ectended but they carry on as if it was.

 

as for your point 7,

there are limits to what costs the parking co can claim and £50 pre-action costs are not one of them

so it is not a matter of quantity but that the costs arent allowed

as they are not contractual as they claim

because they are suing for breach of contract to claim a sum that is fixed.

 

points 8 and 9 say much the same so avoid reetition.

 

However,

I would be using 2 lines at this moment,

no keeper liability as protocols of POFA not followed

and nocontractual obligation so no breach of contract so no monies due.

 

 

The more you write the more it leaves whatever you say open to challenge and you end up bogged down by the detail. That can cost you,.

 

The real question you should ask yourself is

do you understand properly what you have written

or is it just a result of a trawl of other cases found on the web?

 

 

If the latter again I suggest that you save it for when you have to exchange documents as you can go into the details of everything or nothing then.

 

 

I have defeated 2 claims with no paperwork whatsoever other than the short denial of a contract.

 

 

It is for them to prove their case and it will be better to make them drop the matter rather than show that you dont really know what it is you are saying.

[Startkey&Clutch]

I understand most of it but it was a cut and paste, adjusted to suit. Are you saying to trim it even more?

The cpr 31.14 is something like this which I need to send to gladstones??

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?195201-CPR-31.14-Request-Letter-Help-please

 

I think my defence will need to be submitted next week sometime.

[dx100uk]

Again def due 4pm 30th

 

Forget the defence for now

 

Are you saying you've not yet even sent CPR 31:14 yet?

[Startkey&Clutch]

Yes I had no idea about it.

[dx100uk]

get it in the post today else you'll lose another 3 days

 

 

dx

[Startkey&Clutch]

Should I copy the letter from the link?

 

I have no idea what to do....

[dx100uk]

i wouldn't

that's for bank accounts if you read it

 

are you not grasping what EB is telling you in the various posts whereby he has already told you what to put in the 31:14.

 

engage brain

else you are going to miss the post office its already 15:45 and its friday

[ericsbrother]

I understand most of it but it was a cut and paste, adjusted to suit. Are you saying to trim it even more?

The cpr 31.14 is something like this which I need to send to gladstones??

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?195201-CPR-31.14-Request-Letter-Help-please

 

I think my defence will need to be submitted next week sometime.

 

yes, trim it to 2 lines.

 

You will have about 6 months to fill in the detail as it takes that long to creak through the court system.

 

For the moment you are letting the money grabbers know you arent paying.

That will cost them more money and they arent going to win

so they are more than likely to drop the matter.

 

if you send a load of waffle they will do you over as your limits in terms of your arguments will become known to them.

 

The 2 sentence skeleton defence will leave everything open to interpretation and that will worry them.

 

If they have sent out 1000 of these and everyone defends they have to find another £25k

just to find out what it is you are on about and that will stop them cherry picking..

[Startkey&Clutch]

Sorry you mean trim the whole thing down to 2 lines or each point?

 

I'm trying to do all this on my phone and it's proving difficult, won't get the 31:14 request sent until tomorrow at the earliest as I need my computer and then find something suitable.

[dx100uk]

Just two sentences for your defence

 

You really should have gotten that CPR running

 

Rather than working on a defence that wasn't needed for weeks

 

Should be OK though

Sent it rwcorded

[Startkey&Clutch]

I was under the impression that if I didn't mention something in the defence then it couldn't be brought up again, so is that not correct then?

 

I will look to request the 31:14 asap

 

Which 2 lines should I use??

[dx100uk]

for what?

[Startkey&Clutch]

For the defence.

[dx100uk]

forget the defence get the 31:14 done

 

 

EB has several times already has told you simply what to put for your defence

 

 

the first being post 14

[ericsbrother]

but the simple 2 statements I suggested covers everything.

 

By wasting time arguing about the detail

you are missing out on the opportunity to clobber them with the lack of compliance with the request for info and then they wont have to produce it until the day and you wont be able to question or rubbish it beforehand.

 

 

The simple thing to remember is they have to produce the evidnce of their claim,

not you produce evidence to the contrary, although silence wont help you.

 

 

If they dont show a basis for claim by way of contract with landowner,

planning consent

and compliance with POFA

they cannot argue any of their other points about the contract.

 

 

Your suggested defence allows room for manoeuvre

where the blanket no liability and no contract makes them prove every detail or it fails.

 

As for not being able to mention things not written down,

that is a misconception,

 

 

what you are not allowed to do is ambush the other side

and that is why you have to exchange documenst about a fortnight before the claim is heard.

You are about 6 months away from that at least,

possibly even a couple of years

if a judge in another court makes a decision that can affect a number of other claims

 

 

so do what is vital rather than fuss over detail.

[Startkey&Clutch]

OK so now Ive submitted the cpr 31.14, am waiting for that.

 

 

My defence has to be in by the 30th, I can email this to them or send it in the post, when should I send that?

[dx100uk]

you file your skeleton defence online at MCOL regardless

don't miss it by 4pm 30th.

[Startkey&Clutch]

I think there may be a problem!

 

 

The cpr 31.14 was signed for last week, told the I would be fighting them and requested their information, trying now to log into mcol to submit the defence but it wont log in, has it timed out?

[unclebulgaria67]

Try to log in later. It might have been down for maintenance over bank holiday weekend ?

[dx100uk]

usual problem with mcol

 

 

always happens at w/ends/ BH's

 

 

try again until about 15:30 then email it...

 

 

MCOL is only one way of responding to a claim.

.

If you are having problems logging in, or would prefer not to use MCOL,

you can fax, email or post your response to the Court instead.

If you send your response by e mail

please send it to [email protected] and ensure you quote “Claim response” and quote the claim number in the subject field.